Retrial for Sentencing of Jodi Arias - Day 33

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  • #1,081
This is what I have on juror questions for Geff--in case anyone wants to compare and contrast...

1. Are other incarcerated individuals included in norms tests? RG: usually they are not in the norms tests. Some tests look at the MMPI with incarcerated individuals. The general norms group would not include inmates.
2. Many tests were administered many years after incarceration. How accurate are the test results? RG: That's a good question. If looking at overall pattern of functioning, it wouldn't matter as much--those are general tests. I'm looking for consistency. In an ideal situation, we would have had testing before and after incarceration. A diagnostic impression is almost all inference.
3. Depression, anxiety and PTSD would manifest in jail. How can you tell the occurred before? RG: Yes, they can occur in jail. But based on history and people who knew her, there was depression. Darryl says there was a sadness at times. Personality tests look at a person throughout their lives. The say of the death caused a traumatic reaction. The question is whether there was anything else. RG lists other factors of prior abuse that validate these before the murder.
4. How likely is it that JA intentionally scored low on aggressiveness knowing these results would be shown in court? RG: There are a lot of questions that go into each scale. Can someone take one scale and figure out which questions apply to? It is unlikely. She was administered 28 validity scales from all sorts of tests including malingering. What are the odds she can make the validity the same? Unlikely.
5. About TA masturbating to pictures of male child, other than the verbal allegation reported far later, is there any other corroboration in the record? RG: I don't believe so but there is some "indirect corroboration"--like witness #1. There is no direct corroboration.
6. Do you find it odd that someone who journals like she did would not have some reference to the incident? RG: I can't say it's typical or not how someone writes in a journal... There's the issue of dissociation too.
7. I understand the cycle of abuse. How is she choosing to continue contact considering the emotional abuse? RG: That's the problem. With DV victims, there's this hope for change that it won't happen again. There's also the learned helplessness where you don't see a way out.
8. Do the records show that other significant things were happening that were not being written about? RG: The journals are not a blow by blow of every day. There were lots of details that were not in the journal. Can't recall any major significant events in her journal. It's really her perception of significant.
9. Were the IM messages from 12/07 where he is calling her pure evil in the journal? RG: I don't recall right now but I don't recall it being in the journal. In Jan. 08, she starts saying some things.
10. Did JA know that TA was seeing Lisa Andrews when he proposed again in January? RG: I don't think it was January. I don't remember when. She was pulling away in January.
11. In your interviews with JA did you ask why she uses T-dogg sometime and Travis other times? RG: Yes, T-dogg was the more macho man; the sexual part of him.
12.Who was the intended recipient of the coded magazines? RG: I have no idea. A friend or something.
13. Is JA's PTSD centered more on her relationship with TA or her past? RG: It's all tied up. A child victim is at greater risk of being victim of DV later in life. Vulnerability.
14. Did you find anywhere in the info supporting documentation that there was a physical altercation on 1/22/08 or is it only from JA? RG: It came from JA. The only thing we know is the apology after.
15. Is it your opinion that DV/physical abuse took place? Yes
16. Why do you think that in May 2008, she writes as if she is stronger and wants to move on but in reality is doing the opposite? RG: It's part of being sucked back in. She still has strong feelings for him.
17. It may seem to the lay person that the scores on the objective tests are the result of committing the murder. Are there indicators to determine if symptoms were present prior to the murder? RG: The only thing is history (what other people say) and journals/writings. If there was no other history of abuse, then I'd be confident saying it this incident alone.
18. On 12/18/14, a witness explained that TA yelling was powerful enough for JA to write about it. Can you explain why she would write in her journal about the yelling despite the Law of Attraction but not other abuse? RG: Writing was only toward the end.
19. Wouldn't the writings of suicide also violate the Laws of Attraction? RG: I didn't ask her that. I would view it as negative.
20. Did the incidents in the journal really happen? Any other evidence? RG: No, not really. We had some people saying she was different and something caused it. Matt saw bruises and he told her to get a restraining order but she said she was moving in two days.
21. Are there entries in JA's journal after the murder? RG: Yes.
22. What do they say about her state of mind? RG: It's pretty mixed--a lot of emotion and discussing the relationship they had.
23. Is it typical of a heterosexual man to view 🤬🤬🤬🤬 including child 🤬🤬🤬🤬 of both genders? RG: There are people attracted to kids. Then there are qualifiers--some prefer children. Some are only attracted to children. Then there are those attracted to both genders and those with a gender-specific attraction. There are some offenders who are married and having sex with children.
24. Was JA right or left handed IIRC was the ?: RG: JA is left handed.
25. Did TA ever talk to JA about attraction to children before the masturbation incident? RG: After. He also told her he was sexually abused.
26. Do you find it surprising she would have sex with him after this incident? RG: I would like to think I'm surprised but after 30 years not much surprises me. In her view, if he's having sex with her.
27. Did JA ever admit ????
28. How many days did the 1st female psych interview her? RG: 2 days
29. Were notes were handwritten or typed? Both but now RG says the April 29 was not.
30. How long can someone stay in a dissociated state? RG: Depends on the person. Can be a very long time and not know what you're doing. Some are brief--day dreaming.
31. Do people still functioning normally during dissociative times? RG: Could be. Some traumas can be blocked out and you go on day to day. Could affect one in other ways--nightmares, body reacts to a trigger,
32. How do you discriminate between the two DAPS tests where she answers about before and after the murder? RG: The only thing we do is ask her to go back in time then how the events are affecting her now.

