SC - Paul Murdaugh, 22 and mom Margaret, 52, found shot to death, Islandton, 7 June 2021 #13

[stmarysmead]

I think one thing we are missing on that timeline is why would AM go to see his dad twice?

He stated he went to see his dad, came back to Moselle, took a nap, left to see his mom, came back to Moselle, called 911 at 10:07 pm. He lied about having seen MM and PM before leaving to see his mom at 9 pm. We know this by the audio PM captured on his phone.

We know MM arrived at Moselle at around 7 pm. PM ate supper with his uncle at 6 pm then headed to Moselle perhaps arriving around 7pm. Found dead at Moselle at 10:07 pm (according to AM's account).

TOD 9-9:30 pm. It was reported they had been dead an hour more or less.

MM's phone found beside road but PM's found with his body.

If you converge those timelines, then I think it was something along the lines that @stmarysmead stated up thread.

Except I think MM arrived at Moselle at 7 pm and AM talked her into letting him ride with her to the hospital because her vehicle was found by LE running in the driveway at 10pm.

JMO
There have been no statements about whether either of them knew PM was still there.

There have been no statements about the reason AM said she needed to talk to RM III which she did not deny that she did. She just tried to limit her contact with AM to a public place, the hospital. That indicates, to me anyway, she was wary of his motives for her coming to Moselle. I think he talked her into coming to Moselle by promising to be a good boy but she hedged her bets by asking PM to meet her there.

MOO I think they visited with RM III and then returned to Moselle at around 8:30-9 pm. I think AM behaved himself during that time and MM let her guard down. When they arrived back at Moselle she got out to check on the dogs (it has been stated that MM loved the dogs) and AM walked down to the kennels with her. But it is obvious by that running car she didn't plan to stay long and chitchat with AM. There is no evidence either of them knew PM was there. Indeed, he may even have left when they did and returned to video the injuries on the dog at his friend's request. He caught audio of them talking by the kennels.

I think that AM had those guns stored close to the kennels. Maybe they were always kept there close to the dogs. After all they used both guns and dogs to hunt and the dog food had to be stored somewhere close in a dry place. I can't see it well in the photos of the kennels but there looks to be a white shed attached to the kennels behind them or to the side of the kennels on the far right of the photos.

I think an argument occurred between her and AM or perhaps he just asked her to drop the audit and she said no. He got the shotgun and pointed it at her but PM intervened.

I think AM threw her phone out on the way to his mom's.

This is the only scenario I can think of that would fit the timelines stated.

JMO

JMO

Excellent post!

 

[RAISINISBACK]

My grandson used to do skeet shooting with a shotgun and he also hunts turkey, duck and deer among other things during season. He just did a drive by visit (I call his visits drive by's because he never stays long and is talking as he is walking in and talking on his way out after standing about 3 minutes). Busy man.

He asked if I was following this case which he had heard some about on the news. I said yes.

He said he heard the shotgun was loaded with #8 birdshot and 00 buckshot. I told him I thought that had been mentioned on here also.

He said then he meant to kill his wife either short range or long range. I asked him to explain that statement.

He said it was a hunting lodge. They were probably hunting turkey or duck. Thus the #8 birdshot. Also probably hunting bigger animals like deer thus the 00 buckshot.

But he said people do not usually mix shells like that in a shotgun. He said that was more than likely intentional.

His explanation: If the shotgun was full choke or nitro turkey choke then the #8 bird shot would have been used to kill at long range while the 00 buckshot would have been used for short range. So, if he didn't get a kill shot (his words, I'm sorry because it seems insensitive) up close he could get the shot at long range. Therefore, AM loaded the shotgun that way intentionally. Especially if it was double barreled with dual triggers which are commonly used to hunt duck.

I have always believed that shotgun was meant for MM since shotgun shells are harder to match to a specific gun whereas rifles have casings which are matched easily. I think that is also evidenced by the fact it was reported that the shotgun was found at the scene, but the AR style rifle was not.

@Kudzuu and others who know more about guns than I do, what do you think? Is it possible what my GS says is correct?

JMO

 

[legalmomma]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1549483726828195848

 

[legalmomma]

https://www.fitsnews.com/2022/07/19/alex-murdaugh-bond-hearing-evidence-details-to-be-discussed/

Prosecutors attending a scheduled bond hearing in Colleton County, South Carolina this week for accused murderer Alex Murdaugh will provide S.C. circuit court judge Clifton Newman with limited evidence and information about the grisly crimes the former attorney has been accused of committing.

