UK UK - Andrew Gosden, 14, Doncaster, South Yorks, 14 Sep 2007 #2

[JSolt1210]

I wondered about bullying on the school bus? I experienced it myself resulting in eventually having to transfer to a different bus. In this case though it seems it was from time to time and I'm not aware of any accounts of bullying.

Totally possible. But if this had been the case, I feel like someone would've come forward by now with that info—like another student, or even a bus driver, who witnessed the bullying or heard a snide remark, etc. Then again, given the huge publicity this case got, maybe those potential witnesses don't want to be connected to that, even after all this time.

For that reason, I don't think bullying on the bus or even at school was a factor. And it couldn't have been bullying on the street because then he would've always taken the bus back home.

 

[TheRockingRev]

This may seem like a strange one, but hey, the whole case is anything but normal. It may seem silly, but I've recently seen a picture of Andrew holding up a copy of the DVD of the film 'About A Boy'. More than likely a present for his Birthday (apparently the photo is from just a few weeks before he disappeared), but it obviously has some significance being a film that by that time was about 4 years old DVD.
If you don't know the film, then google it as I don't want to do a full break down here - but it basically tells the story of a intelligent, but slightly introverted kid who befriends an older single bloke - having a older brother/father type relationship with him. It's a comedy by the way - nothing dodgy.
What if Andrew was having this type of relationship with someone? What if this person said to him, it's ok it's allowed, it's just like that movie. It could be a favourite of Andrew's knowing that he's playing out this kind of story in real life - as I said nothing dodgy in the film, it's funny, so Andrew would've equated it to being funny in his own life too.
What then if the person says, come to London I'll get tickets for that band you like (the adult character in the film, Hugh Grant, buys cool stuff for the kid in the film) or we can have some hi-jinx in London like in the film we both like so much - I'll then drive you back home afterwards. But of course never does as something more sinister happens.
This could sound far-fetched, but hey, anything is worth looking at.

 

[Lucy6226]

This may seem like a strange one, but hey, the whole case is anything but normal. It may seem silly, but I've recently seen a picture of Andrew holding up a copy of the DVD of the film 'About A Boy'. More than likely a present for his Birthday (apparently the photo is from just a few weeks before he disappeared), but it obviously has some significance being a film that by that time was about 4 years old DVD.
If you don't know the film, then google it as I don't want to do a full break down here - but it basically tells the story of a intelligent, but slightly introverted kid who befriends an older single bloke - having a older brother/father type relationship with him. It's a comedy by the way - nothing dodgy.
What if Andrew was having this type of relationship with someone? What if this person said to him, it's ok it's allowed, it's just like that movie. It could be a favourite of Andrew's knowing that he's playing out this kind of story in real life - as I said nothing dodgy in the film, it's funny, so Andrew would've equated it to being funny in his own life too.
What then if the person says, come to London I'll get tickets for that band you like (the adult character in the film, Hugh Grant, buys cool stuff for the kid in the film) or we can have some hi-jinx in London like in the film we both like so much - I'll then drive you back home afterwards. But of course never does as something more sinister happens.
This could sound far-fetched, but hey, anything is worth looking at.

I suspect he was expecting a lift home that day, hence the one way ticket. No idea how he contacted said person with no internet though.

 

[TheRockingRev]

I suspect he was expecting a lift home that day, hence the one way ticket. No idea how he contacted said person with no internet though.

It's hard to think how we managed in those days, but we did. It was just a matter of making a plan beforehand. The amount of hours I must have wasted waiting for friends who were late!!

 

[Candytuft]

I suspect he was expecting a lift home that day, hence the one way ticket. No idea how he contacted said person with no internet though.

We used phone boxes. Saved up 2 pence pieces and arranged to call at certain times. That's if you didn't want to use the house phone and wanted privacy.

 

[Aluev]

We used phone boxes. Saved up 2 pence pieces and arranged to call at certain times. That's if you didn't want to use the house phone and wanted privacy.

Exactly! Back in 2008 using public phone boxes was still common. You could even place a call to a specific phone box and have the other person answer. The phone number was written on the box.

 

[Lucy6226]

It's hard to think how we managed in those days, but we did. It was just a matter of making a plan beforehand. The amount of hours I must have wasted waiting for friends who were late!!

We used phone boxes. Saved up 2 pence pieces and arranged to call at certain times. That's if you didn't want to use the house phone and wanted privacy.

