GUILTY PLEA DEAL ACCEPTED - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #111

[wildblue]

Even for the families.

We can't have a justice system where one of the benefits of the death penalty is preventing a future Supreme Court from ruling that their constitutional rights were violated. You posed it as a hypothetical, but as a hypothetical it's just wrong. Regardless of anyone's feelings about the death penalty in general. If someone's rights were violated our system says they didn't get due process.

Also, if a future court were to rule BK's rights were violated, it doesn't mean he walks. The plea would be thrown out or overturned and he would go to trial.

As for what went down leading up to the plea, how the families were told, handled, etc., we have one family's version. One understandably angry family. We haven't heard how the others felt about how it was handled.
JMO

If a future court were to rule that his rights and those of others of his ilk were violated, he may indeed walk. If a future court rules that LWOP or is unconstitutional or older or infirm inmates should be released, he may indeed walk. I believe the families have a right to a punishment that fits the crime perpetrated on their loved ones and not to have to worry about changing beliefs altering a sentence. If this murderer was dead, they wouldn’t have to worry about even the remote possibility he could walk free.

 

[mickey2942]

Really, BK does not get the notoriety of being on "Death Row". And the endless appeals. Something made him flip. I am leaning towards his family being able to assist him with his decision.

It seems like BK is close to his father. His father got him a job with the school district. And cared about BK to drive back with him on the road trip home. He even drove out with him to WA in the beginning of the semester. I think BK's family leveraged BK into skipping the trial.

 

[Sundog]

I think there's one more stipulation that the families of the victims should demand. Kohberger should never be allowed to publish, or co-author a book about anything. He should be deprived of all interviews where he provides an opinion about anything.

Although there is law preventing him from writing and profiting from the crimes he committed, he is fascinated by the criminal mind and may believe that he can spend his life in prison interviewing murderers and writing about them. Something should be done today to prevent that possibility.

Maybe he can be stopped from profiting from a book or other media deal, but I don't think he can be stopped from co-authoring or otherwise writing about the crimes. I think Katherine Ramsland has plans to interview him and write a book, she made it clear that she hopes to do so in her interview with Brian Entin (posted earlier on this forum). I think stopping BK from communicating about his crimes would violate his free speech rights, but perhaps not let him profit. For the BTK co-authored book with Ramsland, BTK was not allowed to receive any of the profits, only Ramsland and the families of the victims.

 

[House of Holden]

The family members wanted this to go to trial, all of the evidence come out and to obtain a conviction and the death penalty. They’ve expressly stated that wish and any risk that entailed. I 100% back what these families want as they have lost what matters most in their lives, their loved ones.

Only two families wanted the DP, the other two wanted the deal. And what of the two other housemates who are victims as well. What did they want? Does anyone know? It is simply not true that ALL the families wanted a trial and the DP…

 

[Vaderman]

I know a lot of true crime involves "projecting" emotions onto the perps, but I am curious why so many of us (myself included) automatically think that BK wants the notoriety or attention. Beyond the traffic stop body cam videos, the most we've heard him say are "yes", "no", and "guilty". He doesn't really seem like the type to want to talk or embellish.

 

[Magic8Ball]

Yes, and a large population supports SG in vocalizing his anger, pain and despair. We hope his speaking out can force some changes so that families suffering similar losses in the future feel heard. And, btw, no one got the monster to confess. The murderer was fearful for his own pathetic life and facing the firing squad having run out of defense options, that IMO, is the only reason he confessed.

This isn't about SG wanting to "feel heard."
This is about him wanting to dictate the terms of how justice is meted out.

The prosecutors and the court required BK to confess to the murders in order to approve the plea. BK had to admit to each murder in order to get the plea deal.
I don't know how that translates into "no one got him to confess."

The plea deal is what got BK to confess.
Nothing else would ever gotten him to admit his guilt.
He confessed because the justice system got him to confess.

It's sad that SG was too focused on his misdirected anger at the court to actually sit in that courtroom and hear BK's admission of guilt, as I think he may regret at some point in the future not being there in person to bear witness to it.

JMO.

 

[wildblue]

Only two families wanted the DP, the other two wanted the deal. And what of the two other housemates who are victims as well. What did they want? Does anyone know? It is simply not true that ALL the families wanted a trial and the DP…

We don’t know the actual numbers of members within each family and from family to family, only a couple at this point.

 

[wildblue]

This isn't about SG wanting to "feel heard."
This is about him wanting to dictate the terms of how justice is meted out.

The prosecutors and the court required BK to confess to the murders in order to approve the plea. BK had to admit to each murder in order to get the plea deal.
I don't know how that translates into "no one got him to confess."

The plea deal is what got BK to confess.
Nothing else would ever gotten him to admit his guilt.
He confessed because the justice system got him to confess.

It's sad that SG was too focused on his misdirected anger at the court to actually sit in that courtroom and hear BK's admission of guilt, as I think he may regret at some point in the future not being there in person to bear witness to it.

JMO.

The murderer’s fear of facing the firing squad after losing his defense options, per the judge’s rulings, are what got him to confess IMO not anything the prosecution did or didn’t do. SG had every right to be angry at the court for treating the families with such disrespect and disdain. I doubt he feels remorse for missing the proceeding and watch a cold, heartless murderer say the bare minimum to save his own worthless skin.

 

[Arkay]

Beautiful! We always go over to Mount Vernon and watch the new citizens get sworn in at the naturalization ceremony. Today the keynote speaker was Arnold Schwarzenegger and his speech was so moving.

That sounds spectacular! Thanks for sharing.

