***SPOILER ALERT*** Imperfect Justice by Jeff Ashton - CONTENT DISCUSSION

[beach]

I've been meaning to come back and tell about my experiences, and how I ended up on the State's witness list and had to stop posting, pretty much.

<snipped>

If you only had any clue how many messages I received asking about you. :heartbeat:

I hope that everyone can understand now why I could not be more forthcoming.

It was hard since I knew how much everyone was genuinely concerned and missed you so much.

Thanks for dropping in and spilling the secret.

 

[Muzikman]

Yeah, after getting deposed by the defense, where they asked for and got my WS screen name, I thought it best to keep quiet.

When I told them my screen name, JA actually laughed out loud and LDB smiled. I think they had probably seen some of my posts. :great:
MM

<snipped>

If you only had any clue how many messages I received asking about you. :heartbeat:

I hope that everyone can understand now why I could not be more forthcoming.

It was hard since I knew how much everyone was genuinely concerned and missed you so much.

Thanks for dropping in and spilling the secret.

 

[Tiki]

Hi All,
I'm not posting - recovering from yet another cancer removing procedure (all removed again - yay).
Just want to thank you all for your reports and thoughts. I'm still upset over the verdict but I asked my BFF to get me the book if she can find one. I think I can read it with all of you here to commiserate.
xo
Tiki

 

[beach]

Hi All,
I'm not posting - recovering from yet another cancer removing procedure (all removed again - yay).
Just want to thank you all for your reports and thoughts. I'm still upset over the verdict but I asked my BFF to get me the book if she can find one. I think I can read it with all of you here to commiserate.
xo
Tiki

God bless you, Tiki! Prayers for a successful recovery and future good health. :hug:

 

[jandkmom]

Yeah, after getting deposed by the defense, where they asked for and got my WS screen name, I thought it best to keep quiet.

When I told them my screen name, JA actually laughed out loud and LDB smiled. I think they had probably seen some of my posts. :great:
MM

Welcome back Muzikman!!! What did I miss? You were called as a witness for the defense? Why were you called and why did they think your screen name was so funny?

Side note...I finished reading JA's book. It was good to get his perspective on the case. I don't remember reading anything that jumped out at me about the case. Two things that I thought were interesting but had nothing to do with the case was that JA has been married 3 times...and that LDB dressed up as KC in the jersey with the number on it and white sunglasses....lol

 

[Hope4More]

snipped for clarity (reference points)

For the jury to grasp the significance of the patterns of Casey's lies, they would have to have been:
1) interested
2) thoughtful
3) curious
4) inquisitive
5) logical
6) able to think of something other than movies, restaurants, outings, swimming pools

There was no way they would look at Casey's lying patterns and realize something was amiss.

So true about this jury. Only a silver platter case would do for them.

Specifically, as I recall from one post-verdict interview, one juror said he didn't get why the State kept harping on about OCA lying, that they all knew she was a liar, but that her lies were no proof of murder. Went right over their heads.

I'm not second guessing JA, but I will say that he relied very much on a jury's grasping what is, if not thought through, an intellectual abstraction- a pattern of lies as circumstantial evidence.

 

[AZlawyer]

So true about this jury. Only a silver platter case would do for them.

Specifically, as I recall from one post-verdict interview, one juror said he didn't get why the State kept harping on about OCA lying, that they all knew she was a liar, but that her lies were no proof of murder. Went right over their heads.

I'm not second guessing JA, but I will say that he relied very much on a jury's grasping what is, if not thought through, an intellectual abstraction- a pattern of lies as circumstantial evidence.

I sympathize with him. I have made the mistake of overestimating a jury more than once.

 

[Hope4More]

I am going back into my highlighted notes on my NOOK but haven't found it yet....

JA does not gives specific dates BUT he does mention experts say the body decomposed within 2-4 weeks and that the from the evidence the body decomposed in the car..

Going with the 2 week, Casey drove around with Caylee in the trunk until June 24-27th and dumped her in the swamp.

I use June 24th to the 27th because OCA was adamant not to let George go into the trunk and get something.
Then she started texting Amy about the smell....
by June 27th the car was abandoned and her communication with Cindy went from daily to not answering texts and phone calls and comes up with her new story about working this out with Jeff Hopkins in Jacksonville

Looks like you found the same context and answer I did (upthread) about when JA thinks OCA threw Caylee away. Glad I don't seem to have distorted what JA said on this.

