Psychological Markers

[Dwntwnslim]

@ Peter Brendt-

Thanks again for allowing all of us here to benefit from your knowledge!

 

[Dwntwnslim]

S.T.A.L.K., Inc. updated their profile of the Long Island perp on January 17, 2012.

Here is the link for anyone interested in reading it:

http://www.stalkinc.com/profile6.html

 

[Clem Snide]

S.T.A.L.K., Inc. updated their profile of the Long Island perp on January 17, 2012.

Here is the link for anyone interested in reading it:

http://www.stalkinc.com/profile6.html

Guess we won't know until he's caught how accurate that is, but it's nice to have a concise profile of what the killer might be like. They talk of his needing a "fix", which seems on par with what I know about sks. The question is, where is he getting his fix now?

Or if he's stopped killing, WHY has he stopped.

 

[Peter Brendt]

S.T.A.L.K., Inc. updated their profile of the Long Island perp on January 17, 2012.

Here is the link for anyone interested in reading it:

http://www.stalkinc.com/profile6.html

Thanks for the link. I disagree with them in a number of points, but as someone rightly said, we will know for sure only after the guy is caught.
Still, just as food for thought:

- if he is a psychopath/sadist 101, he would try to reach that high of the first kill again. S.T.A.L.K speaks there from needing a fix because that kind of killer would killer more often and would hone his skills "to do it right" because he would think, he can't get that high because he is doing wrong and if he would do it right, it would come back. This is like a drug addiction, he would need more and in shorter rhythm.
Now look at LISK2. Even if you say, Manorville and Gilgo Beach would be the same killer, what is he doing? Is he killing more often? Jeffrey Dahmer killed in the end almost weekly, Ted Bundy about all two weeks. Especially, if the Manorville murders would be his work too, he would, after all those years of escalating rather be in the range of killing all few weeks if not even faster. Not just once a year.

- As I said several times, a dismemberer and a strangler who creates his own little graveyard are two different mindsets. I still think, it's pretty near to impossible, that one chnages into the other, but if, the way would be from the strangler to the dismemberer, not vice versa. So, IMO, those are two different killers. Thus, LISK2 has no qualms about the Baby killed, simply because he didn't do it.

- SKs of all types fear apprehension, that is true. But to conclude, that LE will arrest him soon sounds more like hope. And while he avoids apprehension and probably kills along dropping his bodies somewhere else, he wouldn't waste too much time about what happens in prison after he is caught. Right now, after all this hype, he probably feels rather invincible.

- a typical symptom for a highly organized psychopathic SK would be an attempt to inject himself in the investigation. I have not heard of any such attempt. No letters to police and media, no phone calls on tip hotlines (unless the officer on the line thought, it's just another interested person and killed the line), no statements garnished with a fresh body - nothing, zilch. So either, he feels ,he lacks the communicative abilities to do so or he simply hasn't this urge, which would again make psychopath 101 pretty unlikely.

- I love that paragraph about serial killers have to learn their trade first. Not only for this reason, but also as part of a mental process, first or early victims are often the key to crack a SK case. However, if I mix up two SKs, one earlier, one later, what do I miss? Right, the earlier murders of the second killer. And if I assume, those are two different cases, I see in the GB4 cases a complete established signature starting with Brainard-Barnes. This means, his earlier victims have to be somewhere else and they would show us the evolution of a strangler type attacker, not another fully fledged signature of a dismemberer. And looking back at Manorville, this was also a fully developed signature form the earliest case on, so where are his earlier victims?

So, well, since profiling is basically the interpretation of little facts, at this point nobody can be really proven right or wrong, there are only little doubts without final prove possible till the guy is caught and even then, in most cases, a lot of question remain. But admittedly, I have such doubts when I read the S.T.A.L.K profile.

 

[Aleph]

S.T.A.L.K., Inc. updated their profile of the Long Island perp on January 17, 2012.

Here is the link for anyone interested in reading it:

http://www.stalkinc.com/profile6.html

I don't know why I didn't notice this before, but it seems to be written largely as a message to the killer, encouraging him to turn himself in.

Also, they misspelled "heroin." Who are they, exactly?

 

[Dwntwnslim]

I don't know why I didn't notice this before, but it seems to be written largely as a message to the killer, encouraging him to turn himself in.

Also, they misspelled "heroin." Who are they, exactly?

I thought the same thing. I just wish we knew what information they are basing their profile on and where they got it. The impression is given that the writers of the profile were drawing from inside information, IMO.

Do you think it's possible they misspelled "heroin" on purpose?

F.Y.I. - I posted some links about S.T.A.L.K., Inc and a couple of their members in this thread (#126) if your interested in checking them out.

 

[citylady]

Do you think it's possible they misspelled "heroin" on purpose?

