the cadaver dog

[brit1981]

snipped by me from here
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES.htm

CANINE SEARCH OF MR MURAT'S PROPERTY.

The property was subjected to a search for human remains or blood stained
articles. The outside of property was stripped of vegetation and after the
ground being probed was searched by the EVRD dog. The inside of the
property was then searched by the dog. There were no alert indications and
no human remains were located.

Your "facts" don't seem to tally with the official reports, yet you state them as proof, do you have any evidence to back up your claim?

If you look at my entire post you will see I am replying to a comment about the Prout case NOt anything to do with Murat - I have even quoted the comment I am replying to where one can see it is about Prout and not Murat. Here is the entire post including the quoted comment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clutchbag
what rubbish

Eddie did not take part in the search for kate prouts body in the grounds of the farm recently, why lie??? Oh i know, to discredit the cadaver dog that alerted in the mccann case, duh

Eddie did though INDEED take part in the original search in the house and alerted years back and guess what, he was right
Eddie took part in the original search in the house and grounds. he barke din the house where no body was ever found, but failed to bark when searching in the burial area. That was only found because the killer told the police where the body was. If the dog was so accurate like the red tops would tell their readers, one might think they might have noticed the decomposing body under their paws.

(I am assuming you had missed this bit and were not of the belief that Murat's home was searched for Kate Prout)

 

[Clutchbag]

Eddie took part in the original search in the house and grounds. he barke din the house where no body was ever found, but failed to bark when searching in the burial area. That was only found because the killer told the police where the body was. If the dog was so accurate like the red tops would tell their readers, one might think they might have noticed the decomposing body under their paws.

ah i see you were talking about the initial search and not the recent search with cadaver dogs of which eddie took no part seeing as he has been retired

Do u have a link for info that eddie searched the whole farm? And failed to alert? Cheers

that he alerted in the house is proof that he detected a death scent, why no praise from you on that score

 

[Clutchbag]

If you are quoting the book, would you be able to put the page number in?

TIA.

Perhaps she meant "to the human nose".

I know scent detectable to dogs can last for months or even years in the right conditions.

I dont have a page number but from memory she said death scent is made up of putrescine and cadaverine, which is false anyway, and that these chemicals last no more than one month

You have to laugh though that gerry mccann says it was HIM who requested the cadaver dogs to be brought in in july

like attracts like they say the pair of them are liars

 

[brit1981]

I dont have a page number but from memory she said death scent is made up of putrescine and cadaverine, which is false anyway, and that these chemicals last no more than one month

You have to laugh though that gerry mccann says it was HIM who requested the cadaver dogs to be brought in in july

like attracts like they say the pair of them are liars

Can you provide a link to a primary source that has Gerry claiming this?

 

[brit1981]

ah i see you were talking about the initial search and not the recent search with cadaver dogs of which eddie took no part seeing as he has been retired

Do u have a link for info that eddie searched the whole farm? And failed to alert? Cheers

that he alerted in the house is proof that he detected a death scent, why no praise from you on that score

No it is not proof as eddie alerts to cadaver scent and bodily fluids according to his handler. Most homes will have bodily fluids including dried blood from living humans in them, so little eddie's barks mean nothing. It might have meant more if he actually found a body that humans were unable to smell or see, but although it is claimed he will detect tiny amounts of "cadaver scent" he seems to have missed over a hundred pounds of decomposing human in this case.

 

[fabgod]

If you look at my entire post you will see I am replying to a comment about the Prout case NOt anything to do with Murat - I have even quoted the comment I am replying to where one can see it is about Prout and not Murat. Here is the entire post including the quoted comment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clutchbag
what rubbish

Eddie did not take part in the search for kate prouts body in the grounds of the farm recently, why lie??? Oh i know, to discredit the cadaver dog that alerted in the mccann case, duh

Eddie did though INDEED take part in the original search in the house and alerted years back and guess what, he was right
Eddie took part in the original search in the house and grounds. he barke din the house where no body was ever found, but failed to bark when searching in the burial area. That was only found because the killer told the police where the body was. If the dog was so accurate like the red tops would tell their readers, one might think they might have noticed the decomposing body under their paws.

