Retrieving wreckage from AirAsia Flight To Singapore- no survivors recovered #3

[Bravo]

Glad your back CARIIS I was worried.

 

[trigger]

Well at least they are going to keep looking for victims. At least until the 7 day operation review. Even then they should keep looking.

I've only flown a handful of times.. And I was petrified. All times were after 9/11. The very first time I stepped foot on a plane, it was one of those small planes that only had 2 rows of seats on each side. Then I flew across the country (home, then to and fro). Once I'm in the air I'm okay but take off and landing were so stressful. If I ever choose to return to Ca (in Fl now), I'm driving. I have such bad anxiety about flying.

I mainly just pray that those families can grieve properly and find some send of closure.

I do not fly anymore, I'm to afraid. Yup, I was on a small plane also, I told my DD it reminded me of Sky King. Lol

CNN had a re-enactment of what happen to the plane. Hopefully the family will get answers soon.

 

[PrairieWind]

I will have to see if I can find that CNN re-enactment, trigger. That would be interesting. Was it based off of information from the flight recorders?

 

[raisincharlie]

I hesitated on posting that video but watching it was a wake up call on how they are bringing up the plane & finding the people's bodies, too sad they film this stuff, smh. Please flag it if you think it should be removed. Once is enough to watch it. Watching the belt/strap snapping was horrendous. It's a plane with loved ones in it. smh fgs

8:10 PM - 26 Jan 2015 · Details
Tweet text
Reply to @btsjeongkook97

Translated from Indonesian by Bing
J0430yes: #OpenFollow Steering QZ8501 Damaged, Air Asia's Answer To This http://bit.ly/1H2UXqo #TeamFollowBack

View attachment 68285


(yay, I have the translation button back on twitter!)

Thanks for the video, I think. I find myself wondering what they were actually thinking by employing the method demonstrated. How could one seriously think for a minute how the fuselage could be brought on board by dragging it over the stern of the boat - seriously. Do they not know what a crane with elevation capabilities is or were they just too hurried ? Seems to me this method resulted in more damage and may have likely led to the loss of any victims that may have been inside the wreckage. I get the very distinct impression, they really are incredibly inexperienced in under sea salvage and find this bordering on the ridiculous. Prayers for the victims and their surviving family members and friends. Very sad.

 

[SouthAussie]

Why did the experienced pilot not take back control (?) of the plane when it started ascending at a rapid rate? Would it have been the g-forces or something that did not allow him to get near the controls again?

I remember seeing an Air Crash Investigations episode once where that happened - the pilot could physically not get to the controls due to the angle/forces so the co-pilot was left hanging onto a shuddering steering wheel and manning the few controls that he could reach from there.

 

[MsFacetious]

Thanks for the video, I think. I find myself wondering what they were actually thinking by employing the method demonstrated. How could one seriously think for a minute how the fuselage could be brought on board by dragging it over the stern of the boat - seriously. Do they not know what a crane with elevation capabilities is or were they just too hurried ? Seems to me this method resulted in more damage and may have likely led to the loss of any victims that may have been inside the wreckage. I get the very distinct impression, they really are incredibly inexperienced in under sea salvage and find this bordering on the ridiculous. Prayers for the victims and their surviving family members and friends. Very sad.

That's how they pulled up the tail. It worked so well then...

 

[MsFacetious]

Why did the experienced pilot not take back control (?) of the plane when it started ascending at a rapid rate? Would it have been the g-forces or something that did not allow him to get near the controls again?

I remember seeing an Air Crash Investigations episode once where that happened - the pilot could physically not get to the controls due to the angle/forces so the co-pilot was left hanging onto a shuddering steering wheel and manning the few controls that he could reach from there.

That is certainly possible.
There have also been a couple where the pilot was in the lavatory or something.
That could have been the case here.

 

[raisincharlie]

That's how they pulled up the tail. It worked so well then...

Yeah I know, I was no less appalled by that fiasco.

 

[SouthAussie]

The plane was veering left and wobbling, said Ertata Lanang Galih, a senior pilot and investigator with the committee. QZ8501 then ascended to 37,400 feet in about 30 seconds in a steep ascent ....

The stall warnings -- which blare the words "Stall, Stall" -- went on as the plane started the steep climb and continued until it crashed, according to information on the flight data recorder.

The voice warning doesn't always mean the aircraft has stalled, said Mardjono. The warning can be triggered when the angle of attack, which is the angle at which the wing tackles the oncoming wind, hits 8 degrees.

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/01/29/asia/airasia-disaster/


And they seem to have found two more people.

"Authorities have recovered 72 bodies from the sea, with 90 still unaccounted for, according to AirAsia."

 

[SouthAussie]

The flight-data recorder indicates the first officer's control stick pulled the plane's nose up, sources in the investigation team told Wall Street Journal.

However, the sequence of events or why the climb was initiated are not clear.

Confusion caused the nose of the Airbus A320 to point upward at an unusually steep angle while the plane's computerised stall-protection systems either malfunctioned or were disengaged, say investigators.

