Rape allegations mount against Bill Cosby #2

[IzzyBlanche]

Yep, huge problem. Probably the most important talking point.

Much bigger problem than the courts being clogged with false allegations.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Cosby Team’s Strategy: Hush Accusers, Insult Them, Blame the Media

An examination of how the team has dealt with scandals over the past two decades and into this fall reveals an organized and expensive effort that involved quashing accusations as they emerged while raising questions about the accusers’ character and motives, both publicly and surreptitiously. And the team has never been shy about blasting the news media for engaging in a feeding frenzy even as the team made deals or slipped the news organizations information that would cast Mr. Cosby’s accusers in a negative light.

Playing hardball with people who make (and report on) incendiary claims is hardly a new tactic in the celebrity world. But given the volume and severity of the recent charges, with numerous women saying Mr. Cosby drugged and then sexually assaulted them, some legal and public relations practitioners question the wisdom of continuing to counterpunch.

...

“I would suggest,” Mr. Brafman added, “a softly spoken denial rather than an outspoken challenge to the integrity of the women now coming forward. Simply put, it may be better to say nothing than try and engage so many.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/29/a...ccusers-insult-them-blame-the-media.html?_r=0

 

[bexlex]

Cosby's Private Investigators Dig Up Dirt to Discredit Rape Accusers

Bill Cosby has hired a battalion of private investigators to dig up dirt on his many accusers, The Post has learned.

The comedian, fighting an onslaught of accusations that he sexually assaulted more than two dozen women over many years, is paying six-figure fees to private investigators for information that might discredit his alleged victims.

Multiple sources confirmed that Cosby, through his Hollywood attorney Martin Singer, is implementing a scorched-earth strategy in which anything negative in his accusers’ pasts is fair game.

At least one Glendale, Calif.-based firm with a half-dozen former LAPD detectives on staff is muckraking for Cosby, a source said.

http://pagesix.com/2014/12/28/cosby...ccusers/?_ga=1.57953258.1126446268.1335160290

And that is how it is done....:sick:

 

[rosemadderlake]

She says she confronted Cosby and that he shoved her into a taxi. NPR's Eric Deggans tells our Newscast unit that "her story is similar to accusations made by more than 20 other women, some of whom claim Cosby also raped them."

On NBC today, Johnson said: "This is bigger than Bill Cosby. This is about women and violence against women. This is about women finding their voice. I feel that Cosby took my power that evening and that I took my power back."

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way...bys-latest-accuser-supermodel-beverly-johnson

RTBM: jumping off your post-

Beverley Johnson has said she is supporting Janice who I actually find more credible because she wanted to tell her story in 2006 +/- and because I believe her in her frustration and anger expressed about it in the Howard Stern interview in 2006 – gut reaction. On The View, when Beverley said she didn’t know if she was raped yet remembers in great detail the exchange with BC, and being shoved into a taxi - I felt doubt about her and the drugging piece – gut reaction.
http://abc.go.com/shows/the-view/video/pl5554876/vdka0_r1b7y9ub

Where things start to get really muddled for me is with Kathie Lee Gifford saying ‘Bill Cosby tried to kiss me’. I almost think she is team Cosby trying to water down the press with the absurdity at some other diminished end of the spectrum. Otherwise, she has very kind things to say about Cosby.
http://www.etonline.com/news/155251_kathie_lee_gifford_says_bill_cosby_tried_to_kiss_her/
http://www.people.com/article/kathie-lee-gifford-bill-cosby-sexual-abuse-allegations

LAPD won’t pursue criminal charges regarding Huth at PB Mansion in ‘74. I wonder if they are going to file a civil suit for 100 mil?
http://mashable.com/2014/12/16/los-angeles-cosby-no-charges/

If that doesn’t happen where does this thing go? -To the tabloid press? -More Dr. Phil? Maybe that is ok for some but I question, is that a good platform for the conversation? There are harrowing issues for women all over the world.