 

[AZlawyer]

I am going back into my highlighted notes on my NOOK but haven't found it yet....

JA does not gives specific dates BUT he does mention experts say the body decomposed within 2-4 weeks and that the from the evidence the body decomposed in the car..

Going with the 2 week, Casey drove around with Caylee in the trunk until June 24-27th and dumped her in the swamp.

I use June 24th to the 27th because OCA was adamant not to let George go into the trunk and get something.
Then she started texting Amy about the smell....
by June 27th the car was abandoned and her communication with Cindy went from daily to not answering texts and phone calls and comes up with her new story about working this out with Jeff Hopkins in Jacksonville

The above is speculation...and I believe we have sleuthed out if Casey drove around with Caylee in the trunk for 9-11 days before dumping her.

I think we ultimately concluded that the body might have been in the trunk unbagged for only a few days (leading to the decomp finding) and then in the trunk bagged for a while longer.

 

[Hope4More]

I sympathize with him. I have made the mistake of overestimating a jury more than once.

It must be an occupational hazard of being a prosecutor.

Everything else aside, including achieving justice, I can't imagine what it would feel like have years of work,that took heart and soul as well as mind, flushed down the toilet in a few days by a handful of folks who simply couldn't be bothered.

 

[Aedrys]

Yeah, after getting deposed by the defense, where they asked for and got my WS screen name, I thought it best to keep quiet.

When I told them my screen name, JA actually laughed out loud and LDB smiled. I think they had probably seen some of my posts. :great:
MM

YAY, MUZIKMAN!!!!! So glad you see you, buddy!!!! :rocker::rocker::rocker:

Were they going after idiot bloggers or something? (Not saying you're an idiot, by the way). I'm just baffled. You were the guy that got documents for it, and probably read some, but what the heck? I can't fathom why they would even want to depose you? Can you talk about it now, or are you still not allowed because of the lying appeal?

No wonder you disappeared! So the signal wasn't broken after all, LOL!

 

[Hope4More]

I think we ultimately concluded that the body might have been in the trunk unbagged for only a few days (leading to the decomp finding) and then in the trunk bagged for a while longer.

Thanks. Haven't seen that thread, but the conclusion makes great sense and fits in with the forensics JA lays out in the book.

He doesn't mention that as a scenario, but then, he does very little laying out of possible scenarios for any aspect of the case. I got the sense he's not a speculator, at least, not at the end of the day (or case).

 

[Aedrys]

Interrupting the flow of this thread to say ---


It is so good to see so many of the old gang all back together here!!! :grouphug:


I love & miss you guys. :heartbeat: <mush mush mush>


For 3 years, on more nights than I care to count, we sleuthed until our eyes were nearly bleeding. We got as close as anyone will ever get to the TRUTH of what really happened. So many brilliant minds here...so many dedicated, caring people all working together for a common cause.... I will never take that time for granted or regret a minute of it. Despite the verdict, we made a difference. That matters. The truth matters.

:tears: <----- happy tears


:grouphug:


I got my book tonight. I was so anxious...I couldn't wait to buy it. I got the last copy Target had on the shelf. Now that I have it, I am a nervous wreck...it feels like I am about to open a partially healed wound.... Strange feeling that I didn't anticipate until after I had the book in my hands. Off to muster the courage and get started.... I hope it doesn't hurt tooooooo bad.

Awww beachie!!!! I even remember the days before you were a mod!!! Such a great post, totally agree. It seems like Jeff's book is what a lot of us needed. I haven't read mine yet, but coming here and reading about what is it in it has done a lot for me. I'm so glad his book came out first. Thank God for Jeff Ashton and everyone who fought for Caylee for so long. Not even the Pinellas 12 can take back those three years or so from any of us. We should be proud of everyone involved and even ourselves. Not even Casey being free can take that away from us. I find myself less angry these days and more hopeful of a better future and nostalgic of the time we all shared. I think the one that is most miserable is Casey. She can't get on with her life, while we all can, with Caylee in our hearts forever. *big hugs and love*

Thank you Jeff Ashton, for everything you've done, especially this book. I'll never, ever forget you. And I, along with everyone else, will never forget Caylee.