Repeated automated stall warnings have been noted on the cockpit voice recorder.

While air turbulence is suspected to be the reason behind the plane's steep climb, investigators are examining the interaction of pilot commands and computer-controlled flight systems during the climb and descent.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/airasia-qz...en-plane-took-steep-climb-say-reports-1485660

 

[CARIIS]

Why did the experienced pilot not take back control (?) of the plane when it started ascending at a rapid rate? Would it have been the g-forces or something that did not allow him to get near the controls again?

I remember seeing an Air Crash Investigations episode once where that happened - the pilot could physically not get to the controls due to the angle/forces so the co-pilot was left hanging onto a shuddering steering wheel and manning the few controls that he could reach from there.

believe it or not, it is very rare for the capt to take control back during an emergency - both are in their roles, one flying one doing the scanning and callouts, transitions take precious seconds and in emergency both are intently in the role they were in before the string of events lined up to form the disaster

In AF the capt stayed in the jump seat the enitre time, the cockpit voice reocrder indicates a L O N G intereaction between the three of them wherein the PF (Pilot flying) more than once clearly stated that he had no idea what was going, what he was doing, what was happeningl what the plane was doing. After minutes of this the other guy finally took it but the the other pilot never stropped pulling the nose up

the capt tho never attempted to change anything !

 

[CARIIS]

Hi Bravo,

a rought couple of weeks, had to say goodbye to baby after 23 years. I TY! Several fellow ws were wonderful during the ordeal and I thank each of you

 

[CARIIS]

I do not fly anymore, I'm to afraid. Yup, I was on a small plane also, I told my DD it reminded me of Sky King. Lol

CNN had a re-enactment of what happen to the plane. Hopefully the family will get answers soon.

thanx for all

 

[PrairieWind]

Thats right CARIIS. In AF447, the problem was that the pilots didn't understand what was happening, and just got confused. And the one pilot didn't realize that the other was pulling back on the control the whole time. I don't think it was every clear why that pilot was pulling back when he when he should have been pushing it forward or level. But once he pulled it back, my understanding is that it overruled the other pilot's joystick. In a Boeing aircraft, they still use the wheel/yoke style control, so its obvious to each pilot what actions the other is taking.

 

[CARIIS]

If accurate the first 8 seconds are amazing shot of the fueelage on the ocean floor - but I dont see Air Asia markings?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fzPXUqfl_mg

do you guys think this is Air Aisa?

 

[Bravo]

Hi Bravo,

a rought couple of weeks, had to say goodbye to baby after 23 years. I TY! Several fellow ws were wonderful during the ordeal and I thank each of you

Yes I figured that's what it was. Condolences and a big cyber hug. I'm sure it was a very rough time. Glad your back and resuming some normalcy. Your furbaby would want that.

 

[emirates1957]

I was just talking to one f our Captains. He said that if they were in an emergency situation and the FO was showing he was competent and in control ....he would not take over. However if the FO was pulling the AC nose up beyond its limitations he would definately be taking over. Still will be interesting to get the full transcript. Once again thanks again for all the media information.

 

[raisincharlie]

Thats right CARIIS. In AF447, the problem was that the pilots didn't understand what was happening, and just got confused. And the one pilot didn't realize that the other was pulling back on the control the whole time. I don't think it was every clear why that pilot was pulling back when he when he should have been pushing it forward or level. But once he pulled it back, my understanding is that it overruled the other pilot's joystick. In a Boeing aircraft, they still use the wheel/yoke style control, so its obvious to each pilot what actions the other is taking.

It is unclear to me what true effect the co-pilot pulling the stick back would have on this Air Bus craft given it is fly by wire and difficult to override the computer systems. That is the thought process behind the fly by wire, to prevent a pilot from executing a maneuver outside of the performance capability of the craft. Just to my way of thinking this smells somewhat of BS. Perhaps emirates can explain this interaction, perhaps he has and I just missed it, but it just seems to me with my limited knowledge of the computer systems that pulling the stick back would have no effect or minimal effect if the computer flight system is operational. Then again maybe I'm just weary of the craziness expressed by the officials overseeing the recovery of victims and the air craft.

 

[sherlockh]

Why did the experienced pilot not take back control (?) of the plane when it started ascending at a rapid rate? Would it have been the g-forces or something that did not allow him to get near the controls again?

I remember seeing an Air Crash Investigations episode once where that happened - the pilot could physically not get to the controls due to the angle/forces so the co-pilot was left hanging onto a shuddering steering wheel and manning the few controls that he could reach from there.

Captain Iriyanto, 53, an Indonesia air force veteran with about 20,000 flying hours logged, was believed to have taken over control of the aircraft from the less experienced Plesel when it started to ascend and then descend, officials said.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/01/29/indonesia-airplane-idUSL4N0V82DG20150129

 

[trigger]

:loveyou: Hi Cariis. Welcome back