GUILTY PLEA DEAL ACCEPTED - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #116

[othram]

Needs to happen for every unsolved case.

 

[agilbe]

The Idaho State police had to wait "hours" for a search warrant to start collecting evidence at a crime scene? Is this just particular to Idaho? You have a quadruple murder scene and investigators have to wait hours to collect evidence to find killer(s)...because they need a warrant to search? No just calling the landlord? Hey four people are dead in your house, can we please go in and process the scene? That they would even have to ask when 4 people are laying there brutally murdered is beyond me. JMO

From your link...

"For hours, police waited to begin collecting evidence until a search warrant was approved at about 5 p.m., Gilbertson said."

Maybe because they knew this could potentially be a loooong drawn out investigation/court case and they wanted to make sure everything was dotted and crossed? I'm with you though. Seems like a long time to wait.

 

[Megnut]

The Idaho State police had to wait "hours" for a search warrant to start collecting evidence at a crime scene? Is this just particular to Idaho? You have a quadruple murder scene and investigators have to wait hours to collect evidence to find killer(s)...because they need a warrant to search? No just calling the landlord? Hey four people are dead in your house, can we please go in and process the scene? That they would even have to ask when 4 people are laying there brutally murdered is beyond me. JMO

From your link...

"For hours, police waited to begin collecting evidence until a search warrant was approved at about 5 p.m., Gilbertson said."

They didn't know what kind of crime they had. But the victims were all the way deceased. They didn't need first aid and they couldn't get deader -- so there was no exigent circumstances to justify further searches, beyond ascertaining DOAs and all clear (of a suspect still on the premises).

Let's say there was a 6th roommate, one we didn't know about, and that person was the murderer. If LE processed the crime scene without a warrant, that roommate's defense attorney would move to have any evidence recovered without a warrant thrown out.

Obviously that wasn't the case but my point is that LE knew they'd be a prosecution one day and they knew to process the crime scene by the book, in order to preserve evidence for trial, leading to the eventual conviction of the assailant who commit that dastardly slaughter.

JMO

 

[Warwick7]

The Idaho State police had to wait "hours" for a search warrant to start collecting evidence at a crime scene? Is this just particular to Idaho? You have a quadruple murder scene and investigators have to wait hours to collect evidence to find killer(s)...because they need a warrant to search? No just calling the landlord? Hey four people are dead in your house, can we please go in and process the scene? That they would even have to ask when 4 people are laying there brutally murdered is beyond me. JMO

From your link...

"For hours, police waited to begin collecting evidence until a search warrant was approved at about 5 p.m., Gilbertson said."

What I understand, yes, they can ask the landlord. But, his say so doesn't carry any weight. If anything should go south a search warrant carries tremendous weight and halts litigation.

 

[Megnut]

KG's dad has spoken many times about, my word, his family's grit. AG demonstrated it so perfectly in her kickask impact statement.

I've been thinking about the horror of what occurred in a span of maybe four or six minutes that early November morning three years ago.

I have just posted what might have happened if KG hadn't been in MM's bed, how the crime might have been singular and so silent that BK might have gotten away with it.

It is awful -- awful awful awful -- what happened that night. How much worse if BK were never caught.

Let's talk about what key people did, that led to this crime being solved.

The DDD, who was in harm's way and never knew it, but without her, the missing front plate would never have been identified, not narrowing the field of Elantras.

KG, who fought like hell. I am reminded of that self defense strategy -- expect to be hurt.

And hurt she was. Her injuries are unfathomable. Brutal. He wasn't going to let her live, but her grit forced him to lose total control and that forced him to abandon silence and IMO the sheath, because she was a force he had to deal with. The noise awakened DM -- without that, there would have been no eye witness description.

It cost KG her life -- and an excruciating death -- to do it but that battle provided LE with critical evidence leading directly to BK's arrest. It might have seemed futile to fight with an armed assailant and indeed it proved fatal, but because she fought like hell anyway, MM's murder as well as hers and XK and EC's too did not become a cold case nor the first of a career of serial killings.

We'll likely never know who BK planned to murder that morning, whether one or four or more. Maybe XK and EC were murdered only because XK had been awake but XK, like KG, fought like hell. It didn't save her life either, but it did cause a disturbance which DM and BF heard, even if they didn't know what they were hearing or just what it meant as it was happening. It was enough that it awakened DM and alarmed her enough to investigate but also in some measure to protect herself. Had she swung that door open wide, she might have been Casualty #5, and her description of both events and BK would have died with her.

BF and DM played vital roles in fillng in what happened that morning, before and after and in between.