I'm in my 40s so lived in a time before internet!

I meant how did he meet someone initially. If he was in school all day and home at evenings and weekends. A homebody it seems. When would he have had chance to meet someone and make plans to travel to London? Obviously these days we can talk to people from across the world from our homes, but back then it wasn't that easy.

 

[TheRockingRev]

I'm in my 40s so lived in a time before internet!

I meant how did he meet someone initially. If he was in school all day and home at evenings and weekends. A homebody it seems. When would he have had chance to meet someone and make plans to travel to London? Obviously these days we can talk to people from across the world from our homes, but back then it wasn't that easy.

I think the answer may be in the club he attended for gifted children, or someone he met through the school, both perfect places for grooming. It could've been going on a while. Plus, and I think this is a big one to look at, the days he walked home from school. It was quite a distance so did someone walk with him, did he go somewhere else or did he get a lift? There was ample time for someone to groom him, either over a long period or by enticing him with something in London. If it was someone who he met through a school related activity, then he may have had no reason not to trust them.

 

[ChatteringBirds]

IF he went to London to meet someone specific, it could have happened pretty quickly after he met or exchanged messages with the person. I could see a teenager going off to meet someone they met just days prior even.

Please, may his family get answers this year. 2025.

 

[davidt]

I think the answer may be in the club he attended for gifted children, or someone he met through the school, both perfect places for grooming. It could've been going on a while. Plus, and I think this is a big one to look at, the days he walked home from school. It was quite a distance so did someone walk with him, did he go somewhere else or did he get a lift? There was ample time for someone to groom him, either over a long period or by enticing him with something in London. If it was someone who he met through a school related activity, then he may have had no reason not to trust them.

I think the gifted summer camp was the year before. There doesn't appear to be any evidence of any continuing involvement affer that. I've never found it very clear what his school life was like. The impression is that he was a homeboy who mainly liked playing computer games on his own and not online. I've not seen much to say he mixed much outside of school other than having previously attended church which he'd given up. Don't know if anyone has seen anything that gives any details of what regular friends he may have had ?

With regard to him walking home from school it's an area which is similarly vague. All we really know is that at some point from time to time he started walking home from school. We don't know when it started, how often he did it or whether there was any pattern to it. Nor do we know of any specific reason for doing so. As it stands it may be a very important part of his case or totally irrelevant and we have no idea which it is.

 

[davidt]

One other thing I was thinking about in terms of Andrews movements that day. The general feeling is that Andrew bunked off school that day in order to go to London (or somewhere else) for an unknown purpose. And that's quite likely exactly what happened.

However I think another scenario is worth considering. What if the events of that morning were entirely spontaneous? When woken that morning Andrew was said to be grumpy. Was he grumpy because of the thought of going to school? All we really know after that is that he apparently left home in the normal way on his way to school. At some point he turned around and eventually returned home. It's possible he made that decision on the spur of the moment. Then having bunked off he decides what he is going to do with the day and decides on a trip to London. He also empties his bank account for spending money to have a good time.

I think it makes some sense. He didn't buy a train ticket in advance, didn't breathe a word to anyone or give a hint or clue anywhere or leave anything behind to suggest what he was up to. Perhaps the reason for this was because he didn't plan anything and he literally just picked up and left? Of course none of this explains what eventually happened to Andrew. I don't know if Andrew ever had any problems at school or any other issues but I haven't see anything to suggest he did but that doesn't prove anything really.

 

[wtiger]

for me the lack of a return train ticket indicates that his plans that day did not involve returning home (which of course he never did)

i can only guess at his reasons for not wanting a return ticket but his lack of luggage would strongly infer that there was no grand plan to stay in London for any length of time.

 

[Lonicera]

One other thing I was thinking about in terms of Andrews movements that day. The general feeling is that Andrew bunked off school that day in order to go to London (or somewhere else) for an unknown purpose. And that's quite likely exactly what happened.

However I think another scenario is worth considering. What if the events of that morning were entirely spontaneous? When woken that morning Andrew was said to be grumpy. Was he grumpy because of the thought of going to school? All we really know after that is that he apparently left home in the normal way on his way to school. At some point he turned around and eventually returned home. It's possible he made that decision on the spur of the moment. Then having bunked off he decides what he is going to do with the day and decides on a trip to London. He also empties his bank account for spending money to have a good time.