(I am assuming you had missed this bit and were not of the belief that Murat's home was searched for Kate Prout)

Amazing!
Even though I didnt read your post correctly (because I'm assuming they seem to all be the same points incorrectly presented as fact)
yet even though my post was wrong the end result was still the same,

"your post doesnt seem to tally with official reports"

Not to worry, lol

 

[brit1981]

Fab,
do you have the official reports into the Prout case? If you have been given the official police files could you post a link to them? Do they state that Eddie only searched the house could you provide a link to where you go this information as I was not aware the police had released their official files.

 

[fabgod]

Fab,
do you have the official reports into the Prout case? If you have been given the official police files could you post a link to them? Do they state that Eddie only searched the house could you provide a link to where you go this information as I was not aware the police had released their official files.

Ha Ha,
Where does it say Official police files?


"your post doesnt seem to tally with official reports"

 

[brit1981]

Ha Ha,
Where does it say Official police files?


"your post doesnt seem to tally with official reports"

Ok, so you have been given access to the official police reports then rather than just the media reports?

 

[Clutchbag]

Can you provide a link to a primary source that has Gerry claiming this?

He said it in one of the two irish interviews last year when asked about the dog findings, you can youtube it

here you go, do a search in youtube for the following title

McCann's Irish RTE Late Late Show Interview May 13 2011

 

[fabgod]

Ok, so you have been given access to the official police reports then rather than just the media reports?

for the last time, where did I mention "Police" ?

"your post doesnt seem to tally with official reports"
thats my quote, same as it always was!


Kate Prouts body was found on a 276 acre farm in woodland.When Prout was taken back to the farm to show police the body, he was driven from the farm to the woodland (It doesnt take a Scientist, to work out that is a fair distance)
It was found in Woodland on the edge of the land, thats a little different from a two bed apartment in Portugal for example.

Lets not forget that Eddie alerted in the property and following a confession, a body was found and Adrian Prout confessed to killing his wife.
However that is presented, it certainly looks like another good result for the Dogs to me lol!

Just to put the truth out there, I post the following
Martin Grimes Rogatory report
14th May 2008
'The dog EVRD also alerts to blood from a live human being or only from a cadaver'

The dog EVRD is trained using whole and disintegrated material, blood, bone tissue, teeth, etc. and decomposed cross-contaminants. The dog will recognize all or parts of a human cadaver. He is not trained for 'live' human odours; no trained dog will recognize the smell of 'fresh blood'. They find, however, and give the alert for dried blood from a live human being.


Not a bad success record for the dogs, especially as they are "so unreliable"
I just cannot understand how they alerted so many times in the McCann case, oh maybe I can!

 

[badhorsie]

for the last time, where did I mention "Police" ?

"your post doesnt seem to tally with official reports"
thats my quote, same as it always was!


Kate Prouts body was found on a 276 acre farm in woodland.When Prout was taken back to the farm to show police the body, he was driven from the farm to the woodland (It doesnt take a Scientist, to work out that is a fair distance)
It was found in Woodland on the edge of the land, thats a little different from a two bed apartment in Portugal for example.

Lets not forget that Eddie alerted in the property and following a confession, a body was found and Adrian Prout confessed to killing his wife.
However that is presented, it certainly looks like another good result for the Dogs to me lol!

Just to put the truth out there, I post the following
Martin Grimes Rogatory report
14th May 2008
'The dog EVRD also alerts to blood from a live human being or only from a cadaver'

The dog EVRD is trained using whole and disintegrated material, blood, bone tissue, teeth, etc. and decomposed cross-contaminants. The dog will recognize all or parts of a human cadaver. He is not trained for 'live' human odours; no trained dog will recognize the smell of 'fresh blood'. They find, however, and give the alert for dried blood from a live human being.


