State vs. Jason Lynn Young 2-24-2012

[Madeleine74]

It doesn't require a stop at Applebees to find a lawyer first. One always has the ability and right to decline to speak with police. And you don't have to have the lawyer before you decline. You can simply do as JY did...and hide in a back bedroom. Or, just say, "I won't speak without an attorney." Period. End of Statement.

 

[Cammy]

I thought he stopped at Applebees before going to Merediths after he realized that he should lawyer up. It sounded to me like they thought he might be confronted by the police while at Merediths and wanted to figure out how to handle that.

Thank you, Fromage........and.......they never went inside., according to Heather, unless maybe they used the bathroom....
that's possible, maybe.

But, not to eat.

Heather will be on the stand soon enough.....

Besides, the Pros would have went there and got the receipt to show they ate there and were stalling or something.

 

[Mama-cita]

I thought he stopped at Applebees before going to Merediths after he realized that he should lawyer up. It sounded to me like they thought he might be confronted by the police while at Merediths and wanted to figure out how to handle that.

And what better way to do that than over a $14.99 three course combo at Applebee's? Seriously. I don't get how anything you said in your quote would make what he did any less repulsive...IMO and all...

 

[Wolfpack]

As a general rule, would a defense attorney NOT ask their client whether they committed the offense or not? I am not sure how criminal defense attorneys operate (read: look at themselves in the mirror) but maybe they can justify what they do by saying they didn't really know bc they didn't ask? How else could someone defend a wife/baby killer, child rapist, or any of the other sickos out there that get arrested?

No, you don't ask.

 

[Cammy]

His talk at last trial isn't evidence at this trial.

JMO

Saacks isn't even this trial.
That was a theory he had, not proof.

 

[gritguy]

As a general rule, would a defense attorney NOT ask their client whether they committed the offense or not? I am not sure how criminal defense attorneys operate (read: look at themselves in the mirror) but maybe they can justify what they do by saying they didn't really know bc they didn't ask? How else could someone defend a wife/baby killer, child rapist, or any of the other sickos out there that get arrested?

A defense attorney can believe their client is innocent of course. But as to the general rule, the idea is that the role of the defense attorney is a necessary counterweight to the power of the state. So, if the defense attorney does her job, and the state fails to gain a conviction, despite its resources and the assistance of law enforcement, then it is the state's failure and not the defense attorney. That covers sleeping. I know a lot of good people who are criminal defense attorneys; it just wasn't for me.

Also, you have to be careful what you know, to some degree, when you are a criminal defense attorney (ok any attorney :-D), due to the responsibility for candor to the court. For sake of everyone's sanity, I'll post the rule in the legal thread. Long story short, you can't offer evidence you know is false - you can't lie to the court. So, if you don't know it's not true, you can still do it.

 

[Mama-cita]

No, you don't ask.

Thanks for replying. Is it because they want to be able to "live with themselves" or are they obligated to report certain things if they were made aware of them or is there another reason entirely?

 

[dmaxphil]

No blood was found near the hose or anywhere outside, Dmax.

Jason said he had cut the grass that afternoon and used the hose.

I know this. I was pointing out to someone else that blood does not vanish into nothingness once you add water.

 

[fromageball]

And what better way to do that than over a $14.99 three course combo at Applebee's? Seriously. I don't get how anything you said in your quote would make what he did any less repulsive...IMO and all...

He could have stopped anywhere, I think he just stopped to have some time to figure out a game plan before going to Meredith's house since he knew he was a suspect and police would probably want to talk to him.

Guilty or innocent, I'm sure he was scared and wanted to make sure he didn't slip up and incriminate himself.

 

[gorealtors]

I thought he stopped at Applebees before going to Merediths after he realized that he should lawyer up. It sounded to me like they thought he might be confronted by the police while at Merediths and wanted to figure out how to handle that.

Isn't the dinner @ Applebees just so telling? You'd think the crowd in that vehicle, if they could even muster the strength to eat, would have just hit the McDonald's drive thru and kept on getting it down the highway. Instead, they chose to dine at a sit down restaurant which probably took nearly an hour from start to finish. Afterall, let's get our priorities in order!hoh:

 

[Cammy]

And what better way to do that than over a $14.99 three course combo at Applebee's? Seriously. I don't get how anything you said in your quote would make what he did any less repulsive...IMO and all...

Not if they didn't eat there to begin with....

I find it more strange that a man planning to kill his wife would go to Cracker
Barrel and eat before committing a murder.

 

[Wolfpack]

Thanks for replying. Is it because they want to be able to "live with themselves" or are they obligated to report certain things if they were made aware of them or is there another reason entirely?

