the question phase continues: Arias on the stand for the 18th day #85

[Rileyanne]

well I tend to agree with you but...let's say it cannot be proven she brought the murder weapon with her, which it cannot be if it's the knife. Then we have a garden variety knife fight. The gun did not kill him and was used last, after he was dead, or maybe as a way to put him out of his suffering when he was near death.

So far, this is the State's case, and I cannot for the life of me figure out why because that is not murder one.

"Garden variety knife fight" ??? Stabbing an unarmed man 29 times and slitting his throat ear to ear is "garden variety knife fight" ???

 

[katiewonders]

Where is that picture? I have not been able to decipher it if in fact I saw it?

Here it is:
http://i.huffpost.com/gadgets/slideshows/273021/slide_273021_1985286_free.jpg?1358207900380


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/...ne-photos_n_2412031.html#slide=1985286:seeya:

edited to add: I didn't notice the socks when I first saw this photo, if that doesn't speak of premeditation -- "oh, your attacking me, I feel in danger of losing my life, oh, wait, let me put these dark socks over my shoes first." wow.

 

[sacrablue]

BBM

So true and to the point. I have been up over 24 hrs now because reading some of the posts last night in regards to questioning why Travis didn't do this or that, after he had the warning signs... just bothered me so much. I get someone not understanding this but when others take the time to explain it only to have it blatantly ignored just really bothers me as a victim and for all victims. .sigh.

Can we have a reverse role here? We are used to hearing, as you are very aware of, of the male being the dominate problem in a relationship. Could the female be the person that enjoys the 'different' activity and holds the male in hostage?

 

[Nali87]

well I tend to agree with you but...let's say it cannot be proven she brought the murder weapon with her, which it cannot be if it's the knife. Then we have a garden variety knife fight. The gun did not kill him and was used last, after he was dead, or maybe as a way to put him out of his suffering when he was near death.

So far, this is the State's case, and I cannot for the life of me figure out why because that is not murder one.

Well a lot of people have already responded as to why the gun is important for pre meditation. But I think it's important that we focus on those 62 seconds available for her murdering him and his body somehow ending up in the hall. For her to have shot and stabbed him both weapons should've been close by.

On the other thing, I think she's also charged with Felony Murder with as underlying felony "aggravated assault". She assaulted TA and that felony resulted in death. I think they can get her that way too but premeditation is their best bet. Like I said before the focus shouldn't be on the knife and or gun, it's on the steps she took before even arriving in Arizona.

IMO.

 

[molly333]

I respectfully disagree
Pre meditation imo isnt just about bringing a weapon with you or such it can be something that is decided in minutes irrespective if you brought a weapon with you.

Someone posted a great example of premeditated murder vs unplanned but it was many threads ago so I can't find it

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

well, that's why her own testimony is so damaging to her because she had disabled him and then went and got a knife to finish him off. That by itself could be premeditation. Except for two flies in the ointment:

The State disagrees.

The expert witnesses will probably say she was in a fugue state at that point and had no idea what she was doing.

IMO

 

[Mykeru]

What's a "POSECUTOR"?

Is that like a choreographer for runway models?

 

[Ammonitida]

It's not murder one if she doesn't use the gun to kill him, per the ME's testimony.

Wrong. That she brought the gun with her and lied about how she acquired it and eventually used it during the murder should be enough to prove murder one. If the jury actually believes the ME sequence of events, then her whole story is a fabrication and based on the other evidence they will have to assume that she brought the knife with her and premeditated his murder with it. How could they even think of 2nd degree under those circumstances?

 

[luvtenniss]

I've been debating whether or not to post some of the clearly psychopathic behaviors of my ex...not just the abusive ones. (For those not in the know - not all abusers are psychopaths but all psychopaths are abusive. Studies also seems to suggest a much higher prevalence of psychopathy among those who abuse. Not really all that surprising, I guess. )

I will, just a handful, only to illustrate you well and truly just cannot anticipate what a psychopath is capable of. This is just a small list off the top of my head.

My ex had the woman he was having an affair with pose as a guy to befriend me online. Over the course of several months I began to confide in whom I thought was a friend. Once I told 'him' how unhappy I was in my marriage my ex magically appeared with printouts of every single conversation I'd had, accusing me of being unfaithful and cheating on him. The printouts were redacted to 'engineer' damning evidence...or rather, misconstrue anything that even reasonably could be.

Stole my mother's wedding ring from the biomedical bag the hospital returned it in following her death.

Stole $5,000 from my father while he was in extremely poor health. My father passed away two weeks after this and I paid the estate back through my inheritance.

Secretly opened an account I could not access in order to move my inheritance from our joint account to only his.

Attempted suicide in front of his 12 year old daughter after calling me, in front of her, to tell me I could explain to her how it was my fault her daddy was dead.

Told my 14 year old niece he would never have raped her had I not left the marriage. Then denied ever doing it at all, or saying that, then plead guilty to avoid a longer sentence.

Told his family, with such conviction, how horrible I was they ultimately believed him and became proxies in intimidation, cyber stalking, and abusive behaviors. My teenage nieces, who were online friends, would apprise my ex of every blog post, photo, and update only friends could see. My ex-MIL sent my ex, by this time in prison, a picture of my house in England from google earth. My ex sent me a birthday card with a hand drawn rendition on my house on the front.

My ex didn't so much as wish me a happy birthday for our first seven years together - yet at a surprise party thrown by my sister years later he gave me a diamond necklace. Gotta keep up appearances, donthcha know.