Not a bad success record for the dogs, especially as they are "so unreliable"
I just cannot understand how they alerted so many times in the McCann case, oh maybe I can!

Coloured and bolded by me, this. What does Brit1981 not understand about this statement and why is there the need to repeat over and over the myth that Eddie reacts to bodily fluids from a live human?

 

[Clutchbag]

Coloured and bolded by me, this. What does Brit1981 not understand about this statement and why is there the need to repeat over and over the myth that Eddie reacts to bodily fluids from a live human?

Exactly, and to go on and say eddie was NOT a cadaver dog when its blindingly obvious that is exactly what he was trained for

There are people on the internet saying he was just a security dog too, you have to laugh at the desperation of such statements and the mind boggles really, what is it that really bothers some about the cadaver dog alerts

 

[Clutchbag]

McCann's Irish RTE Late Late Show Interview May 13 2011 - YouTube

Listen at 27 21 where gerry says the dogs were brought in on their request brit81

Found it

is that not a lie? and a brazen faced one At best

 

[Cappuccino]

Coloured and bolded by me, this. What does Brit1981 not understand about this statement and why is there the need to repeat over and over the myth that Eddie reacts to bodily fluids from a live human?

Badhorsie, read the paragraph you bolded again. The last sentence contradicts you - "They find, however, and give the alert for dried blood from a live human being."

 

[Clutchbag]

Badhorsie, read the paragraph you bolded again. The last sentence contradicts you - "They find, however, and give the alert for dried blood from a live human being."

that doesnt change very much at all
though see the huge problem? Eddies alerts in the oarents bedroom, the clothes, the toy, the verandah, the garden, NONE of which were to blood so what were they to?
And not forgetting Lerts ONLY in the place where somekne has gone *missing* from and no where else

 

[badhorsie]

Badhorsie, read the paragraph you bolded again. The last sentence contradicts you - "They find, however, and give the alert for dried blood from a live human being."

Which is why he was paired with the CSI (or blood) dog, Keela. Martin Grime says this himself

 

[fabgod]

Its all playing with words,
the facts are that Eddie alerted to Cadaver odour and blood from a live person, it doesnt matter how it is twisted they are the facts of what the dog was trained for.

Its easy to play with the words but we all know the truth, it gets very tiresome to see the same post saying the same twist on what was reported, why not bring something else to the table?
Ive tried timelines but there is no interest except the same old "dogs are useless" "look at Jersey" "Shannon Matthews", the overwhelming evidence is that Cadaver dogs do an excellent job, there are many many examples of the positive work they do.

Its responses like the above that bring the McCanns even more into question in my opinion, the fact is there wasnt enough of anything to corroborate or confirm anything that the Dogs alerted to, but that doesnt mean they were wrong.
If there is such a desperate need to discredit the dogs why?
Why not just accept the dogs alerted, it doesnt matter in the investigation, if it did, there would have been charges.

For the case to progress, there needs to be more evidence, where that is from, who knows? but just going round and round with the same post is wasting everyones time on what is supposedly a site for sleuthing, not trying to have the last word on everything even when it has been proven as incorrect, its pointless

 

[Kimster]

Chill out in here. I'm not familiar with this forum and may accidentally use my ray gun on some innocent poster. :angel:

So be nice and discuss the case rather than boss each other around. :tyou:

 

[Cappuccino]

This thread is about the cadaver dog, which is why that's what I'm posting about in here. There's nothing stopping anybody from discussing timelines, or whatever else they want to in the relevant threads.

Cadaver dogs are far from infallible. The Shannon Matthews case is one example where a cadaver dog alerted and the child was recovered alive. In that case, apparently second hand furniture from a home where someone had died was the cause of the dog's false positive.

So do we know the history of this apartment and the furniture in it?