Thank you!!! They were great questions then, a better witness now, and the same jury asking questions today. Definitely ok, imo.
 
  • #1,082
This is something that has really alarmed me since I came to WS. I had no idea so many people believed that judges could throw out testimony if it is just a bunch of obvious lies. I've got to figure out something to add to my closing arguments to let the jury know this is not true.



The AZ Supreme Court has ruled that defendants have to be able to make the "youth" argument if they were under 30 at the time of the crime. :)



Her secret testimony has been challenged like crazy. That's what Juan's been doing this whole time.



I wish the tweeters had told us if JM asked for any particular instruction in that regard. Personally, I don't like to leave jurors in the dark either, because they tend to make up (incorrect) explanations on their own. But I'm not sure what she should have said. Maybe "Ms. Arias has chosen not to continue her testimony on the witness stand. You may consider what she said as allocution [explain allocution], however."

Maybe you don't deal with juries a lot (at least not any more). Do/Did you always try to interview jurors afterward no matter how it turned out? From the way you talk here, I guess you were almost equally amazed at their out of the blue reasoning whether you won or lost. :)
 
  • #1,083
It sounded like there were two biggies. One was over this expert witness who flipped to the state. The other was over the prosecutor telling the jury that the board that controls pardons could overturn a LWOP verdict. It seems interesting.

I wonder if during closing the DT will try to make the case that under current AZ law, LWP is the same as LWOP so no matter what happens if they vote down death she will never walk the streets again. That seems like a highly improper argument, but I wouldn't put it past them to try to sneak that in just in case there is a juror who'd tend to vote for death as the only way to keep her locked up for sure.

There is nothing to guarantee anyone can be locked up forever no matter what. Verdicts or sentences can be overturned, governors can issue pardons, laws can change, etc.

Last time, IIRC, the defense said that there would be no parole based on current AZ law. JM, in trying to explain that there might be some possibility of parole in the future IF the parole board were resurrected, IMO accidentally suggested (by talking too fast lol) that Jodi would be ENTITLED to a parole hearing in the future if she got LWP, even if no parole board existed at that time. I was concerned about it, because the transcript contained an incorrect statement of the law from him (IMO she would not be entitled to a parole hearing even if she got LWP, UNLESS the parole board had been resurrected in the meantime). So I was sort of glad he got a do-over on this phase.
 
  • #1,084
Secret testimony challenged?? Jodi Arias was allowed free reign in a court of law to spew whatever garbage she pleased. Unchallenged. Not questioned at all about her statements. No cross exam. No explaination about why she was doing this. No instructions given about why JM didn't ask a single question. It's just not good enough to say that oooopsy! Sherry screwed up. Nothing can be done. Oh well.....figure something out, Juan. Fix this mess the judge made. Get over yourselves, Alexander family and taxpayers. This is all about Jodi and to hello with Travis Alexander. Truly amazed.
 
  • #1,085
Maybe you don't deal with juries a lot (at least not any more). Do/Did you always try to interview jurors afterward no matter how it turned out? From the way you talk here, I guess you were almost equally amazed at their out of the blue reasoning whether you won or lost. :)

I do jury trials still. I always ask to interview them, and a majority of jurors agree to be interviewed. And yes, the "group" reasoning whether I win or lose never makes any sense in light of the jury instructions. :)
 
  • #1,086
Secret testimony challenged?? Jodi Arias was allowed free reign in a court of law to spew whatever garbage she pleased. Unchallenged. Not questioned at all about her statements. No cross exam. No explaination about why she was doing this. No instructions given about why JM didn't ask a single question. It's just not good enough to say that oooopsy! Sherry screwed up. Nothing can be done. Oh well.....figure something out, Juan. Fix this mess the judge made. Get over yourselves, Alexander family and taxpayers. This is all about Jodi and to hello with Travis Alexander. Truly amazed.