And Murphy too, probably the first to alert, being the first to hear --

What I'm trying to say is that they each responded -- in important ways, ultimately stopping BK from becoming a serial killer. And while I wish none of this happened, while I wish fighting back guaranteed survival, I herald them as heroes.

They helped take him down.

Because of them, he's behind bar for life.

That is mighty.

JMO

 

[Cedars]

What I understand, yes, they can ask the landlord. But, his say so doesn't carry any weight. If anything should go south a search warrant carries tremendous weight and halts litigation.

True. Defense will succeed in getting evidence thrown out of court if a judge didn't approve a proper search warrant. Police can't just go into a house and ransack it, hauling off people's possessions, without approval of a judge.

Your landlord can't take your phone and give to some guy who says he's a policeman. He can't take your knife sheath, either.

The problem may have been getting hold of the judge on a Sunday in sleepy Moscow. They also probably wanted to check with state prosecutors, the FBI, so as not to make any mistakes and bungle the investigation from the start.

 

[sunshineray]

They didn't know what kind of crime they had. But the victims were all the way deceased. They didn't need first aid and they couldn't get deader -- so there was no exigent circumstances to justify further searches, beyond ascertaining DOAs and all clear (of a suspect still on the premises).

Let's say there was a 6th roommate, one we didn't know about, and that person was the murderer. If LE processed the crime scene without a warrant, that roommate's defense attorney would move to have any evidence recovered without a warrant thrown out.

Obviously that wasn't the case but my point is that LE knew they'd be a prosecution one day and they knew to process the crime scene by the book, in order to preserve evidence for trial, leading to the eventual conviction of the assailant who commit that dastardly slaughter.

JMO

Thank Megnut, that's something I didn't consider. Waiting hours though to get a search warrant for a residence that has four slain people seems unsuitable to me. DNA evidence and bodies that have already been around for long hours. It wasn't like LE was trying to get a warrant in the wee hours of the morning either...it was midday.

 

[Cedars]

Thank Megnut, that's something I didn't consider. Waiting hours though to get a search warrant for a residence that has four slain people seems unsuitable to me. DNA evidence and bodies that have already been around for long hours. It wasn't like LE was trying to get a warrant in the wee hours of the morning either...it was midday.

Words are so tricky.

I guess the media outlet has implied police were literally standing around outside, itching to get in?

In fact, police officers are not to touch anything.

The forensics team goes in first. They analyse the untouched crime scene to work out what exactly happened. They gather and bag and label all the evidence, so that they don't contaminate with their own DNA.

The forensics team probably came from the FBI or state police and were a long way away. They would have to drive to the scene with their specially equipped vehicles.

The deceased had already been there for 7 hours by the time they were discovered. What's another few hours, to ensure to the crime was solved...

 

[Megnut]

Given the nature of the crime, IMO it wasn't just about securing the crime scene and obtaining a search warrant, there must have been a great deal of strategizing. Who gets notified and in what order, what departments are alerted, where and how and which organizations to assemble, how to handle the media, how to protect the investigation, how to lock down leaks, how and when to notify families, etc, etc.

In that context, a few hours doesn't seem long at all. That he was identified and arrested in a matter of mere weeks is outstanding.

Some families never get answers.

JMO

 

[MyTinkieGirl]

Real question. How do you see what was reported as "wrong"? Way back when media said there was "trace" DNA under the snap on the sheath, they didn't say that was the only DNA and they didn't say it was"a trace of" DNA. In a case like this, i don't consider omission of information the same as being wrong. BUT I do find (like "imperceptible" somehow equaling "miniscule") that if one media source runs with something incorrect, they all seem to run along behind.

If the truth is that "There was trace DNA under the snap AND there was blood and sweat and other bodily fluids, plus hair and other things", then "There was trace DNA under the snap" is correct, just not complete. How is that wrong?

Ann Taylor herself referred to the DNA quantity as "precious little" in an open court hearing during the great DNA Debate.
One needs to understand that the greater population doesn't look too much into the actual science of the beast. They don't think of "trace" as the actual TYPE of DNA or how it's deposited. A good deal of people see "trace" as the actual meaning of the word.
More like: Trace

What is another word for trace? | Trace Synonyms - WordHippo Thesaurus

Synonyms for trace include touch, hint, bit, shadow, suggestion, suspicion, drop, speck, spot and trifle. Find more similar words at wordhippo.com!

www.wordhippo.com

Noun
▲
A barely discernible indication of something

There's no slicing or dicing of what most of the population thought by "trace". To put it in AT's words "precious little".

