UK UK - Claudia Lawrence, 35, Chef, York University, 18 March 2009 #14

[LuluR38]

I don’t think they’re on the back of the trailer bit, like another Post I considered trick of the light but there appears to be two faces there with features. Spooky trick of the light if that’s what it is ...I recall reading that the the car left in the direction of malton road. I haven’t a clue where that is nor how it could connect to any of the POI in this case . This morning I listened to a news piece in which Claudias Mam said she didn’t take her phone. And we know the phone was close to her home after the time frame of her vanishing until 12.10pm the next day. So was it left in her house as she went to answer the door perhaps, leaving her tooth brush on the side as she came to get the door as she was getting ready for bed and hence why the 9.12pm message went unanswered which was odd for her also. .. maybe her usual slippers were on her feet which is why the odd slippers her mam noticed as not the ones she would wear were left in a staged scene to continue the ‘she left for work’ narrative and distance any possible crime away from her home and associates ... just my ticking brain ...

 

[keep-it-real]

Hi KIR ; I say the below in the manner of you are probably more likely to be correct in where the 2 people are positioned

If the 2 people are sat outside on the bed of the truck (of which you are more likely to be correct)

Then; would this not be unusual? Especially at 9pm on a March evening

Is it the norm to travel like this? Why were they not travelling inside the vehicle ? Did the vehicle have 4 people inside,so they had to travel on the back ?

First of all you have to ask yourself where this photo came from.. Has it been verified by NYP or is it a photo that originated from the internet.

That aside.. If these people were in the back of the SUV were they only there when it was stationary and merely socialising.
If it did move off with them still on board the police would as they know the time it left and they know the direction it took so they either have cctv or witnesses to corroborate this.

 

[Popejohn3]

Hi KIR ; I say the below in the manner of you are probably more likely to be correct in where the 2 people are positioned

If the 2 people are sat outside on the bed of the truck (of which you are more likely to be correct)

Then; would this not be unusual? Especially at 9pm on a March evening

Is it the norm to travel like this? Why were they not travelling inside the vehicle ? Did the vehicle have 4 people inside,so they had to travel on the back ?

The police would have had all the answers to these questions surely

 

[Popejohn3]

I completely agree about the Rangers presence on Heworth road weds night being significant my opinions have never changed on that.
We know what time it is reported as leaving but what time did it arrive?
It was caght on the bus cam at 9.01 but how long had it been there before that?

The previous bus journey would go a long way in answering that question!

 

[UKjester]

But surely when the owner came forward ALL people would have been spoken to and cross checked !!
By the police !
Who else was with you ? Where were you all going to ?
Or have come out from ?

you would certainly have hoped so. But if he said “nah it was me I nipped in home then headed off. I was in the vehicle by myself.....” would they have challenged him?

if they did he had the get out of, “oh I thought that was my vehicle it looks just like it”
Admittedly this would require sizeable b****cks to approach the police and feed them a story but stranger things have happened. It may be the police were focusing on CL going missing on the way to work and possibly overlooked the detail on Weds evening and what was happening at her front door.
I have never fancied living on a main road and seeing the amount of activity in such a small area certainly firms up my belief.

 

[UKjester]

I would just like to mention something you may have missed the top of their heads are above the what would be the roof of the SUV .
I looked at this photo in the early days and to me they were sat in the rear of the flat bed and not in the rear seats of the SUV. Some Ranger owners fitted what they would call a tool box in the back of the truck this was a large metal lockable trunk that ran almost the full width of the back of the cab.I think they are sat on that their body positioning confirms to me that they are sat outside the cab.
From what I could see the male was sat with his arms crossed in a relaxed way across his body. His sleeves appear to be rolled up to his elbows. The female appears to be dressed in a blue boiler suit style garment with a white stripe down the outside of the arm. The are both sat facing the oncoming bus, her upper body is at a slight angle, her right hand is placed on his arm. When I looked closer her body angle is because she is making room on her left for another person who is either exiting from the truck or climbing into the truck.

The strangest thing I noted and which didnt change when looking at the still photo was that the male appeared to be wearing ear defenders. Has anyone else noted this?

These are my opinions

I think if you cross check the CCTV footage from the lower angle you can clearly see the back of the SUV as the bus approaches. There doesn’t appear to be anything or anyone in the flat bed.

