SC - Columbia - Sheriff Slams Female Student to Floor In Class - #2

[katydid23]

That's the way it was when I was in high school. I don't recall a cop ever being there. There were big fit male teachers who were expected to be on hand to break up fights, etc., and they were actually paid a bonus for being a disciplinary aid or some other title. There wasn't anyone needed to subdue defiant but passive kids because there weren't any. There literally were no kids who would sit there in their chair and tell a VP they're not going to get up. They wouldn't be coming back to school after something like that.

Most teachers unions have battled against that use of teacher muscle these days. Those teachers have been injured and have been sued. They do not want to take on that role anymore because it is too dangerous these days. JMO

 

[katydid23]

A phone call to the home after school would suffice my friend. I doubt she would show up the next day. So I was not stating for him to escort her to the office nor off the premises.

Here is the problem with the 'phone call home' policy. LOTS of parents couldn't care less. LOTS of parents don't pick up the phone nor do they return the call. And it is usually the same parents whose kids are in trouble.

 

[katydid23]

This is the comment I was responding to:

But that meant 'no cell phones' during class, not no cell phones allowed inside the classroom.

 

[katydid23]

<modsnip>
When I worked in the school office , it was MY JOB to contact the parents. I know of many times where the parents had no interest in speaking to the principal.

We even had to send people to the homes in some cases because no one would return the calls. And very often, when he did contact the parents, they were hostile towards the school. They blamed the teacher and backed their kid, who was often lying to them. So calling the parents is not always a panacea.

Often the parents were helpful and wanted to make things right. But they would admit they had no way to reign in their kids. Many times it was a busy single mother or aging grandparents who asked US for help in disciplining their kid.

 

[Hope4More]

<modsnip>When I worked in the school office , it was MY JOB to contact the parents. I know of many times where the parents had no interest in speaking to the principal.

We even had to send people to the homes in some cases because no one would return the calls. And very often, when he did contact the parents, they were hostile towards the school. They blamed the teacher and backed their kid, who was often lying to them. So calling the parents is not always a panacea.

Often the parents were helpful and wanted to make things right. But they would admit they had no way to reign in their kids. Many times it was a busy single mother or aging grandparents who asked US for help in disciplining their kid.

So, so, true. And even true about many parents on the other end of the social spectrum with kids in K-12 private schools costing $30-60,000 a year. Both parents so involved in their careers that their nannies are essentially raising the kids, and no, they have no interest whatsoever if the school works up the nerve to tell them anything unpleasant about about their kids.

Real world.

 

[SophieRose]

I realize I am probably the lone poster that feels resource officers belong in every school. I cannot forget Sandy Hook, Columbia and all of the other school shootings. I also like that in our district they are full fledged sherriff or city police officers not school board employees.
Our school district is talking about starting their own police department which I don't agree with. IMO it is the way for the district to circumvent the system and have total control over the students and laws.
Just my two cents.

I was reading up on SRO's. I read at one school gang violence incidents were cut in half with the presence of an SRO.

 

[LietKynes]

Often the parents were helpful and wanted to make things right. But they would admit they had no way to reign in their kids. Many times it was a busy single mother or aging grandparents who asked US for help in disciplining their kid.

SABBM
Snipped for brevity

Imo, it is NOT the school's job to have to 'reign in' these kids -- or at least it shouldn't have to be !
There are some parents who use the public school as a babysitter; and that's asking the impossible; again my opinion.
And sometimes the very people who expect the school to 'deal with their children' are the first to complain if they feel their offspring have been unfairly treated.

I'm agreeing with your post and also find it very sad.
What is this country becoming ?
:moo:

 

[bluesneakers]

I was reading up on SRO's. I read at one school gang violence incidents were cut in half with the presence of an SRO.

Do you have a link?

"Those opposed to law enforcement presence in schools contend there is little evidence to demonstrate that SRO programs reduce illegal or disruptive behavior," the study said. "By the time SROs became common in the late 1990s, juvenile involvement in crime was already declining both inside and outside of schools."

http://www.mprnews.org/story/2015/10/30/cops-schools-walk-fine-line-confronting-problem-students

In public school districts around the country, arrests have increased with the presence of school resource officers, even as juvenile crime rates have decreased.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_...ce_officer_ben_field_s_violent_arrest_of.html

 

[DexterMorgan]

So, so, true. And even true about many parents on the other end of the social spectrum with kids in K-12 private schools costing $30-60,000 a year. Both parents so involved in their careers that their nannies are essentially raising the kids, and no, they have no interest whatsoever if the school works up the nerve to tell them anything unpleasant about about their kids.

Real world.

How many parents send their kids to school while the child is on a suspension. I doubt during a call the parent would say that they will be sending their child to school regardless of the suspension. Now they may get upset. But heck. I think they would be more upset at looking at the extraction video on YouTube or CNN or Nancy Grace.