Stole our son's video games and console so our son would prefer to spend time with his dad - yet he made it very clear he had no use for our daughter. Even now, he sends cards and letters to our son but misses our daughter's birthday every single year.
---------------------------------------------------------
After all this I can only add there is no preparation in life for a psychopath. They don't come with a warning label and at first appear to be perfect beyond measure. I didn't know anything was really wrong until I was so deeply trapped in the relationship I couldn't leave easily.

Post-abuse, post-relationship...I have to monitor communications between ex and kiddos after several abusive and threatening letters to them. I personally maintain a very strict no contact with ex and ex-MIL. I educate munchkins about their's father's behaviors that are unacceptable and why. And kiddos have been coached about what they can't tell their grandmother, because she will tell their father, and he will use it against us somehow. It isn't ideal - but no contact and ensuring my privacy (which stems against how much the psychopath can use to hurt you) is really the only way I've found of 'coping'.

Hugs to you! Can not even imagine. How does someone like that happen? It makes no sense. I wish and pray for wonderful things for you - you are truly a person of strength. I don't know if I could be as strong.

 

[Nali87]

I think it was proved that the gun came with her. The prosecution provided the evidence that a 25 auto was stolen 5 days before she embarked on her murder trip that would see Travis dead by a gunshot from 25. Her eventual disposal of the weapon being another indication that she owned the gun at one time. Her illogical stories about Travis's gun, her twice telling detectives that Travis didn't own handguns early on in the investigation. You link it together and it becomes PROOF.

Good point.
If it was HIS gun, why didn't she leave it? She would've tried to clean up fingerprints and left it just like she left the camera. I think she took it up with her because it was her grandfather's gun and it would undoubtly link to her.
She used HIS camera and left it there. (I assume to play into her "this-was-personal-hit against Travis. It wasn't a burglary. That's why they didn't shoot me" story)




----
O/T: when I type really fast I make a lot of errors. I'm dutch, I have an excuse.

 

[TartLemon]

The reason I believe there WAS a rope is because she had a whole bag of tricks to 'rope' Travis in with some sex play. The rope was not measured/cut like she said, but it was there. Jodi cleaned the scene and took everything she thought would implicate her. Rope, knife, gun, KY. I also believe gloves and ski mask because of the big deal she made about them to the detective. All there in the bag she took with her.

When Jodi tells the story of the fantasies, she is the one in charge of the planning, venue and decor.

Deleted the photos but didn't take the camera because it would have been obviously gone. Besides, the camera was not on her mental contents list to remove.

'You wanna play rough, Big Boy? I'll show you rough."

 

[Renee110]

I think the camera was HUGE for the prosecution in this case. How eerie is it that the camera snapped pictures like that?

I'm not a particularly super religious person, but I remember when I first saw this on the news, I said, "God took those pictures". I still think that.

 

[Nali87]

Maybe it would help if you read up on the law. Sounds like you don't really have a grasp on it, no offense.

Well law is very complicated. It took me a while to understand why she'd be charged on felony murder as well. And why overkill couldn't be part of self defense if she was operating under a very emotional/hysterical state of mind.

:waitasec:
IMO.

 

[josie1986]

Exactly. You can plan to kill someone and use their knife or use your hands or their gun. It is the plan to kill prior to the act of doing so no matter how many seconds before doing so. ty

Im glad that made sense to someone apart from me.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

 

[leebee52]

I need help. Cannot for the life of me find any such button at sign in to keep me signed in. All I find is "remember me". Can someone please tell me where it is?

 

[rhondavous]

Does the admonishment rule apply to the expert witnesses?

 

[Laine]

Agree, no rope. But she may have thrown some things in a dumpster. Although, it seems to me that she would think that was too discoverable. Really want to know what she did with the evidence - clothes, gun, etc. Maybe someone followed her footsteps and found something? I can wish!!!

Perhaps set fire to them out in the desert? Have a vague recollection of a post somewhere that mentioned the hire company saying the car smelt of smoke. (anyone feel free to correct me if that's not true)

 

[SoBeCzar]

Murder 1 is being charged two ways... premed and also during the commission of a felony/ burglary.

What was the felony /burglary?

 

[Nali87]

I need help. Cannot for the life of me find any such button at sign in to keep me signed in. All I find is "remember me". Can someone please tell me where it is?

"Remember me" will keep you signed in. Just check the little box next to it.

 

[InTheGarden]

I've been thinking of the crumpled duck tape that was found in TA's home (unsure of the location). Could this tape have been used by JA to tape the gun and knife somewhere under the vanity in the master bathroom? Would fit into the plan of the attack in the shower, quickly grab both from under the sink.

Also, have the measurements of the master closet been released? Anyone out there with similar closets willing to give out the measurements?

 

[The Farm]

Here it is:
http://i.huffpost.com/gadgets/slideshows/273021/slide_273021_1985286_free.jpg?1358207900380


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/...ne-photos_n_2412031.html#slide=1985286:seeya:

edited to add: I didn't notice the socks when I first saw this photo, if that doesn't speak of premeditation -- "oh, your attacking me, I feel in danger of losing my life, oh, wait, let me put these dark socks over my shoes first." wow.

Thank You katie, I saw that picture before and all I can make out is his foot and shoulders. So actually that was the picture but I just do not see it.
Very scary though. How do you explain that away??????