Question

[Charlie]

Charlie, how about you find a source that says it is? Or, you could read this thread from the beginning and find a list of sources who say the DNA is not Ramsey.

I can't think of ANYone connected to this case that claims or even hints that the DNA from the panties and nail clippings is from the Ramseys. In fact, there has been no information that ANY Ramsey DNA was found on the body.

On page one of this thread toth states:
'Anyway, the dna from the fingernails and from the panties: is NOT Ramsey dna."

 

[LovelyPigeon]

Toth is correct.

Charlie, you didn't provide a source claiming that the DNA belongs to any Ramsey.

 

[BlueCrab]

On page one of this thread toth states:
'Anyway, the dna from the fingernails and from the panties: is NOT Ramsey dna."

Several years age former Detective Mark Fuhrman, on a national TV panel show, stated DNA from the JonBenet crime scene contained Ramsey family markers. Noted forensic pathologist Dr. Michael Baden, also a panelist, gave body language agreeing with Fuhrman's statement.

JMO

 

[Toth]

Mark Fuhrman knows how to spell dna. That's about it!
He obviously does not know what is meant by 'the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth'.

 

[Barbara]

Charlie, you didn't provide a source claiming that the DNA belongs to any Ramsey.

Can you provide a scientific official source (not Lou Smit, Wood, Thomas, etc) that states that it does NOT belong to ANY Ram$ey?

 

[Toth]

or more importantly because it's evidence that proves the Ramseys are not telling the truth about what really happened that morning.

If that were really the case, why on earth would DA Keenan want to conceal this information and why on earth would she be having her investigators focusing on intruders rather than the parents?

 

[LovelyPigeon]

Barbara, I've provided multiple sources that were or are very involved officially in the case. Can you provide any one with the same amount of involvement who even suggest that the DNA belongs to a Ramsey?

And regarding an earlier question, I'll remind you that even ST said in his book that BPD couldn't establish that degradation was responsible for the small number of male markers derived from the nail clippings and blood spot.

 

[LovelyPigeon]

I'll add 2 more official sources that say the male DNA found on JonBenét is not Ramsey: Federal Judge Julie Carnes and current Boulder County District Attorney Mary Keenan.

 

[Toth]

Won't do much good: These people think DA-Keenan doctored the 911tape to help the Ramseys and that the inexperienced federal judge was duped and denied access to all the evidence.

 

[why_nutt]

I'll add 2 more official sources that say the male DNA found on JonBenét is not Ramsey: Federal Judge Julie Carnes and current Boulder County District Attorney Mary Keenan.

I counter with this fact: if Carnes and Keenan are authorities on individual aspects of evidence in the case, then both John and Patsy are liars, as Carnes said that Burke fell sleep in the car coming home from the White party, and Keenan agreed with her. Carnes put her reputation on the line when she put that piece of information in her ruling; as she would know, a jury is allowed to decide "false in one thing, false in all." Has she been false in this one thing? Or have John and Patsy? Did Carnes just pull a made-up fact out of her backside when she wrote "On the drive home from the party, JonBenet and her brother Burke fell asleep in the car. Defendants put the children to bed when they returned home and then went to bed soon there after"? Why would Keenan agree to such a representation of evidence in the case unless it was true?

 

[Jayelles]

Won't do much good: These people think DA-Keenan doctored the 911tape to help the Ramseys and that the inexperienced federal judge was duped and denied access to all the evidence.

Carnes didn't have access to all the evidence. She wasn't allowed access to the massive 20 foot high police file that ******* is wading his way through. She worked from Lou Smit's 1998 PowerPoint presentation. You look at how much more evidence has come out since then - DNA-x is just one example.

Do you think we know everything that's in the police file? I'll bet there's a whole lot that hasn't come out.

There's a case in the British news just now about a guy whose wife went missing in the 1970s. He fell immediately under suspicion, but the police didn't charge hiim. He protested his innocence and accused police of hounding him. His indignant protests reached an all time high in the 1990s.

Last week, they arrested him and charged him with her murder - something like 20 years after her disappearance. New developments in forensic testing meant they got the crucial evidence they needed to proceed with their case.

I'd love to know the reasons why some of the people who were involved in this case and who were privy to the police file still believe the Ramseys are involved. Do they know something that hasn't been made public?

I guess it will all come out in the wash some day.

 

[LovelyPigeon]

That both kids fell asleep in the car is a generalization on the part of the judge, it seems to me. I doubt she depended on any scientific or forensic report but just her general recall on the trip home.