Imo- what is starting to happen is not advancing the “bigger than BC issue”, but perhaps is setting it back especially if any, or many of the women are discredited. For that I feel very sorry for the women who are truthful in this BC saga - and for other victims in other cases who are way out of the limelight.

The court of public opinion can be a fickle thing – the more watered down and unsubstantiated the claims become, it gets reduced to gossip – far, far away from advancing issues with power & integrity. –imo we are not having an Anita Hill moment of real change and awareness.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

If Cosby is being maligned, libeled and slandered by any or all of these women, he's surely free to sue any or all of them, one at a time.

Like those posters who refuse to believe the women who failed to file complaints in a timely manner, I refuse to believe that an innocent and vastly wealthy man would not take these women to court, one at a time, and ASAP.

You would have thought he would have done that immediately if truly innocent. I don't expect BC to bring any lawsuit against any of the accusers. That really would be opening up a can of worms he doesn't want opened. He would also be deposed in a civil lawsuit.

He will continue to do as he is doing which pretty much is the same tactic of any typical rapist who has been exposed. I am sure we have heard/read it all before either from the rapist themselves or their hired gun hot shot lawyer. Mission: Trash the victims.

BC thinks this will work but of course it will not.

1. The victims are liars.
2. Victims aren't perfect (shocker) and the rapist will try to throw as much dirt as they can thinking that will get the heat off of them and on to the victims.
3. It was consensual. (cough-cough)

All of his actions and demeanor really shows guilt, imo.

Instead of coming forth to the media and telling them he would be willing to take a lie detector test to prove his innocence he uses his wealth to hire a PI to dig up dirt on the victims and hires a lawyer to trash the victims. Its the old blame the 'victim' game of lets look how bad the victims are and forget how bad the rapist truly is.

What he fails to realize is women who have been raped often fall into a dysfunctional lifestyle. They can turn to drugs, alcohol, promiscuity or even crime. Especially those who have kept their secrets hidden inside for many years or decades and never received therapy for the rape or rapes they suffered. This is how many victims deal with the pain they feel. So all he is doing is showing what the rape did to these women's lives and how it caused much pain and suffering. This tactic is going to backfire on BC. Life as he once knew it is over.

Had there been maybe one or two alleging the same thing he may have been able to push that aside but when the numbers mount it is just not logical to think that all of these women are lying.

Frankly, I think BC has been a serial predator for decades. IMO.

If the lawsuits pile up he will settle just like he did in 2006.. He is never going to want all of the witnesses (victims) to come forward and testify on a witness stand. Victim testimony is considered evidence. Jurors will get very tired very quickly of a lawyer who tries to blame each and every victim that testifies. Like in the Sandusky case or the Priests cases.....victims in numbers gain great credibility and strength. And all of these women seem to be very clear and concise in telling what happened to them. They seem very credible and I think each of them would testify well in court. We aren't talking about vulnerable little children who can be swayed to testify one way or the other.

I don't blame any of them for suing and I hope they do. But even if they don't all sue then I hope by revealing the deep dark vile secret they have held inside for years will be a welcome release now that it is all out in the open. Mental health professionals say that the healing cant begin until the victim confronts their rapist and exposes them.

It is very common for rape victims to come forward after they are much older than they were when the rapes occurred. Imo, it is not about ruining BCs life. He did that himself. It is about exposing him and showing he isn't the person everyone thought he was. So he now knows that these victims are no longer going to keep his vile perverted secrets anymore. I am sure he thought after all of these years of silence from his many victims.... he was home free. But the thing about secrets is if more than one knows a secret it really isn't a secret and can come out at anytime even after many years have passed.

There are things far worse than going to prison. Now he has to live the rest of his life with people knowing what he has done. It is also said that a rapist will have many many victims before they become known as a serial rapist. I would think there are many more women/victims out there but some just don't have the courage to come forward especially after seeing how the victims have been excoriated by some on social media. It really shows why so few report rapes whether it is male or female victims.

