Post Verdict -Working Out The Unresolved Questions

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The DT strategy was to claim CMJA was a victim of domestic violence at the hands of Travis Alexander. Through repetition, they used his own words from the sex tape and written exchanges to paint this picture.

Do you think that Juan should have and could have done more to offset this strategy, and if so, do you think that it would have made a difference in the initial penalty verdict?

Dr. DeMarte touched briefly on these exchanges, saying that they were out of character and she only saw this side of him when CMJA had lied to Travis. I came to believe that Travis was reaching the end of his tether with her and her increasingly bizarre behavior. I do think that Juan should have done a better job with presenting the IM as a reaction to gas lighting (the "Steve Carrel" exchange) and the 5/26 exchange, which many now believe to be his reaction to a blackmail attempt on her part.
 
The DT strategy was to claim CMJA was a victim of domestic violence at the hands of Travis Alexander. Through repetition, they used his own words from the sex tape and written exchanges to paint this picture.

Do you think that Juan should have and could have done more to offset this strategy, and if so, do you think that it would have made a difference in the initial penalty verdict?

Dr. DeMarte touched briefly on these exchanges, saying that they were out of character and she only saw this side of him when CMJA had lied to Travis. I came to believe that Travis was reaching the end of his tether with her and her increasingly bizarre behavior. I do think that Juan should have done a better job with presenting the IM as a reaction to gas lighting (the "Steve Carrel" exchange) and the 5/26 exchange, which many now believe to be his reaction to a blackmail attempt on her part.

in response to the highlighted portion of your post - IMO, the problem was - JA constantly lied, so there were numerous instances of TA name-calling. I think it was difficult for the Prosecution to overcome that. Even Dr. DeMarte said it wasn't healthy. I think the Prosecution attempted to counter that with testimony from others that Travis didn't do that or treat others that way. And, they presented testimony that sort of corroborated or justified Travis name-calling (like "🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬" and "3-hole wonder") - with testimony about JA having anal sex with all her partners, etc. which sort of segued into JA being deserving of the names - sort of like "if the shoe fits." I think the Prosecution would have had a really difficult time trying to prove exactly what made Travis go off on Jodi though. I mean, they couldn't really prove that JA was the one who slashed his tires, they couldn't prove she sneaked into his home through the doggy door, they couldn't prove she may have been blackmailing him about the sex tape, etc.

Good question though!
 
Absolutely. Juan did a very good job and he got the conviction, but I feel like his closing arguments should have made even clearer that these texts were out of character for Travis and were in response to something Jodi had done to him. This is where it helps to at least have an outline of what you want to say in your closing arguments. It leaves open the door that, even if there isn't any proof of physical violence, there is this "evidence" of emotional violence.

Some things I really wish Juan had hit on more:

1. Travis had never talked to anyone, even Jodi, that way before those two texts exchanges in May. Travis did not have a history of verbal abuse or degradation.

2. That means, especially based on the verbiage, that they were in response to something that really angered and hurt more than he had ever been hurt and betrayed before. He even says words to those effects.

3. Another thing that I really wish was made very clear was, while Jodi had been messing with Travis for a while before May, it definitely appears that after she moves away at the end of April, her stalking behavior had escalated rapidly. Before, perhaps Travis felt like he could handle her, that it really wasn't that, and that Jodi was so sweet and apologetic, (and would gas light to make him feel like the crazy one), that he forgave her and let her back into his life. He also just seems like he couldn't get over her and she made it impossible for him to do so. He may have on some level felt flattered by it.

But in May she was spiraling out of control and she was taking Travis with her. She was hacking his stuff left and right keeping tabs on him then innocently confronting him with the information. He finally clued in that the only way she could have gotten that info was by snooping through his personal accounts and convos. She would delete messages from other people to him. She would send several "accidental" texts and emails to him intended for other men with a little "whoopsie." It is not OTT jealousy that got him upset at that, it's that Jodi would just not leave him alone and he could see the game she was playing. My god, ANYBODY would have responded with some of the vitriol that he unleashed on her. He could have handled it better but he was at his wit's end. If you ever been at your wit's end with somebody, and you just want to explode on them, and when you finally tell them what you think of them, they just gas light and minimize your feelings ("ok, whatever drama queen," or "Well, I am sorry, I was just telling everyone what an awesome guy you were," without ever actually addressing what he's angry about and playing innocent), you are just going to get even angrier and angrier and yes, Travis' words got even more vitriolic. I don't blame him. He was trying to get through to her. Poor Travis didn't know that he was dealing with a sociopath who got off on setting him off and then getting him even angrier. She loves that.

