The ransom note & Patsy Ramsey, letter by letter.

[Ames]

oh, and probably the most important point that horatio brings up..how quickly they called the cops. If they really discovered the note, wouldnt you take a minute to collect yourself and discuss whether or not you should involve the police? It seems one of them should have disagreed with calling the cops, neither of them thought it was an issue at all.

What I don't get is...why did Patsy do the 911 calling, instead of John?? She admitted that she was hysterical, and John was "calm and collected". Okayyyyy...so, let's choose the hysterical one to make the 911 call. Yeah, okay...THAT makes "sense". IMO...Patsy was the chosen one, because she was the actress in the family. (BTW...that heavy breathing of hers during that 911 call, just got on my nerves).

 

[horatio]

Do you think computer analysis will ever progress to the point where PR could absolutely be verified as the RN writer and have it be admissible in a court of law? I think given enough writing samples (before she changed her writing style) a computer would probably match the handwriting. DNA & polygraphs are widely accepted, why not computer handwriting analysis?

 

[freshwater]

Do you think computer analysis will ever progress to the point where PR could absolutely be verified as the RN writer and have it be admissible in a court of law? I think given enough writing samples (before she changed her writing style) a computer would probably match the handwriting. DNA & polygraphs are widely accepted, why not computer handwriting analysis?

In what court of law are polygraphs ever accepted? Ummm, no.

 

[azwriter]

I´ve a question
I do not know who wrote the RN ,either whether PR is a smart woman or not...
why did she write such a long RN and the amount 118.000?

I'm raising my hand, here. The RN was written simply to explain why the dead body of their daughter would be found in the basement of the house. It was a blueprint, a way to cover what really happened and lead cops toward investigating a kidnap/murder that did not really happen. jmo

 

[BBB167893]

Do you think computer analysis will ever progress to the point where PR could absolutely be verified as the RN writer and have it be admissible in a court of law? I think given enough writing samples (before she changed her writing style) a computer would probably match the handwriting. DNA & polygraphs are widely accepted, why not computer handwriting analysis?

I sure HOPE so!

 

[horatio]

In what court of law are polygraphs ever accepted? Ummm, no.

Obviously they're not used to convict someone, but they are accepted as a type of evidence.

 

[joeskidbeck]

I'm raising my hand, here. The RN was written simply to explain why the dead body of their daughter would be found in the basement of the house. It was a blueprint, a way to cover what really happened and lead cops toward investigating a kidnap/murder that did not really happen. jmo

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap: Good summation az! Short and to the point, exactly the way this case should have been handled before money and connections robbed Jonbenet of justice.

 

[horatio]

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap: Good summation az! Short and to the point, exactly the way this case should have been handled before money and connections robbed Jonbenet of justice.

Pretty much what I think.

My post from earlier in this thread:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5993467&postcount=175"]http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5993467&postcount=175[/ame]

 

[DeeDee249]

Polygraphs are not admissible as any kind of evidence. They can be manipulated if you know how. In the case of the Rs, JR said he'd be "insulted" to be asked. Patsy said she'd "take 10 of them" and never took one administered by LE. Years later, they hired their own polygrapher, but they had to take the tests several times before they "passed". If you take them enough times and are asked the same questions enough times eventually you can give a false answer without registering a "lie".
BUT when it is known that someone has refused a polygraph, just like when some invokes the "Fifth Amendment" right not to answer a question because it may incriminate them, their guilt or involvement could be implied or inferred. I'd think it would not be a positive thing for a jury to know that you refused a polygraph or "took the 5th", even if the polygraph itself is not admissible.

 

[roseofsharon]

It's interesting to note that the kidnapper would take the time to put the accent on the word attache.

I think I once read that Patsy loved French things and wanted to have a French name for their daughter named after JR. They also used the accent on JB's name.

The home in Michigan was in Charlevoix.

Very coincidental IMO.

IMO the word briefcase would have been used by most people, but the word attache may be used more by those who perhaps think they have a little more sophistication.

 

[Tadpole12]

heyya roseofsharon

PR might have been known for her use of accents and happyface expressions within her written texts.
She used the accent egu for the vowel e and for the consonant B in the short form of JBR's name, Jonni B.

PR's sample letter:
http://blabbieville.tripod.com/patsychart8letter2.gif

 

[horatio]

Polygraphs are not admissible as any kind of evidence. They can be manipulated if you know how. In the case of the Rs, JR said he'd be "insulted" to be asked. Patsy said she'd "take 10 of them" and never took one administered by LE. Years later, they hired their own polygrapher, but they had to take the tests several times before they "passed". If you take them enough times and are asked the same questions enough times eventually you can give a false answer without registering a "lie".
BUT when it is known that someone has refused a polygraph, just like when some invokes the "Fifth Amendment" right not to answer a question because it may incriminate them, their guilt or involvement could be implied or inferred. I'd think it would not be a positive thing for a jury to know that you refused a polygraph or "took the 5th", even if the polygraph itself is not admissible.