 

[wendiesan]

I would use the term domestic violence if Cosby assaulted his wife and children but I'd prefer some other term for the alleged victims who were not in an intimate relationship or family relationship with him.

Respectfully snipped for focus.

Hey Donjeta.
Your sentence opened up a whole nuther can of worms. The word "rape" is used to describe the physical act of nonconsensual sexual intercourse but it has taken, and continues to take place, within different psychological, emotional and physical contexts. There are several different categories, each of which will undoubtedly contain subcategories, and some of which may overlap depending upon the perpetrator's/s' motivations and actions.

One out of three women and one out of six men will be raped in their lifetimes.

http://www.domesticabuseshelter.org/infosexualviolence.htm

Statistics have shown that 50% to 88% of rape victims know their perpetrators.

http://rapethetruevictim2010.weebly.com/types-of-rape.html

It's frightening to think that every one of us knows at least one person, or is a person, who has survived an attack that would fit into at least one of these categories. I'm just going to list some in alphabetical order.
Acquaintance Rape
Aggravated Rape
Anger Rape
Ceremonial Rape
Child Rape
Custodial Rape
Date Rape
Diminished Capacity Rape
Drug Facilitated Rape
Exchange Rape
Fraudulent Rape (Rape by Deception)
Gang Rape
Incapacitated Rape
Incest
Partner Rape
Power Rape
Prison Rape
Punitive Rape
Sadistic Rape
Spousal Rape
Statutory Rape
Status Rape
Stranger Rape
Theft Rape
Wartime Rape (Rape as Torture)

References:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Types_of_rape
https://www.rainn.org/get-information/types-of-sexual-assault
http://www.ualr.edu/jlfleming/Rapepg2.htm
http://www.healthyplace.com/abuse/rape/types-of-rape-the-different-forms-of-rape/
http://www.domesticabuseshelter.org/infosexualviolence.htm
http://rapethetruevictim2010.weebly.com/types-of-rape.html
http://en.hesperian.org/hhg/Where_Women_Have_No_Doctor:How_to_Avoid_Rape
http://www.yale.edu/consent/definitions.htm

 

[Leilei]

Wendiesan, that list makes me so sad

 

[kimi_SFC]

Thank you oceanblueeyes for so eloquently putting this all into words.

This isn't just a victim-friendly view of this case, it is a human one. I hope everyone who reads here takes a moment to truly digest what you're saying.

:moo:


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I know two women who were raped.

I know two men and one woman who confided in me that they were sexually abused as children.

That seems like quite a lot to me. Way too many for one person to know.

I also once held a job that required my accessing medical records involving minors who were victims of sex crimes. The sheer volume of cases shocked me. Also shocking was the fact that the vast majority involved little kids rather than older ones, for example a statutory rape of a teenage girl who thought she was simply going on a "date" with that older cute guy she'd met at the park.

My point being that these kinds of crimes are, according to my personal experience, much more prevalent than the average person might believe. Disgustingly and depressingly so.

The human species can really be repulsive at times.

 

[MyBelle]

RTBM: jumping off your post-

Beverley Johnson has said she is supporting Janice who I actually find more credible because she wanted to tell her story in 2006 +/- and because I believe her in her frustration and anger expressed about it in the Howard Stern interview in 2006 – gut reaction. On The View, when Beverley said she didn’t know if she was raped yet remembers in great detail the exchange with BC, and being shoved into a taxi - I felt doubt about her and the drugging piece – gut reaction.
http://abc.go.com/shows/the-view/video/pl5554876/vdka0_r1b7y9ub

Where things start to get really muddled for me is with Kathie Lee Gifford saying ‘Bill Cosby tried to kiss me’. I almost think she is team Cosby trying to water down the press with the absurdity at some other diminished end of the spectrum. Otherwise, she has very kind things to say about Cosby.
http://www.etonline.com/news/155251_kathie_lee_gifford_says_bill_cosby_tried_to_kiss_her/
http://www.people.com/article/kathie-lee-gifford-bill-cosby-sexual-abuse-allegations

LAPD won’t pursue criminal charges regarding Huth at PB Mansion in ‘74. I wonder if they are going to file a civil suit for 100 mil?
http://mashable.com/2014/12/16/los-angeles-cosby-no-charges/

If that doesn’t happen where does this thing go? -To the tabloid press? -More Dr. Phil? Maybe that is ok for some but I question, is that a good platform for the conversation? There are harrowing issues for women all over the world.