Or so say sources with knowledge of the upcoming proceeding …

Newman, readers will recall, denied Murdaugh bond last fall in connection with a pair of property tax crimes. His bond was subsequently set at $7 million by S.C. circuit court judge Alison Lee in connection with a host of additional financial crimes handed down by the S.C. statewide grand jury. Murdaugh has yet to make this bond – and remains incarcerated at the Alvin S. Glenn detention center outside of Columbia, S.C.
…
How much of this information will be revealed on Wednesday? Good question … but multiple sources familiar with the state’s case told me prosecutors would be divulging “some details” regarding the evidence they have collected in connection with the investigation.

“They will provide information related to the charges,” a source close to the case confirmed to me, declining to comment further."....
----------------------------------------------------------
More in article.

 

[MerryB]

My grandson used to do skeet shooting with a shotgun and he also hunts turkey, duck and deer among other things during season. He just did a drive by visit (I call his visits drive by's because he never stays long and is talking as he is walking in and talking on his way out after standing about 3 minutes). Busy man.

He asked if I was following this case which he had heard some about on the news. I said yes.

He said he heard the shotgun was loaded with #8 birdshot and 00 buckshot. I told him I thought that had been mentioned on here also.

He said then he meant to kill his wife either short range or long range. I asked him to explain that statement.

He said it was a hunting lodge. They were probably hunting turkey or duck. Thus the #8 birdshot. Also probably hunting bigger animals like deer thus the 00 buckshot.

But he said people do not usually mix shells like that in a shotgun. He said that was more than likely intentional.

His explanation: If the shotgun was full choke or nitro turkey choke then the #8 bird shot would have been used to kill at long range while the 00 buckshot would have been used for short range. So, if he didn't get a kill shot (his words, I'm sorry because it seems insensitive) up close he could get the shot at long range. Therefore, AM loaded the shotgun that way intentionally. Especially if it was double barreled with dual triggers which are commonly used to hunt duck.

I have always believed that shotgun was meant for MM since shotgun shells are harder to match to a specific gun whereas rifles have casings which are matched easily. I think that is also evidenced by the fact it was reported that the shotgun was found at the scene, but the AR style rifle was not.

@Kudzuu and others who know more about guns than I do, what do you think? Is it possible what my GS says is correct?

JMO

I’ve had several people tell me that this is how they load their self-defense shotguns, though I had not heard of doing it this way. One round birdshot (warning), one round buckshot (strike). It makes sense to me that this weapon might have been something that was kept in a car or near the kennels for this purpose.

 

[legalmomma]

https://amp.thestate.com/news/local/crime/article260233370.html

Attorneys will gather at the Colleton County Courthouse in Walterboro for the hearing at 10 a.m. Wednesday, July 20, the S.C. Attorney General’s Office announced late Thursday.

 

[MerryB]

Surprised john didn’t mention Paul going there to tend to the dog during the abc interview. I wonder how Paul knew the dog needed looking at.

Jmo

I’m not sure JMM knew specifically why Paul was going to Moselle. He told Seton Tucker on the Impact of Influence podcast that he thought he was going there for dinner (contrary to what was reported by FITS, JMM stated that Paul did not eat dinner with his family, which makes sense if he left after work in Okatie at 6PM and arrived at Moselle around 7PM).
I’m assuming Paul’s friend might’ve texted him & asked him to check on his dog. MOO

 

[MerryB]

I think one thing we are missing on that timeline is why would AM go to see his dad twice?

Respectfully SBM.
I do not think AM had any intention of visiting his dad twice that day. I think he said that specifically to lure Maggie to Moselle. I don’t believe he had any intention of going back to the hospital, and I think Maggie thought it was weird, too based on the People article.
My theory is that this is why AM got rid of her phone. He didn’t want anyone to see that he’d lied to get her out there. He didn’t count on Buster having a tracking app and being able to not only use that to find her phone but knowing the code to unlock it. MOO

 

[worm]

https://amp.thestate.com/news/local/crime/article260233370.html

Attorneys will gather at the Colleton County Courthouse in Walterboro for the hearing at 10 a.m. Wednesday, July 20, the S.C. Attorney General’s Office announced late Thursday.

I’m not getting my hopes up with learning much since they won’t have to offer much to get a denied bond for a murder charge.

 

[Kudzuu]

My grandson used to do skeet shooting with a shotgun and he also hunts turkey, duck and deer among other things during season. He just did a drive by visit (I call his visits drive by's because he never stays long and is talking as he is walking in and talking on his way out after standing about 3 minutes). Busy man.

He asked if I was following this case which he had heard some about on the news. I said yes.

He said he heard the shotgun was loaded with #8 birdshot and 00 buckshot. I told him I thought that had been mentioned on here also.