They also misspelled "loser" too "he's nothing but a fragile looser" the language in general in that last paragraph seems a bit bizarre IMHO

 

[Peter Brendt]

They also misspelled "loser" too "he's nothing but a fragile looser" the language in general in that last paragraph seems a bit bizarre IMHO

It's not encouraging him to turn himself in, it's making him pissed enough to commit mistakes. And they base their profile on the FBI standard 101 profile, which tells us, that almost every SK is a white loner between 30 and 50 with antisocial personality disorder, psychopathic behavior and a remorseless sadist even before any agent has seen a crime scene or identified any victim.

 

[Dwntwnslim]

They also misspelled "loser" too "he's nothing but a fragile looser" the language in general in that last paragraph seems a bit bizarre IMHO

I didn't catch that at first. Yeah, there probably isn't a hidden meaning in the misspelling of "heroin". They just didn't properly check their document for mistakes before putting it on the website.

For a second I thought the writers of the profile were insinuating that the perp has lost a lot of weight because he is on heroin.

 

[Dwntwnslim]

It's not encouraging him to turn himself in, it's making him pissed enough to commit mistakes. And they base their profile on the FBI standard 101 profile, which tells us, that almost every SK is a white loner between 30 and 50 with antisocial personality disorder, psychopathic behavior and a remorseless sadist even before any agent has seen a crime scene or identified any victim.

Yes. That makes a lot of sense. Thanks again for your perspective.

 

[waltzingmatilda]

This may be a bunch of rubbish but I thought I would post it anyway.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencet...rmula-predict-serial-killers-strike-next.html

Two mathematicians have found that a serial killer's pattern of murders seems to conform to a strict mathematical formula.
They theorise that the reason killings stick to a mathematical function known as 'the devil's staircase' is that serial killers work to a 'rhythm' - driven by neurons in their brains.

The pattern of brain cells 'firing' is similar to the patterns in epileptics' brains which drive them to have fits - but instead, overwhelming the killer with the urge to strike.



Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencet...serial-killers-strike-next.html#ixzz1jueyV2XP

 

[Salem]

Could be rubbish, but its interesting. I read somewhere that SK's have a genetic marker in their DNA - but now I can't find that article?

Sorry - if I run across that link again I will add it. It would be really something though if there was a physiological marker, kwim?

Salem

 

[nugzter]

Hey Salem,
I saw this a while back. I hope this is what you are refering to.
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cnV4RnWcmWo&feature=related"]Scientist discovers he has the mind of a killer - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Peter Brendt]

This may be a bunch of rubbish but I thought I would post it anyway.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencet...rmula-predict-serial-killers-strike-next.html

Two mathematicians have found that a serial killer's pattern of murders seems to conform to a strict mathematical formula.
They theorise that the reason killings stick to a mathematical function known as 'the devil's staircase' is that serial killers work to a 'rhythm' - driven by neurons in their brains.

The pattern of brain cells 'firing' is similar to the patterns in epileptics' brains which drive them to have fits - but instead, overwhelming the killer with the urge to strike.



Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencet...serial-killers-strike-next.html#ixzz1jueyV2XP

Pretty funny ... not the theory in itself, but the way it is worded. Because it's technically the exact same thing S.T.A.L.K would refer to needs a fix. The effect is very simple and well known (obviously only outside the world of mathematics). A killer gets an unbelievable high from his first kill, so he kills after some time again to get that high again. But it isn't that high. And like an addict, he kills always fast, escalates with every murder and so on. Devil's Staircase. So what those mathematicians do is basically a mathematical description of the perfect addict.
Here is the rub: Only certain types of SKs follow this patterns, usually psychopath/sadist101. A mission-driven killer wouldn't care, because he kills when his mission commands it (Herbert Mullin in California was that kind). A greed-killer wouldn't care, because he kills when he can make a profit (Harold Shipman in England, with about 200 victims, was that kind), a black widow, a housecleaner, an angel of death, they all wouldn't care. So this formula from the start is limited to one specific type of serial killer. And in real life not even that kind would in reality always follow that formula because the formula can calculate, when he wants to kill, not when he has the opportunity. So, it's interesting from the scientific point of view, and it is far from rubbish, but I think, also far from usable.

 

[Dwntwnslim]

@ Peter Brendt-

I apologize if this question has already been asked and answered but, I was wondering if it were possible for a sk to be a mix of psychopath/sadist and a mission-driven killer?

Are there any examples of this mix if it is possible?

Also, if I google your name will it point me toward your website?

 

[Peter Brendt]

Could be rubbish, but its interesting. I read somewhere that SK's have a genetic marker in their DNA - but now I can't find that article?

Sorry - if I run across that link again I will add it. It would be really something though if there was a physiological marker, kwim?