Imo- what is starting to happen is not advancing the “bigger than BC issue”, but perhaps is setting it back especially if any, or many of the women are discredited. For that I feel very sorry for the women who are truthful in this BC saga - and for other victims in other cases who are way out of the limelight.

The court of public opinion can be a fickle thing – the more watered down and unsubstantiated the claims become, it gets reduced to gossip – far, far away from advancing issues with power & integrity. –imo we are not having an Anita Hill moment of real change and awareness.

I totally agree. Well said.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I am really racking my brain here, so y'all help me out. Because I got nothing.

Just one example of someone who profited from a rape accusation later proven false?

Think. Think. Think. Nothing. :thinking:

 

[IzzyBlanche]

And that is how it is done....:sick:

Yep, nuts and . No factual contradictory evidence (such as he wasn't even in that place on that date) being presented.

Throw feces at the victims and hope some of it sticks. That's the strategy. And it is very sickening.

ETA: I hope at the very least this strategy opens people's eyes to the fact that he is not the kindly and compassionate "America's Dad" he has sought to portray himself as. Far from it.

 

[wendiesan]

I know two women who were raped. I know two men and one woman who confided in me that they were sexually abused as children. That seems like quite a lot to me. Way too many for one person to know. I also once held a job that required my accessing medical records involving minors who were victims of sex crimes. The sheer volume of cases shocked me. Also shocking was the fact that the vast majority involved little kids rather than older ones, for example a statutory rape of a teenage girl who thought she was simply going on a "date" with that older cute guy she'd met at the park. My point being that these kinds of crimes are, according to my personal experience, much more prevalent than the average person might believe. Disgustingly and depressingly so. The human species can really be repulsive at times.

My Bolds

By the Numbers:
44% of victims are under age 18
80% are under age 30
68% of sexual assaults are not reported to LE
98% of rapists will never spend a day in jail

Statics from Rape, Abuse & Incest National Network (https://www.rainn.org/statistics)

I think these stats support your personal experience.
The under-reporting of rape back in the day may have something to do with the image we have of a "typical" rape and the lack of language that would address what a person experienced. How do you report something if you haven't got a word to use?
The book I Never Called It Rape: The Ms. Report on Recognizing, Fighting and Surviving Date and Acquaintance Rape * by Robin Warshaw was first published in 1988. It was based on the Ms. Magazine Campus Project on Sexual Assault and derives its title from a statistic gleaned by the study: 27% of women whose sexual assault met the criteria of rape DID NOT identify their experience as rape.

Dan Savage in his Jan. 8, 2009 column, Savage Love, in The Stranger responded to a writer who had to ask if the assault perpetrated on her by her ex-boyfriend was, in fact, rape. IMO, Savage's response could not have been more clear, but the writer's dilemma and the response of her current partner give, I think, a good description of what many people face if they reveal the circumstances of a sexual assault.

Understand that you were raped, DREAD—date-ish raped, acquaintance-ish raped, gray-area-ish raped, blurry-booze-soaked-lines raped, and raped under circumstances that would make bringing charges a futile exercise. But raped. Your ex kept coming at you, and you were paralyzed by a set of inhibitions—a desire to avoid confrontation at all costs (even the cost of your own violation), a desire to avoid making your victimizer feel bad—that are pounded into the heads of girls and young women. Your ex exploited this vulnerability. Your ex may not think he raped you since you finally "let him," and perhaps he interprets that as consent and so, distressingly, does your boyfriend. But raped you were.

**

It's very sad.