I think it makes some sense. He didn't buy a train ticket in advance, didn't breathe a word to anyone or give a hint or clue anywhere or leave anything behind to suggest what he was up to. Perhaps the reason for this was because he didn't plan anything and he literally just picked up and left? Of course none of this explains what eventually happened to Andrew. I don't know if Andrew ever had any problems at school or any other issues but I haven't see anything to suggest he did but that doesn't prove anything really.

I completely agree with your analysis: maybe Andrew kept a secret garden. Especially in adolescence, he may not have told his relatives everything because there is necessarily an explanation for his disappearance .

 

[davidt]

for me the lack of a return train ticket indicates that his plans that day did not involve returning home (which of course he never did)

i can only guess at his reasons for not wanting a return ticket but his lack of luggage would strongly infer that there was no grand plan to stay in London for any length of time.

The train ticket is another one with various possible explanations.

1) He never intended to return.
2) He expected to return another way, perhaps a lift or something else.
3) He was in a hurry, didn't want to be spotted and didn't want to hang around discussing ticket arrangements.
4) London wasn't his final intended destination.

There doesn't seem anyway of knowing anything about Andrew's intentions that day. It's similar in a way in respect to leaving his gaming machine charger behind. Was that because he would be returning, wouldn't need it any more, had a spare or did he just simply forget it. I agree he didn't take anything with him suggesting he was planning a stay of any kind.

 

[ChatteringBirds]

Don't know if anyone has seen anything that gives any details of what regular friends he may have had ?

I recall he was said to have some friends he hung out with while at school but was mostly a "homebody" after school.

 

[Konstantin]

3) He was in a hurry, didn't want to be spotted and didn't want to hang around discussing ticket arrangements.

This is very plausible. Andrew was a kid and had no experience in solo train travel. He was book smart not street smart. There is a very big difference. He had very little life experience, being a kid and also not being street smart. He was secretive and sneaky though, probably he had things going on his life that he had concealed from his parents who had not realized at all.

It's not possible to figure out his intentions that day from his train ticket choices. He might have planned everything out in his head, possibly helped out by a groomer, and when the ticket office staff asked him about the return, that threw him because that was not part of his plan has he had imagined it.

But we have no idea.

In a way this reminds me of how people often take the remarks by his dad that Andrew did not use a mobile phone as gospel truth and think that means that Andrew definitely did not have a phone. I mean, we don't know that. Andrew was a teenager, and plenty of kids his age do things that their parents have zero idea about. They have secrets. Andrew had secrets. For instance, Andrew had a secret plan to go to London on a school day, which he could do without anyone noticing that morning because his parents were at work and sister at school, so no one was at home to see him slope off or ask him where he was going, or be around to see what he was doing. His parents had no idea he was going to do that. Teenagers have secrets. Andrew could easily have had a phone. We don't know what arrangements he had made for after he got to London.

 

[helenff]

Would he have definitely known that it's cheaper/better to buy a return than two singles?

My son gets the train home from school every day. He gets singles (because we drive him there) so I'm not sure he even knows what a return is.

Now I imagine if Andrew used the train regularly or with friends, he would know, I certainly did back in the day. But he may not have bought a return because he just wanted 'to London' and thought he'd get a ticket on the way back.

 

[wtiger]

Would he have definitely known that it's cheaper/better to buy a return than two singles?

My son gets the train home from school every day. He gets singles (because we drive him there) so I'm not sure he even knows what a return is.

Now I imagine if Andrew used the train regularly or with friends, he would know, I certainly did back in the day. But he may not have bought a return because he just wanted 'to London' and thought he'd get a ticket on the way back.

someone described as a gifted maths student should have no trouble working out that a return ticket was his best option IF he planned on making a return journey

 

[helenff]

But who's to say he bothered working it out? What I mean is, we may not be able to read too much into his decision to buy a single because he might have just thought 'I want to go to London' and not been concerned about whether there was a more cost-effective ticket available.

 

[Bickles]

Would he have definitely known that it's cheaper/better to buy a return than two singles?

My son gets the train home from school every day. He gets singles (because we drive him there) so I'm not sure he even knows what a return is.

Now I imagine if Andrew used the train regularly or with friends, he would know, I certainly did back in the day. But he may not have bought a return because he just wanted 'to London' and thought he'd get a ticket on the way back.

Andrew was aware of the cost of the return ticket, as the agent spoke to him about it. Andrew declined the return ticket anyway.

The ticket one way cost £31.40 and it was only 50p more for the return.