So their participation with the kids schooling doesn't negate a reason for the school to not be able to give the suspension news via telephone to the parent and child. Jmo.

 

[ohreally]

The thought of school districts creating their own police departments boggles my mind. How disturbing!!!

I can understand your fears about school safety, since school shootings and massacres have become almost commonplace here in the US. My kid attends a public school in a very violent city, so I share your fear as well as understand it.

But I just can't agree about having full fledged cops in school, much less calling upon them to handle what are the basic responsibilities of teachers and administrators.

I'll go the one step further and say what scares me more than school violence is watching the seeds of a genuine police state being planted in the hallways of our impressionable kids' schools.

I do understand where you are coming from, but I guess my experience has not been the feeling that resource officers make students feel like they are in a police state. My children have always liked their resource officers. In high school they liked and admired their resource officer better than some of the administration. They felt he was fair to everyone. Some of the administration they felt did not dish out punishments fairly.

 

[bluesneakers]

How many parents send their kids to school while the child is on a suspension. I doubt during a call the parent would say that they will be sending their child to school regardless of the suspension. Now they may get upset. But heck. I think they would be more upset at looking at the extraction video on YouTube or CNN or Nancy Grace.

So their participation with the kids schooling doesn't negate a reason for the school to not be able to give the suspension news via telephone to the parent and child. Jmo.

Maybe suspension should always be in school suspension because what are working parents supposed to do? It's like a snow day with no warning.

 

[katydid23]

How many parents send their kids to school while the child is on a suspension. I doubt during a call the parent would say that they will be sending their child to school regardless of the suspension. Now they may get upset. But heck. I think they would be more upset at looking at the extraction video on YouTube or CNN or Nancy Grace.

So their participation with the kids schooling doesn't negate a reason for the school to not be able to give the suspension news via telephone to the parent and child. Jmo.

It is very hard to get a child suspended for a public school. If this student had refused to give up her phone, the teacher could not have her suspended. and when the VP came to class, he would not have been able to suspend her. It takes a lot of get a student suspended. Usually an act of violence or a large theft. Someone stole a phone from another student at my kids school and they did not get suspended. Just detention.

 

[DexterMorgan]

It is very hard to get a child suspended for a public school. If this student had refused to give up her phone, the teacher could not have her suspended. and when the VP came to class, he would not have been able to suspend her. It takes a lot of get a student suspended. Usually an act of violence or a large theft. Someone stole a phone from another student at my kids school and they did not get suspended. Just detention.

So the take down shouldn't have been warranted for a detention offense?

 

[katydid23]

Maybe suspension should always be in school suspension because what are working parents supposed to do? It's like a snow day with no warning.

It becomes like a catch 22 though. In House suspensions are costly AND kids tend to enjoy them. They get to hang around and chill with their homies. Much more enjoyable than being in class.

Our school tried to make it a requirement that the in school suspension kids had to do some work. They had to do school work for a majority of the time, then were supposed to go outside and help clean up and pick up trash. Like the community service work to pay off fines, etc. But the ACLU prevented the schools from requiring them to do any labor because that was unseemly, I suppose. So all the kids could do was sit around with their buddies and enjoy themselves. Not really that much of a punishment.

 

[katydid23]

So the take down shouldn't have been warranted for a detention offense?

The take down was warranted because by that time she was under arrest for refusing the Deputy's lawful commands.

But I was speaking of the initial behavior on her part. She could not be suspended for not giving up her phone. Detention, YES/ Suspension, NO.

ETA:

http://www.nyclu.org/content/know-y...s-and-responsibilities-when-facing-suspension

Know Your Rights: Students' Rights and Responsibilities When Facing a Suspension

Suspension is a serious punishment, that can have important consequences for your education and your future. There are certain rules your school must follow in order to suspend you. This guide will explain those rules and help you protect your rights.

This information is available in Spanish:
Conozca Sus Derechos y Responsabilidades Cuando se Enfrente Una Suspension

If you are a student in New York City, the NYCLU may be able to help you find free representation for your suspension hearing. Please contact Jalise Burt at [email protected].

 

[K_Z]

I realize I am probably the lone poster that feels resource officers belong in every school. I cannot forget Sandy Hook, Columbia and all of the other school shootings. I also like that in our district they are full fledged sherriff or city police officers not school board employees.
Our school district is talking about starting their own police department which I don't agree with. IMO it is the way for the district to circumvent the system and have total control over the students and laws.
Just my two cents.

BBM-- I will sit next to you, because as I posted earlier in this thread, I do believe all public schools should have at least one or two officers on duty during the school day. It is simply too controversial to try to identify and get wide agreement on criteria for "which" schools should have officers, and which don't need them. Putting officers in all public schools would set this as the norm, and removes the perception of bias and discrimination. And I do think there is a strong value on a number of levels, to having officers present during the school day. I have changed my ideas on this completely in the past 10 years or so.