He said then he meant to kill his wife either short range or long range. I asked him to explain that statement.

He said it was a hunting lodge. They were probably hunting turkey or duck. Thus the #8 birdshot. Also probably hunting bigger animals like deer thus the 00 buckshot.

But he said people do not usually mix shells like that in a shotgun. He said that was more than likely intentional.

His explanation: If the shotgun was full choke or nitro turkey choke then the #8 bird shot would have been used to kill at long range while the 00 buckshot would have been used for short range. So, if he didn't get a kill shot (his words, I'm sorry because it seems insensitive) up close he could get the shot at long range. Therefore, AM loaded the shotgun that way intentionally. Especially if it was double barreled with dual triggers which are commonly used to hunt duck.

I have always believed that shotgun was meant for MM since shotgun shells are harder to match to a specific gun whereas rifles have casings which are matched easily. I think that is also evidenced by the fact it was reported that the shotgun was found at the scene, but the AR style rifle was not.

@Kudzuu and others who know more about guns than I do, what do you think? Is it possible what my GS says is correct?

JMO

Yes. Get rid of the rifle so they can't tie it to the bullets. Guns that shoot bullets leave unique markings. Just throw it in the Broad River. And your Grandson has me thinking if AM didn't expect PM to be there and only had the shotgun then he would have probably not had time to find the rifle and shoot MM within yards of PM. Maybe he brought both. The rifle as a backup if something went sideways. Also safety conscious gun owners unload their guns before putting them up unless they are left out for protection. With all the drinking etc. I would never leave a loaded gun around people partying and PM was that age and he was violent when drunk.


Also if MM felt uneasy that AM was up to something then AM might have felt the same and came armed for both close up and long distance killings. MM might bring a companion. I mean really if she had concerns to his intent take someone with you.

Plenty of scenarios. Maybe PM loaded the shot gun with random shells lying around and confronted his father. AM gets him to give it to him and all crazy gets loose. We may never know.

But it is interesting about the buckshot. At any rate with both guns it was overkill.

 

[clearskies1]

Respectfully SBM.
I do not think AM had any intention of visiting his dad twice that day. I think he said that specifically to lure Maggie to Moselle. I don’t believe he had any intention of going back to the hospital, and I think Maggie thought it was weird, too based on the People article.
My theory is that this is why AM got rid of her phone. He didn’t want anyone to see that he’d lied to get her out there. He didn’t count on Buster having a tracking app and being able to not only use that to find her phone but knowing the code to unlock it. MOO

I don't think it's unusual to make multiple visits to a dying parent in one day, especially if you are accompanying a family member there. But, like you, I don't think there was a return trip to the hospital with Maggie that evening. I think we probably would have heard about someone seeing her there if she did. JMO.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Yes. Get rid of the rifle so they can't tie it to the bullets. Guns that shoot bullets leave unique markings. Just throw it in the Broad River. And your Grandson has me thinking if AM didn't expect PM to be there and only had the shotgun then he would have probably not had time to find the rifle and shoot MM within yards of PM. Maybe he brought both. The rifle as a backup if something went sideways. Also safety conscious gun owners unload their guns before putting them up unless they are left out for protection. With all the drinking etc. I would never leave a loaded gun around people partying and PM was that age and he was violent when drunk.


Also if MM felt uneasy that AM was up to something then AM might have felt the same and came armed for both close up and long distance killings. MM might bring a companion. I mean really if she had concerns to his intent take someone with you.

Plenty of scenarios. Maybe PM loaded the shot gun with random shells lying around and confronted his father. AM gets him to give it to him and all crazy gets loose. We may never know.

But it is interesting about the buckshot. At any rate with both guns it was overkill.

@Kudzuu You have given amazing insights into this case. So has @stmarysmead. You both have given me plenty to think about.

BBM

Also if MM felt uneasy that AM was up to something then AM might have felt the same and came armed for both close up and long distance killings. MM might bring a companion.

That is so true that if MM felt uneasy AM may have expected her to bring someone and prepared for two people. I did not think of that.

This all feels so planned. Like he prepared everything in advance. Lured her out there. Expected 2 people to show up. Loaded the guns, chose 2 weapons in case he missed with one, prepared for both short and long range shots like he expected one of them to run. Almost like he planned to go on a hunting trip.

This is looking less like a spur of the moment argument and heat of passion killing to a carefully planned out execution of his wife and possibly his son. Would things have been different if BM had showed up instead of PM?

What really bothers me is that over 2 hour time lapse from when we know MM and PM arrived at 7 pm to TOD at 9-9:30 pm.