Nice idea though and the only certainty here is that we all looks at these images in a different way and it all helps to raise question around whether these images were cleaned up by NYP

 

[Popejohn3]

you would certainly have hoped so. But if he said “nah it was me I nipped in home then headed off. I was in the vehicle by myself.....” would they have challenged him?

if they did he had the get out of, “oh I thought that was my vehicle it looks just like it”
Admittedly this would require sizeable b****cks to approach the police and feed them a story but stranger things have happened. It may be the police were focusing on CL going missing on the way to work and possibly overlooked the detail on Weds evening and what was happening at her front door.
I have never fancied living on a main road and seeing the amount of activity in such a small area certainly firms up my belief.

Now going back to the cctv opposite of Claudia’s house ... did the bus ( or any bus at any time for that matter )block it’s view ?

 

[Popejohn3]

you would certainly have hoped so. But if he said “nah it was me I nipped in home then headed off. I was in the vehicle by myself.....” would they have challenged him?

if they did he had the get out of, “oh I thought that was my vehicle it looks just like it”
Admittedly this would require sizeable b****cks to approach the police and feed them a story but stranger things have happened. It may be the police were focusing on CL going missing on the way to work and possibly overlooked the detail on Weds evening and what was happening at her front door.
I have never fancied living on a main road and seeing the amount of activity in such a small area certainly firms up my belief.

I’m sorry you would not be allowed to say “that looks like my vehicle “ you should be able to point to where you parked your vehicle !

 

[UKjester]

Hi UKjester; sorry If I came across as not grasping your point. It's not intentional or ignorance; sometimes communication gets lost in the trail, especially with written communication. My inadequacies


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Thus; I'm sure your stating that there are 2 similar vehicles in the Heworth area titled (A) and (B)

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Vehicle (A) was indeed outside Claudia's property on the 18th

In contrast Vehicle (B) was parked outside York F.C for example

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When Claudia went missing: Vehicle (B) nipped into the Police station and said.....'' that was me outside Claudia's on the 18th''
Therefore the authorities checked vehicle (B) and found nothing and ticked those people as innocent


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In contrast: The owner of Vehicle (A) which was actually outside Claudia's on the 18th ; kept quiet


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No problem at all and yes you hit the nail on the head there. This would then suggest there was a network of suspects and they could also be perverting the cause of justice.

I did see a post somewhere that identified the lady’s passenger in the SUV on google street view. Maybe in ML’s blog. If I can find it again I would like to see if there is an address to check for the SUV

 

[UKjester]

I’m sorry you would not be allowed to say “that looks like my vehicle “ you should be able to point to where you parked your vehicle !

If I was trying persuade the police it was my vehicle, i wouldn’t start with the line “it looks like my vehicle” either. Pointless pointing to where it was parked, most of England know where it was parked

 

[keep-it-real]

I think if you cross check the CCTV footage from the lower angle you can clearly see the back of the SUV as the bus approaches. There doesn’t appear to be anything or anyone in the flat bed.

Nice idea though and the only certainty here is that we all looks at these images in a different way and it all helps to raise question around whether these images were cleaned up by NYP

So could this shot have been taken by the previous bus ..
Does anyone know the timetable for buses on the Heworth road route that night?

 

[UKjester]

So could this shot have been taken by the previous bus ..
Does anyone know the timetable for buses on the Heworth road route that night?

That was one of my questions, it was stated that the SUV was captured leaving the area at 21:37 on another bus CCTV. Does anyone know where the 2nd bus was located to capture it?

 

[UKjester]

This could well be different to the service in 2009 but it appears it’s the 843 that travel up Heworth road from east parade.
It certainly isn’t a local service as it heads to Scarborough.
https://www.itravelyork.info/downloads/file/2/york-bus-route-map

Currently there is a temporary timetable in place:
https://passenger-line-assets.s3.eu...field/YCD/840-timetable-20210221-24f5beed.pdf

The number 11 is again on a temporary timetable but appears much more regular. This takes a different route around Heworth from East Parade

 

[LuluR38]

First of all you have to ask yourself where this photo came from.. Has it been verified by NYP or is it a photo that originated from the internet.