The bigger question is who should pay for them-- the county or the district or the state? And where do the officers fit in on the administrative chart for the school, if at all? Who do the officers answer to? What is their chain of command, and area of authority and responsibility?

I don't think officers need to be mandated in private schools unless the schools and their parents want them, and are willing to pay for them.

I was reading up on SRO's. I read at one school gang violence incidents were cut in half with the presence of an SRO.

Do you have a link?



http://www.mprnews.org/story/2015/10/30/cops-schools-walk-fine-line-confronting-problem-students



http://www.slate.com/articles/news_...ce_officer_ben_field_s_violent_arrest_of.html

I think we have to be an educated consumer of statistics. I don't think school crime has decreased, and I can dig up a bunch of evidence to show it has increased.

Anyone relatively skilled in statistics can massage and manipulate numbers of "something" to get the kind of outcome they are looking for-- or design a study to "only" look at specific things while leaving other things out.

As an example, some school districts have "decided" not to report criminal activity on K-12 campuses to "prevent" youths from having a law enforcement record-- with the SECONDARY benefit of the school district being able to triumphantly report to the community and various other agencies that "Crime has decreased in our district schools".

Just one example of this kind of re-labelling of criminal activity that was in the news recently was the efforts of a school to characterize stolen property discovered in a student backpack, along with burglary tools, as "found property."

School crime reporting is not standardized, and is considered by a number of authoritative agencies to be vastly underreported.

http://www.schoolsecurity.org/trends/school-crime-reporting-and-underreporting/

We find it ironic that here at a private consulting firm we can have more accurate and current counts on school-associated violent deaths than a federal agency which spends millions and billions a year to function. We also find it odd that our school death stats show a spike in the 2003-2004 and 2004-2005 school years, while the federal government is simultaneously telling the American public that school crime has dramatically declined.

State school crime reporting requirements vary and lack enforcement

A number of states created legislation following the spate of national school shootings in the late 1990s to require local school districts to report school crimes to state departments of education and/or other state authorities. The specific requirements vary state to state and the quality of reporting to states by local districts has repeatedly come into question.

The problem with state school crime reporting requirements is simply that there are few, if any, rewards for schools that accurately report crimes and no meaningful consequences for those that fail to do so. In general there is no real auditing or enforcement. Even in cases where local daily newspapers have investigated and identified gross inaccuracies in local school district crime reports to states and to police, most school districts are quick to claim “clerical errors” or a “lack of understanding of the law and guidelines” for reporting — and nobody is ever significantly held accountable with substantive consequences.

BBM

 

[KaaBoom]

Please provide a link to the internal investigation report that states that he beat her and/or choked her.

Richland County Sheriff Leon Lott said an internal investigation over the Monday incident at Spring Valley High School in Columbia focused on whether Senior Deputy Ben Fields had violated the department's policies.

He said at a news conference that the department looked at cellphone videos taken from the classroom and interviews with witnesses, and concluded that the maneuvers he used in the confrontation were "not acceptable."

"From the very beginning that's what's caused me to be upset, and (what) continued to upset me is that he picked the student up and threw the student across the room," Lott said.

South Carolina Deputy Ben Fields Fired After Body Slamming Student: Sheriff

 

[Hope4More]

So the take down shouldn't have been warranted for a detention offense?

She didn't get taken down for a school's detention offense. She was taken down because she resisted the orders of a police officer who was authorized to arrest her based on state legislation making disruption of school a criminal offense, which by the way, is an offense adjudicated in a courtroom, not the principal's office.

In other words, he could have arrested her even if she had complied and left the classroom. Her chance at detention vanished when she said no to the assistant principal.

 

[DexterMorgan]

She didn't get taken down for a school's detention offense. She was taken down because she resisted the orders of a police officer who was authorized to arrest her based on state legislation making disruption of school a criminal offense, which by the way, is an offense adjudicated in a courtroom, not the principal's office.

In other words, he could have arrested her even if she had complied and left the classroom. Her chance at detention vanished when she said no the assistant principal.

Okay. Suspending the kid is hard to do for minor infractions; But we will arrest her instead?

 

[vestigare]

Exercising her constitutional rights

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...&p=12148997&highlight=exercising#post12148997

Do not misquote me and apply quotes to the incorrect subject.
The "exercising" her rights quote that you highlighted was not even about the girl who was thrown by the RO. The entire discussion if you followed it back from Jenna through EllieBee and me you will see we were discussing the girl who was arrested for speaking up against this girls treatment.

This girl was arrested for protesting and speaking out about the treatment of a fellow student. She was arrested for exercising her constitutional rights.