The reason JM did not ask for JSS to strike JA's testimony is because he wanted to challenge it. He challenged it through his witnesses and exhibits, and I promise he will challenge it in his closing argument as well. This is why people tweeted that he "gleefully" responded to JSS that he did not want to strike her testimony. :) IMO Juan's opinion is, the more JA talks, the more ammo he has.
 
  • #1,087
Last time, IIRC, the defense said that there would be no parole based on current AZ law. JM, in trying to explain that there might be some possibility of parole in the future IF the parole board were resurrected, IMO accidentally suggested (by talking too fast lol) that Jodi would be ENTITLED to a parole hearing in the future if she got LWP, even if no parole board existed at that time. I was concerned about it, because the transcript contained an incorrect statement of the law from him (IMO she would not be entitled to a parole hearing even if she got LWP, UNLESS the parole board had been resurrected in the meantime). So I was sort of glad he got a do-over on this phase.

I well remember that whole kerfluffle and your concern. From reading I've done since, the DT's concern was quite valid. Juries are far more likely to vote DP if they think it's possible a dangerous defendant could be released on parole later on.
 
  • #1,088
I believe there is a juror who has, at least somewhat, determined that JA suffered from abuse (and then some). So, the question becomes does this person or persons believe that this abuse is a mitigating factor in sentencing her.

Oh God I hope not. Dr. D personally interviewed Jodi and some relatives who all said no abuse ever occurred. Her journal entries would support that. As opposed to the defense witnesses who only took Jodi's word that there was abuse throughout her poor, unfortunate life. Plus, the nameless, faceless affidavit witness's testimony was thoroughly discredited, as was every insinuation and implication made by Nurmi. How ANYone can believe there was ANY abuse, ANYwhere, by anyONE in Jodi's life is a mystery to me.

And the abuse and pr0n claims have been completely shot down. They should be a non-factor for the jury. And re: BPD... there wasn't a pattern that Jodi slaughtered every boyfriend she felt cheated on her, so she knew right from wrong and BPD shouldn't be used or considered as a mitigating factor for JA. That's the way I see it anyway. These jury questions seemed to have rattled me a little bit, although to my credit I'm not shaking like a Chihuahua. Yipe!

I agree. And I think all this 🤬🤬🤬🤬, master bating etc has taken away from the key thing in this trial, THE PREMEDITATED MURDER

I would expect Juan to bring the murder clearly into focus for the jury in his closing.
 
  • #1,089
This is something that has really alarmed me since I came to WS. I had no idea so many people believed that judges could throw out testimony if it is just a bunch of obvious lies. I've got to figure out something to add to my closing arguments to let the jury know this is not true.



The AZ Supreme Court has ruled that defendants have to be able to make the "youth" argument if they were under 30 at the time of the crime. :)



Her secret testimony has been challenged like crazy. That's what Juan's been doing this whole time.



I wish the tweeters had told us if JM asked for any particular instruction in that regard. Personally, I don't like to leave jurors in the dark either, because they tend to make up (incorrect) explanations on their own. But I'm not sure what she should have said. Maybe "Ms. Arias has chosen not to continue her testimony on the witness stand. You may consider what she said as allocution [explain allocution], however."

BBM 1 ~ I know hey! A Judge can't argue, only lawyers can.

BBM 2 ~ Maybe that is why JSS spoke to them individually at the end today?
 
  • #1,090
Last time, IIRC, the defense said that there would be no parole based on current AZ law. JM, in trying to explain that there might be some possibility of parole in the future IF the parole board were resurrected, IMO accidentally suggested (by talking too fast lol) that Jodi would be ENTITLED to a parole hearing in the future if she got LWP, even if no parole board existed at that time. I was concerned about it, because the transcript contained an incorrect statement of the law from him (IMO she would not be entitled to a parole hearing even if she got LWP, UNLESS the parole board had been resurrected in the meantime). So I was sort of glad he got a do-over on this phase.

I remember that. Do you think it made a difference that after Willmott's objection Juan was sort of able to correct himself by saying "the defense is right, there's no procedure NOW but there could be in 25 years"?
 
  • #1,091
  • #1,092
BBM 1 ~ I know hey! A Judge can't argue, only lawyers can.

BBM 2 ~ Maybe that is why JSS spoke to them individually at the end today?

No, any instructions would be given to the jury as a whole.

I remember that. Do you think it made a difference that after Willmott's objection Juan was sort of able to correct himself by saying "the defense is right, there's no procedure NOW but there could be in 25 years"?