• Influencing public perception. Legal analysts have suggested that Taylor's arguments, while rooted in technical legal challenges, also serve to plant seeds of doubt in the public's mind. The phrasing "precious little DNA" may be an example of "craftily worded" statements designed to influence public perception of the case.

Context for the phrase "precious little DNA"
While many sources report on Taylor's broader arguments about the limited and potentially transferred nature of the DNA, the exact phrase "precious little" is most prominently discussed in online forums and analyses of her defense strategy. Legal experts suggest this phrasing is intended to cast doubt on the prosecution's central piece of evidence.

 

[katydid23]

The Idaho State police had to wait "hours" for a search warrant to start collecting evidence at a crime scene? Is this just particular to Idaho? You have a quadruple murder scene and investigators have to wait hours to collect evidence to find killer(s)...because they need a warrant to search? No just calling the landlord? Hey four people are dead in your house, can we please go in and process the scene?

They won't take a chance on asking the landlord and then going in and collecting evidence without the legality of the signed warrant. If something goes wrong, like the landlord is not sole property owner, or he changes his mind mid-search, or whatever---then EVERYTHING they collected can be lost, and not admissible in the trial.

So they'd rather be safe and wait for a judge to sign off on the legal document.

That they would even have to ask when 4 people are laying there brutally murdered is beyond me. JMO

From your link...

"For hours, police waited to begin collecting evidence until a search warrant was approved at about 5 p.m., Gilbertson said."

 

[Bekind89]

KG's dad has spoken many times about, my word, his family's grit. AG demonstrated it so perfectly in her kickask impact statement.

I've been thinking about the horror of what occurred in a span of maybe four or six minutes that early November morning three years ago.

I have just posted what might have happened if KG hadn't been in MM's bed, how the crime might have been singular and so silent that BK might have gotten away with it.

It is awful -- awful awful awful -- what happened that night. How much worse if BK were never caught.

Let's talk about what key people did, that led to this crime being solved.

The DDD, who was in harm's way and never knew it, but without her, the missing front plate would never have been identified, not narrowing the field of Elantras.

KG, who fought like hell. I am reminded of that self defense strategy -- expect to be hurt.

And hurt she was. Her injuries are unfathomable. Brutal. He wasn't going to let her live, but her grit forced him to lose total control and that forced him to abandon silence and IMO the sheath, because she was a force he had to deal with. The noise awakened DM -- without that, there would have been no eye witness description.

It cost KG her life -- and an excruciating death -- to do it but that battle provided LE with critical evidence leading directly to BK's arrest. It might have seemed futile to fight with an armed assailant and indeed it proved fatal, but because she fought like hell anyway, MM's murder as well as hers and XK and EC's too did not become a cold case nor the first of a career of serial killings.

We'll likely never know who BK planned to murder that morning, whether one or four or more. Maybe XK and EC were murdered only because XK had been awake but XK, like KG, fought like hell. It didn't save her life either, but it did cause a disturbance which DM and BF heard, even if they didn't know what they were hearing or just what it meant as it was happening. It was enough that it awakened DM and alarmed her enough to investigate but also in some measure to protect herself. Had she swung that door open wide, she might have been Casualty #5, and her description of both events and BK would have died with her.

BF and DM played vital roles in fillng in what happened that morning, before and after and in between.

And Murphy too, probably the first to alert, being the first to hear --

What I'm trying to say is that they each responded -- in important ways, ultimately stopping BK from becoming a serial killer. And while I wish none of this happened, while I wish fighting back guaranteed survival, I herald them as heroes.

They helped take him down.

Because of them, he's behind bar for life.

That is mighty.

JMO

The similarities of these murders to the murders that Bundy committed at the Chi Omega house gives me doubts about BK targeting just one girl.
Bundy entered the Chi Omega dorm through slider/door that had a broken lock, just like BK.
Bundy attacked four students, viciously. BK killed four.
Idk, but BK read about Bundy, probably studied him and I believe the sick admired him.
One can't help but wonder if this was a copycat crime, but we will probably never know the answer to this.
All just my useless musings.

 

[Megnut]

The similarities of these murders to the murders that Bundy committed at the Chi Omega house gives me doubts about BK targeting just one girl.
Bundy entered the Chi Omega dorm through slider/door that had a broken lock, just like BK.
Bundy attacked four students, viciously. BK killed four.
Idk, but BK read about Bundy, probably studied him and I believe the sick admired him.
One can't help but wonder if this was a copycat crime, but we will probably never know the answer to this.
All just my useless musings.

Also entirely possible. If multiple targets, I imagine he expected one roommate per room. And no one being able to fight back.