Salem

It's called Monoamine oxidase A or shorter MAO-A or more popular, the "warrior gene". However, that is in public misunderstood (Jerry Bruckheimer's shows did a lot of work to promote the misunderstanding). Technically, there are a number of variants of this genom and in Caucasians are two of the most common. The studies, at first limited to Caucasians, seemed to indicate, that some other variants result in some kind of preposition for becoming an SK. In the meantime, they found out, that other ethnic groups have other variants revalent and thus, now everything goes slow because nobody wants to be the one saying by accident, that maybe people with a certain skin color have a higher probability. And in fact, this would be bull anyway. A lot of the trouble comes from the way. specialized scientists work today:

The neurobiologist: x% of all serial killers have one of those genetic variants. That is more than my testgroup for the normal population (which originally was all white). THe neurobiologist wouldn't touch a book about social psychology to save his life.
The socialpsychologist: Has no idea what MAO-A technically is. For him, it could be a little green man with fishtail. And he wouldn't touch a book about genetics to save his life. But he knows, that certain social environments (for example abusive parental households) breed more SKs. So he counts out the rare cases in which the SK comes from a nice middle class family just out of his study as exception from the rule.
The mathematician: Scratches his head. How does the neurobiologist make a sample size statistically relevant if the sample is lesss than 0,001 promille of the population and the targeted group makes anyway statistically less than 0.01 promille of the population. Because the mathematician knows, this is mathematically impossible and therefore rubbish, but he wouldn't go down the rabbit hole and talk to a psychologist unless he is just at the right time going through a bad divorce.
And so it goes on and on. Everyone makes his studies about exactly one aspect, nobody looks for the whole picture. And all refuse to talk to each other.
But in fact, things are pretty simple: Certain variants of MAO-A flood the brain during the development with large amounts of serotonin (other substances as well, but the key seems to be serotonin). So, at early age, the result is some kind of immunity to serotonin and it's calming effects (S. is also called the happiness hormone, because it calm's down and gives some kind of happy relaxation, but makes also emotional).
Now, less impact of serotonin makes people less emotional, distanced and in consequence sometimes socially a bit awkward because they tend to be logic in a twisted way when everybody expects them to be emotional. It could be a thing, that makes killing easier - or other activities which are normally emotionally hard - but it doesn't make one a killer. Someone with the warrior gene has a lot of career choices: Politician, business management, cop, artist (especially known in writers and actors), gardeners (lone job not so much bothering with other people), trucker, ... and so on, the list is too long. So what we really talk here is just raising the chances to become a successful killer.

 

[Peter Brendt]

Hey Salem,
I saw this a while back. I hope this is what you are refering to.
Scientist discovers he has the mind of a killer - YouTube

I love, how this "scientific recognization" is embedded in an episode of a TV show (Criminal Minds). Makes me wonder, whether Dr Reid was helping him out there ;-)).
However, there is a little truth to it (I wrote about MAO-A in an earlier post, right before this one) and a little misinterpretation. However, if this doc looked at about how man brains (something like thirty) and found five serial killers, all of the psychopaths type, then his base sample was already statistically distorted.
The next thing is the conclusion. There are a lot of people with that gene, also the doc himself. The majority of them aren't killers. So the hype about this discovery clearly is already out weighted by the number of mathematically wrong interpretations.

 

[Peter Brendt]

@ Peter Brendt-

I apologize if this question has already been asked and answered but, I was wondering if it were possible for a sk to be a mix of psychopath/sadist and a mission-driven killer?

Are there any examples of this mix if it is possible?

Also, if I google your name will it point me toward your website?

1.) I don't think, there is a clear mix. Both are major driving powers. But it is possible, that a psychopath in his process of self-justification disguises his motivation as mission-driven. And it is also possible, that a mission-driven killer can have anti-social personality disorders in his secondary diagnosis, thus supporting his primary diagnosis in the realm for example of religious delusions. As far as I can see, most examples would be in the range of black Angels of Death or Housecleaners. Look up for example Marianne Nolle (a German case, also written Noelle), Beram (one famous historic example), in a way, also Charles Manson.

2.) My name will bring you to the website of my wife. Forget facebook, I'm admittedly too stupid to use facebook.

 

[Clem Snide]

1.) I don't think, there is a clear mix. Both are major driving powers. But it is possible, that a psychopath in his process of self-justification disguises his motivation as mission-driven. And it is also possible, that a mission-driven killer can have anti-social personality disorders in his secondary diagnosis, thus supporting his primary diagnosis in the realm for example of religious delusions. As far as I can see, most examples would be in the range of black Angels of Death or Housecleaners. Look up for example Marianne Nolle (a German case, also written Noelle), Beram (one famous historic example), in a way, also Charles Manson.

2.) My name will bring you to the website of my wife. Forget facebook, I'm admittedly too stupid to use facebook.

Too stupid? Brotha, you are clearly one of the smartest or at least the most educated person on this board in terms of what you know about serial killers.

 

[Peter Brendt]

Too stupid? Brotha, you are clearly one of the smartest or at least the most educated person on this board in terms of what you know about serial killers.

Lol. now I need me to catch a serial killer who maintains my facebook page for me. After someone wrote me this week, I have the same mindset as John Wayne Gacy (because of a little wording on my website), it would be probably so opportune ;-))