 

[Boxer]

Interesting.
Either he was just being obnoxious or is one of those people who think prison is 3 hots and a cot. Or daycare.

IMO if BK earns privileges to get out of his cell someone will attack him. Prisons are horrible places for lifers. They have to adapt or lose their mind.

MOO SG is not taking into account the risk of appeal being successful or the fact it takes 20+ years to exhaust appeals and the impact that has on the other families and witnesses.

 

[wendy44]

If a future court were to rule that his rights and those of others of his ilk were violated, he may indeed walk. If a future court rules that LWOP or is unconstitutional or older or infirm inmates should be released, he may indeed walk. I believe the families have a right to a punishment that fits the crime perpetrated on their loved ones and not to have to worry about changing beliefs altering a sentence. If this murderer was dead, they wouldn’t have to worry about even the remote possibility he could walk free.

The Supreme Court has consistently upheld LWOP for adults so the lower courts have to follow. But, for the sake of argument, you're justifying putting someone to death just in case a future court finds his rights have been violated and he didn't receive due process under the constitution. This is not a benefit of the death penalty. It's actually an argument against it.
JMO

 

[mickey2942]

Maybe he can be stopped from profiting from a book or other media deal, but I don't think he can be stopped from co-authoring or otherwise writing about the crimes. I think Katherine Ramsland has plans to interview him and write a book, she made it clear that she hopes to do so in her interview with Brian Entin (posted earlier on this forum). I think stopping BK from communicating about his crimes would violate his free speech rights, but perhaps not let him profit. For the BTK co-authored book with Ramsland, BTK was not allowed to receive any of the profits, only Ramsland and the families of the victims.

What if BK's family, siblings wrote a book about growing up with BK? I would find that interesting. And I guess, they would get all of the profits?

 

[Magic8Ball]

Eye for an eye. Death for a death. This is truly what some believe.

I'm pro-DP and I absolutely, unequivocally support this plea deal.
The two are not mutually exclusive.

Life without the possibility of parole and no appeals are worse than a death sentence.

People living on death row are still able to harbor some measure of hope in prison, because they can cling to the possibility that they'll get a reprieve from a successful appeal or a last-minute commutation of their sentence.

BK is being left in a state of complete hopelessness.

It's a fate worse than death.

 

[wendy44]

The family members wanted this to go to trial, all of the evidence come out and to obtain a conviction and the death penalty. They’ve expressly stated that wish and any risk that entailed. I 100% back what these families want as they have lost what matters most in their lives, their loved ones.

I think it's totally fine to support that and agree with the families that have expressed that.

But how the families were treated and the input and consideration they were given is something we actually don't know. We've only heard from one family on that. So it's really just opinion and not actual fact how the prosecution handled this with the families.
JMO

 

[Magic8Ball]

The murderer’s fear of facing the firing squad after losing his defense options, per the judge’s rulings, are what got him to confess IMO not anything the prosecution did or didn’t do. SG had every right to be angry at the court for treating the families with such disrespect and disdain. I doubt he feels remorse for missing the proceeding and watch a cold, heartless murderer say the bare minimum to save his own worthless skin.

I didn't say remorse, I said regret.

Those words have completely different meanings.

And, no. He didn't have "every right to be angry at the court for treating the families with such disrespect and disdain," because the court did NOT treat the families with disrespect and disdain.
His perception of the court is not the reality.

JMO.

 

[wildblue]

The Supreme Court has consistently upheld LWOP for adults so the lower courts have to follow. But, for the sake of argument, you're justifying putting someone to death just in case a future court finds his rights have been violated and he didn't receive due process under the constitution. This is not a benefit of the death penalty. It's actually an argument against it.
JMO

I’m a proponent of guilty parties facing the punishment to which they are sentenced. If a future court wants to let out elderly inmates, for example, even those with LWOP, then it shouldn’t be retroactive.

 

[wildblue]

I didn't say remorse, I said regret.

Those words have completely different meanings.

And, no. He didn't have "every right to be angry at the court for treating the families with such disrespect and disdain," because the court did NOT treat the families with disrespect and disdain.
His perception of the court is not the reality.

JMO.

Hmm, Oxford says remorse means “deep regret.”
The prosecutor sending off an email, with a plea attachment, is reprehensible and stating that they spoke with only “available” family members in this day and age of technology, without waiting to speak with ALL family members as if they had no time to waste, is reprehensible. This is from the prosecution team not SG.
SG does indeed have every right to be angry and to express it, about whatever he wants IMO. It was his child that was slaughtered not the child of random people on the internet trying to tell him he should be grateful to a court he feels dishonored his child, telling him how to feel and what he’s allowed to say and criticizing him for normal human emotions.

 

[Arkay]

I’m a proponent of guilty parties facing the punishment to which they are sentenced.

Great! Then we agree!

Bryan is sentenced to life in prison, no parole, no appeals. Four consecutive sentences of the same. Plus 10 years for robbery.

This will be official at the next and last court date.

He was NOT sentenced to die. That issue is now defunct. If he lives to be 500, he will still be in prison.

The judge was very careful in closing all possible loopholes. This won’t go to a higher court because Bryan signed off on no appeals.

If you are in fact “a proponent of guilty parties facing the punishment to which they are sentenced,” then you are no longer wishing he’d get the death penalty.

I too am in favor of the death penalty, but this was a balancing act. The important issue was to prove Bryan guilty. He has confessed. Game over.

IMO

 

[Boxer]

LWOP is a death sentence - just a slow one.

 

[Sundog]

dbm