May is also when he had begun telling his friends that Jodi was scaring him. He told a girl just weeks before his murder that he was afraid of Jodi. Her behavior clearly had gone from, in his eyes, a girl with an intense crush to someone whose behavior had grown frightening and erratic. She recorded the phone sex convo with him. Her journals reflect an all out obsession and some kind of plot that was unfolding but she was quite vague. They also reflect an inner rage and instability. Even in her text to Ryan Burns she just goes on and on and on about Travis.

Travis seemed to frame these expressions of fear around semi sarcasm. But at the heart of it people could see that Travis was genuinely uneasy and scared of her. He was probably in a place where he felt like there was no one to talk to and nothing he could do about her. That's hell. And it's sad to me when ALV talks about a cycle of abuse because that is exactly what poor Travis was trapped in and he was trapped in a situation that he probably felt he couldn't get out of.

So, in short (haha), yes, I had really, really wished that Juan had made it more clear what was going on and what spawned this reaction from. Anyone, like Foreman, looking to exonerate Jodi in any way he can (and the fact that he couldn't just speaks to the strength of the evidence and the way Jodi's testimony really worked against her), can look at these texts as a mean, scary guy set off on poor sweet little Jodi who's trying to keep him calm. I don't know how this could be evidence of an escalation of abuse in general as Jodi lived in Cali and could have just not talked to him or messed with him. They are evidence of a man at the end of his rope trying to make the psycho stalker leave him alone. So it should have been hit on very hard because that was the crux of the "verbal abuse."

And there were only two instances. So it's just even more silly to me. The defense went over them over and over and over and over and over again, so as to make it seem more frequent and severe then it really was. Juan should have diffused that by saying it wasn't a frequent occurrence at all, but only two text exchanges that happened at a time where Jodi's stalking behavior had escalated and Travis was growing increasingly frustrated and scared of her. And only weeks later, he was dead.

I have thought about this before, lol.
 
in response to the highlighted portion of your post - IMO, the problem was - JA constantly lied, so there were numerous instances of TA name-calling. I think it was difficult for the Prosecution to overcome that. Even Dr. DeMarte said it wasn't healthy. I think the Prosecution attempted to counter that with testimony from others that Travis didn't do that or treat others that way. And, they presented testimony that sort of corroborated or justified Travis name-calling (like "🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬" and "3-hole wonder") - with testimony about JA having anal sex with all her partners, etc. which sort of segued into JA being deserving of the names - sort of like "if the shoe fits." I think the Prosecution would have had a really difficult time trying to prove exactly what made Travis go off on Jodi though. I mean, they couldn't really prove that JA was the one who slashed his tires, they couldn't prove she sneaked into his home through the doggy door, they couldn't prove she may have been blackmailing him about the sex tape, etc.

Good question though!

She said it demonstrated an immaturity in expressing emotions. Definitely fair enough. Travis could have handled it better. But she also said it was understandable given that it was in response to repeated violations of his privacy and to Jodi crossing boundaries. Juan should have highlighted this more.
 
She said it demonstrated an immaturity in expressing emotions. Definitely fair enough. Travis could have handled it better. But she also said it was understandable given that it was in response to repeated violations of his privacy and to Jodi crossing boundaries. Juan should have highlighted this more.

But, I think Juan was limited in what he could highlight or present - I mean, he has to have evidence or proof to back it up. (Juan Martinez is still a hero in my book)
 
But, I think Juan was limited in what he could highlight or present - I mean, he has to have evidence or proof to back it up. (Juan Martinez is still a hero in my book)

He did have evidence of it though. Jodi talked about it, Demarte talked about it, and he was able to bring up things like the Reagan Housely text and Jodi's journals from May. He had enough to work with. He didn't have evidence of the tire slashing, the ring being stolen, but the escalation on Jodi's part was well documented. And if Demarte said that Travis was responding to repeated violations of his privacy, then he could have talked about that, even if he couldn't specifically talk about all of them. He could definitely talk about some. Take the things that Jodi copped to and get to the truth of them.
 