*Warshaw, R. (1994). I Never Called It Rape (Harper Perennial ed.). New York: HarperPerennial. p. 11. ISBN 978-0-06-092572-7.
** To read the letter and the complete response: http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/SavageLove?oid=936054

 

[SStarr33]

My Bolds

By the Numbers:
44% of victims are under age 18
80% are under age 30
68% of sexual assaults are not reported to LE
98% of rapists will never spend a day in jail

Statics from Rape, Abuse & Incest National Network (https://www.rainn.org/statistics)

I think these stats support your personal experience.
The under-reporting of rape back in the day may have something to do with the image we have of a "typical" rape and the lack of language that would address what a person experienced. How do you report something if you haven't got a word to use?
The book I Never Called It Rape: The Ms. Report on Recognizing, Fighting and Surviving Date and Acquaintance Rape * by Robin Warshaw was first published in 1988. It was based on the Ms. Magazine Campus Project on Sexual Assault and derives its title from a statistic gleaned by the study: 27% of women whose sexual assault met the criteria of rape DID NOT identify their experience as rape.

Dan Savage in his Jan. 8, 2009 column, Savage Love, in The Stranger responded to a writer who had to ask if the assault perpetrated on her by her ex-boyfriend was, in fact, rape. IMO, Savage's response could not have been more clear, but the writer's dilemma and the response of her current partner give, I think, a good description of what many people face if they reveal the circumstances of a sexual assault.

**

It's very sad.

*Warshaw, R. (1994). I Never Called It Rape (Harper Perennial ed.). New York: HarperPerennial. p. 11. ISBN 978-0-06-092572-7.
** To read the letter and the complete response: http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/SavageLove?oid=936054

I thought I posted this already, but I must not have hit post before I fell asleep last night.

Is the Dan Savage you quoted Typhoid Dan who went around licking doorknobs and computer keyboards to try to get people sick?

Dan's own words:

“I go around the room licking doorknobs. They are filthy, no doubt, but there isn’t time to find a rag to spit on. If for some reason I don’t manage to get a pen from my mouth to Gary’s hands at the conference, I want to seed his office with germs, get as many of his people sick as I can, and hopefully one of them will infect the candidate. I lick office doorknobs, bathroom doorknobs. When that’s done, I start on the staplers, phones, and computer keyboards. Then I stand in the kitchen and lick the rims of all the clean coffee cups drying in the rack. I grab my coat and head out.”

http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/germ-warfare/Content?oid=3092

He is evil incarnate IMO--not anyone I would quote as an authority on anything except how to be a horrible human being.

 

[nrdsb4]

I thought I posted this already, but I must not have hit post before I fell asleep last night.

Is the Dan Savage you quoted Typhoid Dan who went around licking doorknobs and computer keyboards to try to get people sick?

Dan's own words:

“I go around the room licking doorknobs. They are filthy, no doubt, but there isn’t time to find a rag to spit on. If for some reason I don’t manage to get a pen from my mouth to Gary’s hands at the conference, I want to seed his office with germs, get as many of his people sick as I can, and hopefully one of them will infect the candidate. I lick office doorknobs, bathroom doorknobs. When that’s done, I start on the staplers, phones, and computer keyboards. Then I stand in the kitchen and lick the rims of all the clean coffee cups drying in the rack. I grab my coat and head out.”

http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/germ-warfare/Content?oid=3092

He is evil incarnate IMO--not anyone I would quote as an authority on anything except how to be a horrible human being.

Not only despicable, but really REALLY bizarro.:sick:

 

[Donjeta]

That is bizarre (and stupid-- he could himself have gotten more bugs from the doorknobs and keyboards than he left there...)
Nevertheless, I agree with the rape quote.

People do not need to be beaten black and blue to qualify as raped, sometimes it happens in more ambiguous circumstances where the perp may rationalize it as "she said no but she wanted it anyway" and the victim blames herself for not fighting hard enough. Even so it's a sexual assault and a social problem when excuses are made for the aggressor but the victim gets blamed.

