Special Counsel Issues 1st Indictments

[bwt42]

I agree he has lied and to the FBI of all agencies to lie to. He tried to undermine the USA not good!

And I respect your opinion that it could be a coincidence and I will acknowledge that is possible, however:

According to the indictment his emails show approx mid March he started emailing trying to get a meeting...

April 26, 2016 he was informed by foreign agency that they had "dirt" on HRC.
May 21, 2016 he emailed Manafort about meeting to get said "dirt".
June 9, 2016 Kushner, DTJ and Manafort meet with foreign agency to get "dirt" by DTJ own admission.

I don't think it was a coincidence looking at the timing of the emails and the eventual meeting DTJ admitted to, but reality is that Mueller has access to Pop's email and who all was on the email chains.

Meeting 3ish weeks after emailing Manafort about setting up a meeting is pretty suspicious to me and apparently the FBI.

ETA: 3ish weeks from POP's email to Manafort and the actual meeting Manafort and DTJ had with foreign agency to get "dirt". If a coincidence, and I will concede there are some strange coincidences, it's one for the books that an email that the FBI have in their possession to Manafort about a meeting ended up actually happening.

Okay let's say the dirt that was offered to Papadopouls is the same dirt that was offered to Manafort by someone else. What is the significance?

 

[LaneGirl]

Okay let's say the dirt that was offered to Papadopouls is the same dirt that was offered to Manafort by someone else. What is the significance?

It's pretty shady to have a foreign entity interfere with USA elections and depending on what happened in that meeting could be illegal. That we don't really know yet.

But also note and more importantly: by DJT own admission they talked about adoptions which is Russia's ban in reaction to the Magnitsky Act.

There would be no reason for Russia to bring up a ban that they themselves enacted against the USA unless they wanted to talk about the Magnitsky Act which has hurt Russian $.

So now we are getting to the heart of the meetings.

By DTJ own admission and Kushner they went for "dirt" which the meeting was set up for and the foreign entity actually wanted to talk about adoptions i.e. ban in response to Magnitsky Act.

ETA - what happened/transpired after that and what emails went to who and about what is still yet to be released.

 

[bluesneakers]

Okay let's say the dirt that was offered to Papadopouls is the same dirt that was offered to Manafort by someone else. What is the significance?

Have you read Papadopouls' plea? Did that not seem significant?

 

[LaneGirl]

Here's the indictment if it hasn't already been posted...

https://www.justice.gov/file/1007346/download

 

[LaneGirl]

Okay let's say the dirt that was offered to Papadopouls is the same dirt that was offered to Manafort by someone else. What is the significance?

I forgot to add said "dirt" was in the form of hacked emails which is illegal.

 

[bluesneakers]

Here's the indictment if it hasn't already been posted...

https://www.justice.gov/file/1007346/download

Thanks. I thought I still had it saved.

 

[bwt42]

Have you read Papadopouls' plea? Did that not seem significant?

Yes I have read Papadopouls' plea. I was adsking what is the significance of Papadopouls & Manafort being offered the same dirt by different Russians. My guess would be that the Russians were probing to see if they could compromise someone in the American government.

 

[kaen]

I was out Trick or Treating tonight. The idea that Manafort had more than one passport and has lied about his liquidity is definitely a clue that he would have no trouble fleeing. My guess is that these facts were the reason that Manafort had his home raided in the early morning. He seemed to be willing to lie or abscond at will.

I would love to be a fly on the wall in the room where Mueller and Co are discussing what they are finding.

 

[HoneyWest]

Newly unsealed court documents: Manafort and Gates received "millions of dollars" from "Russian oligarchs"

http://www.businessinsider.com/prosecutors-say-manafort-and-gates-received-millions-from-russian-oligarchs-2017-10

Manafort and Gates, who both pleaded not guilty on Monday, were required to turn over their passports to the FBI and notify the bureau of their movements. According to the filing, Manafort currently has three passports with different numbers — and has "submitted ten US passport applications on ten different occasions" over the past decade.

The New York Times reported in July, citing financial documents filed in Cyprus, that Manafort was in debt to pro-Russian interests by as much as $17 million by the time he joined President Donald Trump's campaign team in March 2016.

Manafort also represented the value of his assets on loan applications "in divergent amounts, " according to the court filings. The values varied wildly in 2016, when he was serving as Trump's campaign chairman — from $48 million in February 2016 to $136 million in May 2016 to $25 million in November 2016 — suggesting "considerable resources, the full extent of which is unclear," the government wrote.

Did Manafort have an accountant to keep up with all of these millions? He/She would be a good person to talk to.

 

[bwt42]

Have you read Papadopouls' plea? Did that not seem significant?

Don't really know. It remains to be seen if it leads to more. It may or may not be significant. I have listened to some talk shows today with balanced opinions and their views say the significance is up for debate. jmo. Those with political bents will portray it in a way to further their interests.

 

[kaen]

It's pretty shady to have a foreign entity interfere with USA elections and depending on what happened in that meeting could be illegal. That we don't really know yet.

But also note and more importantly: by DJT own admission they talked about adoptions which is Russia's ban in reaction to the Magnitsky Act.

There would be no reason for Russia to bring up a ban that they themselves enacted against the USA unless they wanted to talk about the Magnitsky Act which has hurt Russian $.

So now we are getting to the heart of the meetings.

By DTJ own admission and Kushner they went for "dirt" which the meeting was set up for and the foreign entity actually wanted to talk about adoptions i.e. ban in response to Magnitsky Act.

ETA - what happened/transpired after that and what emails went to who and about what is still yet to be released.