That aside.. If these people were in the back of the SUV were they only there when it was stationary and merely socialising.
If it did move off with them still on board the police would as they know the time it left and they know the direction it took so they either have cctv or witnesses to corroborate this.

from the bus cctv. It is also the one that also appeared in newspapers / reports at the time they were seeking it.

 

[Pinkizzy]

This could well be different to the service in 2009 but it appears it’s the 843 that travel up Heworth road from east parade.
It certainly isn’t a local service as it heads to Scarborough.
https://www.itravelyork.info/downloads/file/2/york-bus-route-map

Currently there is a temporary timetable in place:
https://passenger-line-assets.s3.eu...field/YCD/840-timetable-20210221-24f5beed.pdf

The number 11 is again on a temporary timetable but appears much more regular. This takes a different route around Heworth from East Parade

I'd like to see views from the bus before and after that one and what about the bus views from the opposite direction?

 

[MEKON]

First of all you have to ask yourself where this photo came from.. Has it been verified by NYP or is it a photo that originated from the internet.

That aside.. If these people were in the back of the SUV were they only there when it was stationary and merely socialising.
If it did move off with them still on board the police would as they know the time it left and they know the direction it took so they either have cctv or witnesses to corroborate this.

The significance of people socialising inside a vehicle outside someone's house; would in normal times, not be of much interest

However, the vehicle was seen outside the house. At approx the time that someone whose disappeared, stopped communicating with the world

 

[keep-it-real]

The significance of people socialising inside a vehicle outside someone's house; would in normal times, not be of much interest

However, the vehicle was seen outside the house. At approx the time that someone whose disappeared, stopped communicating with the world

It brings us back to the same important question. Was she in the house at that time or was she at another location.
Had she left the house earlier in the day for another location.
Had she left the house and was in one of the vehicles that passed the bus travelling in the opposite direction..
A silver car similar to the one seen at the Uni and Melrosegate PO is caught on the bus cam crossing the junction at costcutters as the bus approaches the traffic lights was she in that vehicle?

 

[MEKON]

It brings us back to the same important question. Was she in the house at that time or was she at another location.
Had she left the house earlier in the day for another location.
Had she left the house and was in one of the vehicles that passed the bus travelling in the opposite direction..
A silver car similar to the one seen at the Uni and Melrosegate PO is caught on the bus cam crossing the junction at costcutters as the bus approaches the traffic lights was she in that vehicle?

It is certainly possible that Claudia could of stayed over elsewhere and left her home; before the car we are referring to, parked outside Claudia's home

It's also possible that Claudia got a lift in the Silver car

However; did we see the Silver car park outside Claudia's home for not only a considerable duration of time, but at a key moment in time

 

[MEKON]

It brings us back to the same important question. Was she in the house at that time or was she at another location.
Had she left the house earlier in the day for another location.
Had she left the house and was in one of the vehicles that passed the bus travelling in the opposite direction..
A silver car similar to the one seen at the Uni and Melrosegate PO is caught on the bus cam crossing the junction at costcutters as the bus approaches the traffic lights was she in that vehicle?

This is another possibility here If Claudia was away from home on a stay over. And that is there was 'a call to arms' in gaining entrance to her house after determining If Claudia was inside her property or not. If in the chance,this was the case; then surely someone had a key and the object of the task was to find something

 

[keep-it-real]

It is certainly possible that Claudia could of stayed over elsewhere and left her home; before the car we are referring to, parked outside Claudia's home

It's also possible that Claudia got a lift in the Silver car

However; did we see the Silver car park outside Claudia's home for not only a considerable duration of time, but at a key moment in time

From when the bus cam starts to finnish its 45 secs long
In the first 27 seconds it records at least 4 vehicles travelling towards it down Heworth rd how can anyone be certain that none of these stopped to pick up Claudia or had been parked on Heworth rd prior to the bus passing by?

Claudia was last seen at approx 3.10pm by Linda the childminder returning home..who knows what Claudia's did or what her movements were from then on. The bus cam passes her home at approx 9.01pm Its possible she could have left her home at anytime within those 5-6 hours to be at another location. Even the police appear to be stumped on the determining if she was at home or else where.
Peter believed that she was abducted on her way to work on the Thurs, and he knew a lot more of the details of the case than we do if that was true then the evening of the 18th passed as normal without incident.

Mekon can I ask when do you think she went missing the evening of the 18th or the morning of the 19th?