I think gritguy explained it best. They cannot lie to the court. And if you know your client is guilty, you cannot stand up there and say "He is innocent" in your closing argument. If you don't know, you can say it.

I think defense attorneys serve an honorable purpose, and they have a very difficult and often thankless job. I am sure some lose sleep at night, but it is a necessary job, commanded by the constitution. And no one wants to see anyone locked away without the vigorous defense he is entitled to.

John Adams and his description of the necessity of defense attorneys during the Boston Massacre trials would be an interesting read for anyone on the subject.

 

[Cammy]

I know this. I was pointing out to someone else that blood does not vanish into nothingness once you add water.

I know, and I agree.

There are always traces....

 

[Madeleine74]

As a famous defense attorney once said (I don't remember who, I just remember his statement), "how do we sleep at night? On 800 thread count sheets and quite well, thank you."

 

[Cammy]

He could have stopped anywhere, I think he just stopped to have some time to figure out a game plan before going to Meredith's house since he knew he was a suspect and police would probably want to talk to him.

Guilty or innocent, I'm sure he was scared and wanted to make sure he didn't slip up and incriminate himself.

He was prolly scared..

Heather will be on the stand to tell about the Applebee's stop this week.

:wink:

 

[MyBelle]

SS was definitely coming over later. Babysitter and MY were having the conversation as MY picked up CY from daycare. Late. SS was not there yet. Therefore, she was coming later.

SS didn't come over later, she brought dinner. This fact was established at the first trial.

I don't believe the daycare worker was personal friends with Michelle or Shelly.

JMO

 

[gracielee]

As a general rule, would a defense attorney NOT ask their client whether they committed the offense or not? I am not sure how criminal defense attorneys operate (read: look at themselves in the mirror) but maybe they can justify what they do by saying they didn't really know bc they didn't ask? How else could someone defend a wife/baby killer, child rapist, or any of the other sickos out there that get arrested?

I don't think they ever ask their client 'if they committed the crime'. If they did, they would carry a certain legal obligation to not commit perjury in their questioning.

As an aside, I was once asked to be a witness in a case and the attorney who asked for the information I had, also asked a number of questions of me. Attempting to ascertain what sort of things *could possibly* come up on a cross exam of me. His wording of the questions I found to be precise. Like 'can anyone testify as to if you've had any extra marital affairs?' Not, 'have you got any lovers out there' that could be used to muddy up your testimony. :fence: It was specifically phrased to 'is there anyone who can testify to..... such and such' stuff about me to impeach my testimony by the other camp. :waitasec: :rocker: :floorlaugh:

 

[Cammy]

A defense attorney can believe their client is innocent of course. But as to the general rule, the idea is that the role of the defense attorney is a necessary counterweight to the power of the state. So, if the defense attorney does her job, and the state fails to gain a conviction, despite its resources and the assistance of law enforcement, then it is the state's failure and not the defense attorney. That covers sleeping. I know a lot of good people who are criminal defense attorneys; it just wasn't for me.

Also, you have to be careful what you know, to some degree, when you are a criminal defense attorney (ok any attorney :-D), due to the responsibility for candor to the court. For sake of everyone's sanity, I'll post the rule in the legal thread. Long story short, you can't offer evidence you know is false - you can't lie to the court. So, if you don't know it's not true, you can still do it.

What if a client confesses to their attorney at some point?
What does he do then?

BTW, have you ever seen The Lincoln Lawyer?

Great movie, GG.

There is a scene where the defense laywer is so disgusted
with the piece of crap he is defending, that he sets him up
beautifully to take the fall.

Pretty genius.

 

[gitana1]

As a general rule, would a defense attorney NOT ask their client whether they committed the offense or not? I am not sure how criminal defense attorneys operate (read: look at themselves in the mirror) but maybe they can justify what they do by saying they didn't really know bc they didn't ask? How else could someone defend a wife/baby killer, child rapist, or any of the other sickos out there that get arrested?

Defense attorneys usually never ask because if the answer was yes, that their client did it, they could not present evidence to the contrary. That is a breach of the code of ethics.

 

[gritguy]

As a famous defense attorney once said (I don't remember who, I just remember his statement), "how do we sleep at night? On 800 thread count sheets and quite well, thank you."

Also told to me, with regard to how far you go for a client, "At the end of the trial, if someone is going to jail, make sure it is your client and not you."

As well, "If the facts are on your side, pound on the facts. If the law is on your side, pound on the law. If you don't have either, pound on the table."