Thanks for your well constructed posts. I tend to think that the idea that Papadopolous getting encouragement from superiors rather than anyone reporting the Russian outreach and offer of illegally obtained material is the thing that I keep coming back to.

 

[kaen]

Newly unsealed court documents: Manafort and Gates received "millions of dollars" from "Russian oligarchs"

http://www.businessinsider.com/prosecutors-say-manafort-and-gates-received-millions-from-russian-oligarchs-2017-10



Did Manafort have an accountant to keep up with all of these millions? He/She would be a good person to talk to.

I bet he/she has already been contacted....it seems the Mueller crew has been busy.

 

[LaneGirl]

Don't really know. It remains to be seen if it leads to more. It may or may not be significant. I have listened to some talk shows today with balanced opinions and their views say the significance is up for debate. jmo. Those with political bents will portray it in a way to further their interests.

It's absolutely significant that POP lied to the FBI correct? I think you and I can agree on that.

So you have to ask yourself why? Why would he lie? Whats to hide if it was just innocent?

Everybody tells lie's in some form or another to many different people but lie to the FBI who can get your email, social media (which apparently he deleted) phone, bank, real estate and any records they want AND put you away for lying? Nope he had something to hide and he probably sang like a canary if not wore a wire as some are speculating.

I will agree with you re: how high up in the administration it goes though. Who knows, but I have to say with this guy lying to the FBI and some of his emails in the possession of the FBI and some of the meetings that came out it's not looking good for some people higher up.

ETA - We already see Manafort was on the emails and Manafort was pretty high up during the campaign.

 

[kaen]

Wow. The judge allowing Mueller and his team to ask Manafort's former attorney questions as part of the investigation. I think so many people thought they were so smart and, then, they run into some truly smart people who happen to be investigating them.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...s-710pm:homepage/story&utm_term=.ade4746ddd72

 

[EllieBee]

Also, I find it ironic that yesterday many names other than those indicted were brought up without a peep, but when a Democrat is brought up there's an outcry.

Not exactly "irony", but I dig what you meant. Don't agree, but I hear you.

And also, red triangle on the bottom left of the post.

 

[bwt42]

It's absolutely significant that POP lied to the FBI correct? I think you and I can agree on that.

So you have to ask yourself why? Why would he lie? Whats to hide if it was just innocent?

Everybody tells lie's in some form or another to many different people but lie to the FBI who can get your email, social media (which apparently he deleted) phone, bank, real estate and any records they want AND put you away for lying? Nope he had something to hide and he probably sang like a canary if not wore a wire as some are speculating.

I will agree with you re: how high up in the administration it goes though. Who knows, but I have to say with this guy lying to the FBI and some of his emails in the possession of the FBI and some of the meetings that came out it's not looking good for some people higher up.

ETA - We already see Manafort was on the emails and Manafort was pretty high up during the campaign.

I think he was a small fish & when he emailed higher ups claiming he could do these big deals they said go ahead knock yourself out. jmo. One possibility out of many.

 

[LaneGirl]

I think he was a small fish & when he emailed higher ups claiming he could do these big deals they said go ahead knock yourself out. jmo. One possibility out of many.

He was and they did and some took the bait as the meeting with the foreign agency shows (the meeting DTJ, Kushner and Manafort acknowledged they met with foreign agency for "dirt" and discussed "adoptions")

FBI knows exactly who POP emailed and their response, they have the emails. We do not yet know those details.

In the indictment some of the "higher ups" are not mentioned by name. These folks are still under investigation. We do know Manafort was a higher up at that time in the campaign and he told POP "good work" when he received an email about meeting with the Russians. So not everyone ignored him.

Yet I agree will we see how far up the chain this goes.

 

[bwt42]

It's absolutely significant that POP lied to the FBI correct? I think you and I can agree on that.

So you have to ask yourself why? Why would he lie? Whats to hide if it was just innocent?

Everybody tells lie's in some form or another to many different people but lie to the FBI who can get your email, social media (which apparently he deleted) phone, bank, real estate and any records they want AND put you away for lying? Nope he had something to hide and he probably sang like a canary if not wore a wire as some are speculating.

I will agree with you re: how high up in the administration it goes though. Who knows, but I have to say with this guy lying to the FBI and some of his emails in the possession of the FBI and some of the meetings that came out it's not looking good for some people higher up.

ETA - We already see Manafort was on the emails and Manafort was pretty high up during the campaign.

Good question. Why did he lie. I've noticed that those that have lied to enhance their credentials and have gotten away with lying often will lie even when they don't have to. He may have sensed where the FBI was going with their questions & thought he could lie his way out or it. It's quite possible the only crime he committed was lying to the FBI but wasn't bright enough to realize it.

 

[LaneGirl]

Good question. Why did he lie. I've noticed that those that have lied to enhance their credentials and have gotten away with lying often will lie even when they don't have to. He may have sensed where the FBI was going with their questions & thought he could lie his way out or it. It's quite possible the only crime he committed was lying to the FBI but wasn't bright enough to realize it.

haha could be but one would have to be literally an idiot to lie to the FBI when they have access to everything.

Like I said there is lying that folks do all the time for advancement/ because they can/ because no one fact checks and then there is lying to someone (FBI) who has access to your bank, real estate, phone, and social media records AND put you in prison FOR lying to them.

The only reason one would lie to the FBI is IF they were really an idiot OR they felt like they had some sort of protection.

 

[bwt42]

Not exactly "irony", but I dig what you meant. Don't agree, but I hear you.

And also, red triangle on the bottom left of the post.

I don't play the triangle.