 

[beach]

I sympathize with him. I have made the mistake of overestimating a jury more than once.

Well heck. It is hard for intelligent people to not assume that most of the general population possesses some common sense and a sense of morality.

 

[zippitydoda]

Yeah, after getting deposed by the defense, where they asked for and got my WS screen name, I thought it best to keep quiet.

When I told them my screen name, JA actually laughed out loud and LDB smiled. I think they had probably seen some of my posts. :great:
MM

WOW.... just wow. This case continues to just shock me over and over - it&#8217;s a never ending story. Muzikman, for me, your absence was so quick and so for long - and I'm just stunned by your revelation as to why, but now understand. You were responsible for providing us here with so much information, all for Caylee's cause, and I appreciate all that you did.

 

[Muzikman]

Welcome back Muzikman!!! What did I miss? You were called as a witness for the defense? Why were you called and why did they think your screen name was so funny?

Side note...I finished reading JA's book. It was good to get his perspective on the case. I don't remember reading anything that jumped out at me about the case. Two things that I thought were interesting but had nothing to do with the case was that JA has been married 3 times...and that LDB dressed up as KC in the jersey with the number on it and white sunglasses....lol

No, the State. I think they thought it was funny because they probably read some of my defense-slamming posts, and because I always got docs so everyone here could sleuth them.

 

[logicalgirl]

Awww, Thanks Aedrys and everyone. I miss getting the bat signal! LOL

I've been meaning to come back and tell about my experiences, and how I ended up on the State's witness list and had to stop posting, pretty much.

But life gets in the way... finally got a job - actually, 3 of them - and have had little time to do much else... and of course, I was completely disgusted with the verdict, and heartbroken.

But I'll try to spend a little time here.... I got Jeff's book of course, but haven't had time to get more than a couple chapters read so far.
MM

OMG!!! :bow: :bow: :bow: I have talked and talked about you and what you did for us here - you were the best!! But I never thought about sending up the bat signal so thank you Aedrys!

Seriously Muzikman - thank you for dropping in and saying hello! You played such a huge role in the three years leading up to the trial that you left a huge hole in a hearts after the verdict! It was so painful that many of our long term members never did return. But let me take this time to say thank you thank you again. You did wonderful work and I know all of us WSers thank you for being "Our Guy".

Hey congrats on your three jobs - now there's a heap of karma love for you!

 

[Muzikman]

YAY, MUZIKMAN!!!!! So glad you see you, buddy!!!! :rocker::rocker::rocker:

Were they going after idiot bloggers or something? (Not saying you're an idiot, by the way). I'm just baffled. You were the guy that got documents for it, and probably read some, but what the heck? I can't fathom why they would even want to depose you? Can you talk about it now, or are you still not allowed because of the lying appeal?

No wonder you disappeared! So the signal wasn't broken after all, LOL!

No, it was because of my involvement in another area, mainly. Have to wait a bit before talking about some of it still, unfortunately. But Beach wants to have a Q&A thread, which I would very much like to do. :rocker::rocker::rocker:

 

[logicalgirl]

Awww beachie!!!! I even remember the days before you were a mod!!! Such a great post, totally agree. It seems like Jeff's book is what a lot of us needed. I haven't read mine yet, but coming here and reading about what is it in it has done a lot for me. I'm so glad his book came out first. Thank God for Jeff Ashton and everyone who fought for Caylee for so long. Not even the Pinellas 12 can take back those three years or so from any of us. We should be proud of everyone involved and even ourselves. Not even Casey being free can take that away from us. I find myself less angry these days and more hopeful of a better future and nostalgic of the time we all shared. I think the one that is most miserable is Casey. She can't get on with her life, while we all can, with Caylee in our hearts forever. *big hugs and love*

Thank you Jeff Ashton, for everything you've done, especially this book. I'll never, ever forget you. And I, along with everyone else, will never forget Caylee.

Thank you Aedrys - you've said it all right there! :blowkiss:

 

[chefmom]

Yeah, after getting deposed by the defense, where they asked for and got my WS screen name, I thought it best to keep quiet.

When I told them my screen name, JA actually laughed out loud and LDB smiled. I think they had probably seen some of my posts. :great:
MM

So glad you weren't hooked by one of their fishing expeditions! Lol! Sooo looking forward to hearing more about this when you have time! And welcome back! You have been sorely missed!