Also, OT post, but this seems to be the only trial thread going so here goes, but anyway. I was watching all of the state's case from yesterday to today since I missed it before and there was a great Juan line in there that no one ever mentions.

It was in response to Nurmi as he was cross examining Burns and makes mention of no one being able to hear Burns because of the other voices going on. And Juan, as he's walking back to his desk responds,

"Objection as to "the other voices." If he has something to say to he can say it directly to me."

Oh snap!!! Everyone looked kind of shocked, even Jodi. No wonder he has a reputation for "playing hardball." He is certainly not there to make any friends.
 
Estrella has no internet access for inmates. Sheriff Joe knows better. Wired up prisoners doing social media outreach is taking a long stick to poke a hornet's nest. Facilities all over the country have found that out the hard way. When jailed offenders are able to go on-line, the ability is vastly abused. Criminals contact their victims. Criminals run slicker games, cons & graft of all sorts. Criminals taunt survivors & their families. That is the experience of facilities that have allowed access. When it is cut off, criminals can become morose. Convicted Connecticut killer Michael Ross sunk into a V shaped depression when his ex-fiancée stopped helping him in the same way Ms. Bering has been helping C.M.

Arizona did have a law that prohibited outsiders from providing prisoners with web access but in 2003, a Fed. Distr. judge struck it down. Possibly, family members have taken over for Ms. Bering. For me, a ban means you don't do it. It does not mean find a monkey's paw to play the internet for you. This must be beyond delicious for the convicted murderer, incorporating both intrigue and using people, absolutely top hobbies of hers.

The Canadian Coalition Against the Death Penalty publishes websites for 500 U.S. death row inmates and solicits pen pals for 700 more. This is accomplished with a phone call and a published list of those on death row. As I look at this in terms of legal implications, it could not be more troublesome. Can I sit in the common room, on my jail phone and tell you, as trustee, to go into your aunt's bank account and procure a large heaping of "commissary" money for me, simply because it is lawful for you to access it? C.M.'s web access is a circuitous violation, almost as roundabout as her itineraries, but it is still a glaring violation. Of course, without it she would be as frustrated as Michael Ross. Punishment for capital crime, however, does not come without its inconveniences.
 
What are we enabling by allowing criminals to post on the web? Jack Trawick, resident of Alabama's death row, wrote stories about his criminal exploits. One elaborate tale described the details of a murder he committed against a 21 yr. old woman whom he strangled and then hammered to death. He illustrated his crimes with drawings of women he had mutilated after he had a date with them. In particular, he liked to taunt the mother of the victim above. Inmates like Jack get busy luring internet users into relationships based on deceitful self-presentation and they also use the web to promote new crimes.

It was long ago decided crying "Fire!" in a crowded theater is not protected speech. Neither should this access be allowed as a First Amendment right guaranteed the intermediaries who plaster garbage on the web for their "inside connection".
 
A few negative Amazon reviews of the new Jodi Arias book appeared to regard Travis as a typical abuser, partly because of the "dirty talk" and their varied sexual activities. This stereotypical thinking is dangerous because it paints the brutally slaughtered victim as, in a sense, the real instigator to his own demise.

Next to Jodi, Travis was a babe in the woods; indeed, if he had been more sexually experienced, he might have refused any of her post-breakup booty calls. As for the "dirty talk," by participating in it, Travis was communicating that the relationship was just sexual; it was Jodi who was attempting to gyrate into a meaningful connection and marriage.
 
What I was hoping to hear from Juan in his closing and or plea for death is a few facts about REAL Domestic Abuse the kind that JA was putting upon TA. First thing I would of liked for him to address with quacko ALV is the fact that mostly all killings occur when the person is trying to get away from their abuser. Juan really needed to address this to the jury! TA Made it clear in his texts he was done he wanted her to leave him alone and when he told little miss murder she started the plan of if I can't have you nobody will! If is classic abuser 101. Even the quackadoodle ALV would have to admit (maybe not) but it could have been brought in by JD that when an abuser and stalker like JA loses her control and hold on their obsession that is when they kill.
You hear so many times how the person was finally trying to get away or they were moving on and the next minute they are dead. I just wished his friends knew the signs or that TA wasn't so scared of her maybe blackmail that he would of opened up to at least SH.
It is sad.
 