Yes, but that's when I think he said something like "once she was vested" she would have a right to a hearing--and I think he MEANT that this "vested" right would happen if and when a parole board came back into existence, but because of the words he said just before and after it sounded like she would be "vested" just by getting the sentence of LWP.
 
  • #1,093
I don't think this has anything to do with Nurmi's job on Demarte. This person has already made up their mind. This person asks many questions of this nature of every single witness.

If this person is a pro-lifer, I could only hope he/she is on the outside looking in as an alternate. Damn... Wing Ding sad now.
 
  • #1,094
The reason JM did not ask for JSS to strike JA's testimony is because he wanted to challenge it. He challenged it through his witnesses and exhibits, and I promise he will challenge it in his closing argument as well. This is why people tweeted that he "gleefully" responded to JSS that he did not want to strike her testimony. :) IMO Juan's opinion is, the more JA talks, the more ammo he has.

As I said, I'm amazed that what happened, that this judge allowed, is treated so casually. But....whatever....supposedly, the jury is left to figure out that JM is "challenging", gleefully, that which was done unconstitutionally. And, that is perfectly ok and normal? Sad
 
  • #1,095
No, any instructions would be given to the jury as a whole.



Yes, but that's when I think he said something like "once she was vested" she would have a right to a hearing--and I think he MEANT that this "vested" right would happen if and when a parole board came back into existence, but because of the words he said just before and after it sounded like she would be "vested" just by getting the sentence of LWP.

Makes sense. In some ways the hung jury was a bit of a blessing. Hopefully Juan doesn't make the same mistake though.
 
  • #1,096
Oh God I hope not. Dr. D personally interviewed Jodi and some relatives who all said no abuse ever occurred. Her journal entries would support that. As opposed to the defense witnesses who only took Jodi's word that there was abuse throughout her poor, unfortunate life. Plus, the nameless, faceless affidavit witness's testimony was thoroughly discredited, as was every insinuation and implication made by Nurmi. How ANYone can believe there was ANY abuse, ANYwhere, by anyONE in Jodi's life is a mystery to me.

And the abuse and pr0n claims have been completely shot down. They should be a non-factor for the jury. And re: BPD... there wasn't a pattern that Jodi slaughtered every boyfriend she felt cheated on her, so she knew right from wrong and BPD shouldn't be used or considered as a mitigating factor for JA. That's the way I see it anyway. These jury questions seemed to have rattled me a little bit, although to my credit I'm not shaking like a Chihuahua. Yipe!



I would expect Juan to bring the murder clearly into focus for the jury in his closing.

BBM ~ Didn't her brother write an affidavit about abuse in the Arias household?

IMO, JA was not abused as a child. She rebelled in her teens by smoking weed and hanging out with "bad boys". Anyways, "abuse" is such a loose term.
 
  • #1,097
Absolutely agree with everything. I wonder if Nurmi and Willmott realize, or even care at this point, that as a Ph.D. in psychology, Dr. DeMarte has (despite what they keep trying to refute) years of training and experience dealing with potentially very difficult people. It's kind of what she does for a living. Do they really think they're going to win a war of words with her? Ain't gonna happen. I wonder if she's thinking, "Do you want to spar with the Expert Witness?" She sometimes has that look on her face. Other times she looks like she's thinking, "Bring it."

With her directness on the BPD diagnosis no matter who questions her, it's obvious Demarte is not a hired gun. It's evidently been JM's strategy to emphasize that she's not. The jury is going to know that all the DT experts, by contrast, are hired guns, because they now very obviously were biased in their findings. JM impeached Karp, Samuels, Geff, Fonseca, and ALV all in one day. BOOM! He got DT to impeach them all for him!
 
  • #1,098
Troy Hayden ‏@troyhaydenfox10 3h3 hours ago

#JodiArias in crt today. Judge wants to meet individually with jurors in chambers. Reason?. No end in sight for case.

:gaah:
 
  • #1,099
The transportation is all indoors. There is a bridge/tunnel system from the jail to the criminal court.

I thought Estrella was in the country somewhere? It looked like it from photos/news videos. But there's a downtown jail too, right? Jodi lives there for the duration of the trial? It's coed, right: no wonder this trial is taking so long.
 
  • #1,100
I think some part of me fantasized the jury wouldn't need to ask questions, that they would all rise as one and give her a standing ovation. Or that their questions would be so snarky and derisive that we couldn't mistake their contempt and anger for JA and her lies.

Back to earth. They were responsible questions, IMO, and indicative of a jury that is paying attention and trying to get it right. DM did an outstanding job. She and JM revealed the truth about who JA is, and demolished every one of her foul lies about Travis.

Good enough for me.
 
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