JonBenét fell asleep in the car, Burke did not, according to PR's police and public interviews. Both children were put to bed shortly after arriving home. The parents also went to sleep shortly after arriving home.

Male DNA on the murdered child is a bit more technical and important than both children falling asleep in the car.

 

[Jayelles]

That both kids fell asleep in the car is a generalization on the part of the judge, it seems to me. I doubt she depended on any scientific or forensic report but just her general recall on the trip home.

So you are conceding that Carne's report is speculative?

Male DNA on the murdered child is a bit more technical and important than both children falling asleep in the car.

And unfortunately, Carnes did not have access to those crucial lab reports - especially the later ones which Smit didn't have.

 

[BlueCrab]

I'd love to know the reasons why some of the people who were involved in this case and who were privy to the police file still believe the Ramseys are involved. Do they know something that hasn't been made public?

Not only the police, but ANYBODY who has been following the case knows at least one of the Ramseys in the house that night is involved. The Ramseys wouldn't be lying and covering up for an intruder.

JMO

 

[LovelyPigeon]

No, I do not think Carnes opinion is speculative. She based her legally sound opinion on the available evidence and on information from depositions taken.

There are case people (ST comes to mind) who have thought the Rs were involved from day one. And there are case people who do not. Smit was one of those who thought the Rs must have been involved from what he'd read in the papers (no footprints in snow, no sign of intruder, etc) but came to believe them innocent after reviewing the evidence for himself.

 

[Shylock]

These people think DA-Keenan doctored the 911tape to help the Ramseys and that the inexperienced federal judge was duped and denied access to all the evidence.

"Redacted" Toth. Say it 10 times..Redacted, redacted, redacted..
As to why Keenan released a "redacted" version of the 911 tape you'll just have to call her up and ask her. (Actually I understand that someone from another forum already did just that and Keenan's answer was "no comment".)

And the federal judge wasn't "duped". The federal judge ruled on evidence presented by the loser Darnay Hoffman. Tell me Toth, knowing what you know about Hoffman, would YOU want to base an opinion on anything that guy has to say? Unfortunately Carnes could only rule on the evidence presented, not on the source presenting it.

 

[Shylock]

No, I do not think Carnes opinion is speculative. She based her legally sound opinion on the available evidence and on information from depositions taken.

LP, "legally sound"?...LOL you must be kidding! She based her opinion on information presented by the untimate legal buffoon, Darnay Hoffman! Carnes opinion was shaped by a fool. That makes Carne's opinion completely WORTHLESS!

Edited to add: Most of the posters on this forum could have done a better job of refuting Lin Wood's false evidence, and presented a better case of Ramsey guilt, then Darnay Hoffman did.

 

[Shylock]

why on earth would DA Keenan be having her investigators focusing on intruders rather than the parents?

Do you REALLY think she is, Toth? I think Keenan duped you the same way she duped Limpy so he didn't file a suit against the BPD and cause Boulder to waste even more taxpayer dollars on the Ramseys.

Don't look for anything to ever come of Keenan's investigation, the same way you'll go to your grave expecting the foreign DNA to ever make any kind of a difference in this case.

 

[Cherokee]

If that were really the case, why on earth would DA Keenan want to conceal this information and why on earth would she be having her investigators focusing on intruders rather than the parents?

Keenan is "having her investigators focusing on intruders rather than on the parents"? Oh please. Don't make me laugh.

Just like Shylock said ... the ONLY reason Keenan has even made noises about investigating the JBR case and having Tom ******* go through the case files is because ... and I'll say this loudly and slowly so it can be understood ... KEENAN CAVED IN TO LIN WOOD'S THREAT THAT HE WOULD SUE THE BOULDER DA'S OFFICE AND THE BPD IF THEY DIDN'T TAKE OVER THE CASE.

It was "legal" extortion from Lin Wood and Team Ramsey.

Wood: "Take the JBR case away from the BPD and say you're investigating other leads, and we won't sue you for millions of taxpayer dollars."

Keenan: "Okay."

Wood: "Now jump!"

Keenan: "How high?"



IMO

 

[LovelyPigeon]

I am no fan of Darnay's Hoffman's and have nothing nice to say about him, including that he in any way shaped Carne's opinion.

On the contrary, Carnes opinion was based on the evidence presented by Lin Wood and as revealed in depositions, as opposed to the baseless claims of DH that Patsy wrote the note.

Keenan publically agreed with Carnes, and Keenan certainly has access to even more than Carnes or Wood.