MeeBee, your outline for closing arguments was exactly the way that I had hoped to see Juan present things to the jury, including some of ALV's buzzwords so that he made it crystal clear to the jury that it was his opinion that she was in fact at the extreme end of ALV's exhibit in terms of domestic violence.Reference that exhibit in the closing arguments. I don't think that he drove this home strongly enough. I do believe that if he had there might possibly have been a different outcome in the penalty phase.
 
There is a rumor floating around that Kimberly Ross, a convicted felon who is currently awaiting trial on new charges, may be called as a mitigation witness.

This appears to be a false rumor.

Using the Maricopa County Superior court website to view trial history and minutes for this woman, it does not appear likely that she would be considered a possible witness. She is awaiting trial right now, however court minutes dated 6/6/2013 show that she has been found mentally incompetent to stand trial. If this ruling stands, she would not be able to testify.

Just wanted to get things out there before this rumor takes on a life of its own.
 
:jail:Dose anyone know if JM opening or closing arguments are transcribed anywhere? I have been trying to find them instead of watching the video's because my kids get mad at me. They are like it's over stop going thru it again you're not a lawyer and she is convicted. Kids don't get it! lol :blushing:
 
:jail:Dose anyone know if JM opening or closing arguments are transcribed anywhere? I have been trying to find them instead of watching the video's because my kids get mad at me. They are like it's over stop going thru it again you're not a lawyer and she is convicted. Kids don't get it! lol :blushing:

I thought HLN had a transcript but I can't find one over there (or anywhere else google turns up), the Timeline thread here has lots of tweets from the first day:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=195462"]*graphic and adult content* Jodi Arias Trial media/ timeline thread **no discussion** - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]


and the first trial watcher thread has pics and posts from the beginning of the trial:


[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=194747"]Jodi Arias Trial Watchers Thread - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]


If I come across any transcripts of open or close I'll post links.
 
I thought HLN had a transcript but I can't find one over there (or anywhere else google turns up), the Timeline thread here has lots of tweets from the first day:

*graphic and adult content* Jodi Arias Trial media/ timeline thread **no discussion** - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community


and the first trial watcher thread has pics and posts from the beginning of the trial:


Jodi Arias Trial Watchers Thread - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community


If I come across any transcripts of open or close I'll post links.

Thank you I have looked and looked nobody seems to have the entire thing just snippets here and there.
 
Star...here you go. An early Christmas present from me: http://www.scribd.com/doc/163015143/Jodi-Arias-Prosecution-Closing-Arguments-Full

PS: all I want for Christmas is the winning jackpot ticket in Powerball. That should only set you back $2. :floorlaugh:

Thank you! Is anyone in the mood to chat about miss murder? I have a few things bothering me about this for one the judge not controlling the court room and lies hat where not addressed. I also saw where ppl where talking about the sex pic's thinking they where not from that day maybe? I do know there where more not shown in court of the act itself that JSS said had no reason to be in the trial. :blushing:
 
Thank you! Is anyone in the mood to chat about miss murder? I have a few things bothering me about this for one the judge not controlling the court room and lies hat where not addressed. I also saw where ppl where talking about the sex pic's thinking they where not from that day maybe? I do know there where more not shown in court of the act itself that JSS said had no reason to be in the trial. :blushing:

BBM

Hiya starporter and welcome to the world of unresolved questions. :)

I'm one of those who doesn't believe the nudies were taken the day she killed Travis. Considering there were two camera memory cards found (the blue one and the Sony card) it means not only did she intend to leave the camera (albeit with deleted pictures) but she also threw the blue card into the wash, and we have zero testimony on that blue card...that does not fit in Travis' camera...but was found in the washer (pic with evidence marker on page 1, post 3 of this thread).

I have to set aside what does not make sense with the Big Picture - and what makes the least amount of sense is that we know they were arguing on and off since she left Mesa, had a huge fight on May 26th, yet 9 days later he's asking her into his bed and taking nudies like it's old times? No, I do not think so.

I think the nudies were on the blue camera card, and she transferred those that day onto that card and that's how they got the June 4th date and time stamp. Remember, Travis never called or answered his phone after 12:13 p.m., so we have no evidence that he was alive at 1:45 or 5:22 when the shower pics began.

She wasn't a professional photographer but she did know her way around cameras, photos and editing software, and she's mighty crafty when she has a plan.

Sorry, didn't mean to write a book, but Flores had it so right early on...'It's the details.' lol
 
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