JMO.

 

[Donjeta]

Not sure if this was posted yet.

Cosby Team’s Strategy: Hush Accusers, Insult Them, Blame the Media

By LORNE MANLY and GRAHAM BOWLEYDEC. 28, 2014

An examination of how the team has dealt with scandals over the past two decades and into this fall reveals an organized and expensive effort that involved quashing accusations as they emerged while raising questions about the accusers’ character and motives, both publicly and surreptitiously. And the team has never been shy about blasting the news media for engaging in a feeding frenzy even as the team made deals or slipped the news organizations information that would cast Mr. Cosby’s accusers in a negative light.

Playing hardball with people who make (and report on) incendiary claims is hardly a new tactic in the celebrity world. But given the volume and severity of the recent charges, with numerous women saying Mr. Cosby drugged and then sexually assaulted them, some legal and public relations practitioners question the wisdom of continuing to counterpunch.

“Sometimes in a case like this, less can be more,” said Benjamin Brafman, a criminal defense lawyer who represented Dominique Strauss-Kahn. “Attacking someone who is perceived to be a ‘victim’ can often be unproductive.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/29/a...ccusers-insult-them-blame-the-media.html?_r=0

 

[wendiesan]

I thought I posted this already, but I must not have hit post before I fell asleep last night. Is the Dan Savage you quoted Typhoid Dan who went around licking doorknobs and computer keyboards to try to get people sick?
Dan's own words:“I go around the room licking doorknobs. They are filthy, no doubt, but there isn’t time to find a rag to spit on. If for some reason I don’t manage to get a pen from my mouth to Gary’s hands at the conference, I want to seed his office with germs, get as many of his people sick as I can, and hopefully one of them will infect the candidate. I lick office doorknobs, bathroom doorknobs. When that’s done, I start on the staplers, phones, and computer keyboards. Then I stand in the kitchen and lick the rims of all the clean coffee cups drying in the rack. I grab my coat and head out.”http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/germ-warfare/Content?oid=3092

He is evil incarnate IMO--not anyone I would quote as an authority on anything except how to be a horrible human being.

Ah, yes. Dan Savage did write that satirical piece about licking doorknobs in 2000. He is a gay rights, and a human rights, advocate who began the "It Gets Better" campaign. He is certainly a controversial figure and has, like every human being, said or written things for which he had to apologize later. His writing style is brash and no nonsense, IMO, and he has no problem bringing in experts to help him respond to those who send him their questions. I disagree with your point of view, and don't think he's evil. You are welcome to take your sex advice from anyone you choose.

 

[BirdycatNY]

Pulling Back The Curtain On Bill Cosby’s Dirty PR Game
http://thinkprogress.org/culture/2014/12/29/3607159/bill-cosby-private-investigators-report/
by Emily Atkin Posted on December 29, 2014 at 11:03 am, Updated: December 29, 2014 at 12:25 pm

"Cosby did settle a lawsuit in 2006 filed by one of his accusers out of court. The terms of the settlement remain confidential."

Here is another article from today, not sure if it's been posted. I don't think Constand publicly discussed this case, maybe part of confidential terms? I don't know, feel free to correct if she has publicly talked. It would be interesting though if there are other confidential settlement(s) that never made it to court, but less formal arrangement and confidential to the extent that only a few know of such arrangement(s) existence (hypothetically speaking of course).
***

Here is another article from today, not sure if posted yet:
How Bill Cosby's team of high-profile lawyers and media experts silenced rape rumors for decades by threatening accusers and playing hardball with the press
By Ashley Collman for MailOnline
Published: 11:30 EST, 29 December 2014 | Updated: 13:35 EST, 29 December 2014

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...eatening-accusers-playing-hardball-press.html

 

[ontheclock]

As if the initial rape wasn't bad enough. Just adding insult to injury, imo. Well, BC, show the world how you respond, show us what youre all about. Denigrate your victims. Makes me think less of you even more so.