At any rate you have given me a lot to think about.
JMO

 

[Seattle1]

Respectfully SBM.
I do not think AM had any intention of visiting his dad twice that day. I think he said that specifically to lure Maggie to Moselle. I don’t believe he had any intention of going back to the hospital, and I think Maggie thought it was weird, too based on the People article.
My theory is that this is why AM got rid of her phone. He didn’t want anyone to see that he’d lied to get her out there. He didn’t count on Buster having a tracking app and being able to not only use that to find her phone but knowing the code to unlock it. MOO

^^BBM

But getting rid of the instrument (phone) doesn't destroy the communication history or evidence that AM lied to get MM to Moselle. Downloading the phone back-up or unlocking the phones was just a matter of time-- waiting for probable cause for the search warrants. JMO

 

[stmarysmead]

Raisinisback…thank you and i feel the same about your posts. Very thought provoking! So many great posters here with interesting insights.

Im wondering if PM came out to the house that night purposely to have dinner with his parents. It doesn't make sense that MM would agree to come to the house if the hospital were more convenient…and AM was acting ‘fishy.’

I think PM could have been the ‘hook’ AM used to get her out there specifically to Moselle. ‘We can have dinner with PM and then head over to the hospital.’ It’s said she adored those boys.

Something that seems ‘fishy’ to me…is visiting someone with Alzheimer's in the evening when they are usually ‘sundowning.’

I hope we get a few answers tomorrow .

 

[MerryB]

^^BBM

But getting rid of the instrument (phone) doesn't destroy the communication history or evidence that AM lied to get MM to Moselle. Downloading the phone back-up or unlocking the phones was just a matter of time-- waiting for probable cause for the search warrants. JMO

Do you think AM knew that?

 

[MerryB]

Lawyers speculate on what's in store for Murdaugh at bond hearing for murder

The public may finally hear what cards the state is holding when it comes to murder charges against Alex Murdaugh.

abcnews4.com

 

[LetsSolvIt]

Maybe not. If MM was wanting to divorce AM the past would surface IMO in some fashion. Also, IMO, an audit of marital assets would drive AM over the edge more so than anything else. If it is true that she was seeking a divorce I wonder what atty would take on the case. Could she find an atty who would represent her that she could trust.

With all the rumors, speculation, and actual facts floating around the last 13 months, I have found it surprising the no attorney or firm name has been rumored or confirmed as who Maggie allegedly met with. While I wouldn’t expect the lawyer to hold a press conference (tongue in cheek), I’ve wondered if the gal/fella has sworn his entire firm to secrecy — certainly wouldn’t want AM or cohorts to know who she/he is?

Added: Practically every other detail has been surrounded by rumors, wonder why not this?

 

[Warwick7]

^^BBM

But getting rid of the instrument (phone) doesn't destroy the communication history or evidence that AM lied to get MM to Moselle. Downloading the phone back-up or unlocking the phones was just a matter of time-- waiting for probable cause for the search warrants. JMO

Without the phone. Can't LE still get a search warrant fom the cell company?

 

[LetsSolvIt]

https://www.fitsnews.com/2022/07/19/alex-murdaugh-bond-hearing-evidence-details-to-be-discussed/

Prosecutors attending a scheduled bond hearing in Colleton County, South Carolina this week for accused murderer Alex Murdaugh will provide S.C. circuit court judge Clifton Newman with limited evidence and information about the grisly crimes the former attorney has been accused of committing.

Or so say sources with knowledge of the upcoming proceeding …

Newman, readers will recall, denied Murdaugh bond last fall in connection with a pair of property tax crimes. His bond was subsequently set at $7 million by S.C. circuit court judge Alison Lee in connection with a host of additional financial crimes handed down by the S.C. statewide grand jury. Murdaugh has yet to make this bond – and remains incarcerated at the Alvin S. Glenn detention center outside of Columbia, S.C.
…
How much of this information will be revealed on Wednesday? Good question … but multiple sources familiar with the state’s case told me prosecutors would be divulging “some details” regarding the evidence they have collected in connection with the investigation.

“They will provide information related to the charges,” a source close to the case confirmed to me, declining to comment further."....
----------------------------------------------------------
More in article.

Will this be on video like the last bond hearing?

I LOVE Judge Neuman! One man in S.C. who isnt part of the legal scheming network and isnt afraid of AM and his cohorts!! So glad this hearing is with Judge Neuman! MOO.

 

[Seattle1]

Without the phone. Can't LE still get a search warrant fom the cell company?

Absolutely -- for all the phone calls, texts, location tracking, apps, and cloud backup. Technology and privacy are no longer close or distant cousins!