After two rooms with two occupants, perhaps he wasn't taking his chances on more.

JMO

 

[sunshineray]

Words are so tricky.

I guess the media outlet has implied police were literally standing around outside, itching to get in?

In fact, police officers are not to touch anything.

The forensics team goes in first. They analyse the untouched crime scene to work out what exactly happened. They gather and bag and label all the evidence, so that they don't contaminate with their own DNA.

The forensics team probably came from the FBI or state police and were a long way away. They would have to drive to the scene with their specially equipped vehicles.

The deceased had already been there for 7 hours by the time they were discovered. What's another few hours, to ensure to the crime was solved...

The original quote about having to wait hours for a search warrant was from an Idaho State Police, not the local LE.

 

[sunshineray]

Given the nature of the crime, IMO it wasn't just about securing the crime scene and obtaining a search warrant, there must have been a great deal of strategizing. Who gets notified and in what order, what departments are alerted, where and how and which organizations to assemble, how to handle the media, how to protect the investigation, how to lock down leaks, how and when to notify families, etc, etc.

In that context, a few hours doesn't seem long at all. That he was identified and arrested in a matter of mere weeks is outstanding.

Some families never get answers.

JMO

It was outstanding they got him so quickly, excellent work!

 

[othram]

Ann Taylor herself referred to the DNA quantity as "precious little" in an open court hearing during the great DNA Debate.
One needs to understand that the greater population doesn't look too much into the actual science of the beast. They don't think of "trace" as the actual TYPE of DNA or how it's deposited. A good deal of people see "trace" as the actual meaning of the word.
More like: Trace

What is another word for trace? | Trace Synonyms - WordHippo Thesaurus

Synonyms for trace include touch, hint, bit, shadow, suggestion, suspicion, drop, speck, spot and trifle. Find more similar words at wordhippo.com!

www.wordhippo.com

Noun
▲
A barely discernible indication of something

There's no slicing or dicing of what most of the population thought by "trace". To put it in AT's words "precious little".

• Influencing public perception. Legal analysts have suggested that Taylor's arguments, while rooted in technical legal challenges, also serve to plant seeds of doubt in the public's mind. The phrasing "precious little DNA" may be an example of "craftily worded" statements designed to influence public perception of the case.

Context for the phrase "precious little DNA"
While many sources report on Taylor's broader arguments about the limited and potentially transferred nature of the DNA, the exact phrase "precious little" is most prominently discussed in online forums and analyses of her defense strategy. Legal experts suggest this phrasing is intended to cast doubt on the prosecution's central piece of evidence.

However you describe it, the fact is there was plenty of DNA to do everything that was necessary to build an excellent DNA profile.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Ann Taylor herself referred to the DNA quantity as "precious little" in an open court hearing during the great DNA Debate.
One needs to understand that the greater population doesn't look too much into the actual science of the beast. They don't think of "trace" as the actual TYPE of DNA or how it's deposited. A good deal of people see "trace" as the actual meaning of the word.
More like: Trace

What is another word for trace? | Trace Synonyms - WordHippo Thesaurus

Synonyms for trace include touch, hint, bit, shadow, suggestion, suspicion, drop, speck, spot and trifle. Find more similar words at wordhippo.com!

www.wordhippo.com

Noun
▲
A barely discernible indication of something

There's no slicing or dicing of what most of the population thought by "trace". To put it in AT's words "precious little".

• Influencing public perception. Legal analysts have suggested that Taylor's arguments, while rooted in technical legal challenges, also serve to plant seeds of doubt in the public's mind. The phrasing "precious little DNA" may be an example of "craftily worded" statements designed to influence public perception of the case.

Context for the phrase "precious little DNA"
While many sources report on Taylor's broader arguments about the limited and potentially transferred nature of the DNA, the exact phrase "precious little" is most prominently discussed in online forums and analyses of her defense strategy. Legal experts suggest this phrasing is intended to cast doubt on the prosecution's central piece of evidence.

Come on AT, 'precious little' was more than enough to send this killer to the firing squad. IMO

 

[Megnut]

Come on AT, 'precious little' was more than enough to send this killer to the firing squad. IMO

Every day and twice on Sunday.

 

[LinasK]

Needs to happen for every unsolved case.

I want to heartily thank you for the work that you do! My cousin's long cold case was solved- through another lab- through the use of IGG. His killer is now convicted and in prison.

 

[girlhasnoname]

I want to heartily thank you for the work that you do! My cousin's long cold case was solved- through another lab- through the use of IGG. His killer is now convicted and in prison.

Absolutely thrilled beyond words for you @LinasK