Yeah, so basically the computer handwriting analysis would be utilized in the same manner. Not as strong as DNA, but it looks incriminating if you fail it/don't do it.

 

[CathyR]

The mentioning of beheading in the note has been pointed to as IDI evidence. No parent wanting an open casket funeral is going to do this.

Am I wacked out from reading so many child murder cases but... I think her name was Samantha Runyon or similar to that. 5 years old abducted right in front of her home. Beautiful little girl. Brown full hair that was naturally curly and fell into ringlets. The photo I remember seeing of her would rival any of JBR's pageant ones. When her body was found she had been beheaded. If the R's are using movie clips to stage then a real abduction resulting in the death of a child might also have been copied or made reference to in the RN. In a subtle way of course, no direct mention just a fear planted.

 

[joeskidbeck]

Cathy, could you be thinking of someone besides Samantha Runnion? I followed her case from the first moments after the Amber Alert and she wasn't beheaded. She had been sexually assaulted and strangled, then dumped on the side of a road where she was found rather quickly by a jogger.

 

[BBB167893]

The mentioning of beheading in the note has been pointed to as IDI evidence. No parent wanting an open casket funeral is going to do this.

Am I wacked out from reading so many child murder cases but... I think her name was Samantha Runyon or similar to that. 5 years old abducted right in front of her home. Beautiful little girl. Brown full hair that was naturally curly and fell into ringlets. The photo I remember seeing of her would rival any of JBR's pageant ones. When her body was found she had been beheaded. If the R's are using movie clips to stage then a real abduction resulting in the death of a child might also have been copied or made reference to in the RN. In a subtle way of course, no direct mention just a fear planted.

A bit confused, maybe. In any case, Samantha Runnion is a darn good contrast to this case. Not only does it show the difference between what an intruder supposedly did to JB (which Nancy Grace and Marc Klaas hammered Lin Wood on), but the difference between the Rs and Erin Runnion is night and day.

 

[CathyR]

The way a person behaves after their child is murdered, abducted, missing, is as unique as the individual.

My point about the Runnion case is that it was in the news, if copying movies why not throw a little reality out there in the note too.

Also I have noticed and well as other family members that my sisters and I all resemble my mothers handwriting. My older sister being the closest and me being the messiest but the same style of making certain letters exists in samples of all 3 girls and my mom.

Was the handwriting of other family members, Nedra, Pam, Melissa, John Andrew, etc. examined and were there similarities to Patsy or the note?

 

[CathyR]

Cathy, could you be thinking of someone besides Samantha Runnion? I followed her case from the first moments after the Amber Alert and she wasn't beheaded. She had been sexually assaulted and strangled, then dumped on the side of a road where she was found rather quickly by a jogger.

That is why I am not certain about the child. It involved a very pretty brunette child who ended up beheaded or nearly beheaded. With the facts you just gave it can't have been Samantha. My point was it was in the news and the RN may also have some references to real crimes involving children besides just movie's.

 

[madeleine]

or maybe the killer/stager was inspired by "Mindhunter"

here's what I found/posted about it

>>> [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=118135"]Is this what the one/ones who staged it had in mind?? - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[joeskidbeck]

or maybe the killer/stager was inspired by "Mindhunter"

here's what I found/posted about it

>>> Is this what the one/ones who staged it had in mind?? - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

You know what, madeleine? JR HAD TO HIRE John Douglas for his team. Just think what would have happened if Boulder LE had beat him to the punch. The Ramseys would have been arrested. I have no doubt about that. They used his book to plan out the staging and then gave him only information that made them look good. Douglas is on my list with Tracey and A. Jones.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Also, Samantha's case happened almost six years after JonBenet's murder so it wouldn't be possible for the beheading part of the RN to be a reference to her case. The only highly publicized child murder cases that happened prior to JBR's that I can think of would be Adam Walsh, Polly Klaas, and the Lindbergh baby. Adam Walsh was beheaded; perhaps the Ramseys were thinking of his case when they wrote the RN? There could've also been a case that perhaps only got brief coverage in just Denver, Atlanta, or Michigan, or even in West Virginia when Patsy was growing up, where the child victim isn't a "household name" but the Ramseys recalled the case when they were writing the RN? I'll do some searching on my college's Archive Database to see if I can find any cases where the child was beheaded since the only ones I can think of off the top of my head are Adam Walsh, and I believe Zahra Baker was beheaded too.