UK UK - Claudia Lawrence, 35, Chef, York University, 18 March 2009 #16

[Woodburnbay]

I’ve been thinking a bit about CL’s phone. We know it was deliberately turned off at 12.10. (Claudias moile phone is switched off) This seems like a big gap for the perpetrator to hold onto the phone and just leave it on if the crime was committed the night before.

Claudias phone may be the first sign that she was being missed and the culprit may have wanted to keep the phone to see what interest was being shown in her silence.

 

[keep-it-real]

It appears that her behaviours changed in her last week(s). Always an indicator in a major crime.
She hadn't been to the Pub since the weekend and according to her friends this was not her normal pattern.
If she had embarrassed herself on her last visit to the pub, she may have been avoiding it and not wanting any of the locals see her going out for fear that she may have been invited back in.

I think trouble was a foot and she knew it. Wether she had been to police with her concerns or she had confided the fact to someone she was loyal to on the wrong side of the law (which in my opinion is more likely). She was in my opinion being watched and protected. I believe someone was accompanying her to work and someone was staying at her house wether that was the same person or two people but both were serving the same purpose to protect her. Something major happened on weds outside Melrosegate shops on weds afternoon and that lead to her having to leave Heworth road on Weds.
I dont think things would have taken such an abrupt turn of events if it wasnt for events at the NH on Gold Cup day which bought together a group of hard drinking violent individuals involved in criminal activities around Heworth and beyond. A disagreement between these was the cause of what ensued in the days following and the events of the evening of the 18th.

Peter said when he rang the police on Friday to report Claudia misssing they were round to the house in about 5 minutes. Police just dont turn up that quickly unless they had prior knowledge of a situation that could potentially become a cause for concern.

These are my opinions only.

 

[keep-it-real]

Ah! That's interesting. I was a student 2006-2010 and I recall getting cupcakes from Vanbrugh (they were well known for them). I guess the established bakery perhaps wasn't an official thing back then. Not sure.

I'm afraid I don't recall meeting CL and I didn't know her personally. I very likely did see her in the Roger Kirk though, especially if she served food as well as cooked. Interestingly, I don't remember ever seeing any police presence in the uni around the time. I would have thought there would be but apparently not... ?

Sorry -- I've edited the post to correct the link. It's the campus interactive map.
I've attached a pic where I've marked on the place I think CL is walking through in the foyer pics. It's a common route through the back towards the Roger Kirk Centre. I'm not sure why she would be coming from that direction if I'm correct though.

Whats up the stairs?

 

[aworldofmadness]

Whats up the stairs?

Classrooms and offices, I believe. Tentative answer though as it’s been a long time since I’ve been there. There’s been a fair few changes to buildings around uni in the past decade or so.

ETA - it is (or at least used to be) part of the maths department.

 

[keep-it-real]

Classrooms and offices, I believe. Tentative answer though as it’s been a long time since I’ve been there. There’s been a fair few changes to buildings around uni in the past decade or so.

ETA - it is (or at least used to be) part of the maths department.

Ok leading on can you figure out and indicate on map you posted where Claudia would have been heading in this attatched photo

 

[Novosti]

Yes, but there's an intermediate stage here, which is the clear decision of the police to request the CPS bring charges. That differentiates 'the four' from MS for example - for whom they did not decide that the evidence was worth pursuing a charging decision. And suggests the police believed a case could be mounted against the four, but could not be mounted against MS. The CPS of course took a different decision, no doubt with their guideline probabilities in mind with respect to the chances of successful prosecution at trial.

Agree, strong evidence is not required to arrest but a threshold has to be reached to charge and that is what wasn't achieved here.

 

[aworldofmadness]

Ok leading on can you figure out and indicate on map you posted where Claudia would have been heading in this attatched photo

It looks to me like she is walking towards Walmgate Stray from the uni.
That wouldn't be in the direction of her home...

 

[aworldofmadness]

It looks to me like she is walking towards Walmgate Stray from the uni.
That wouldn't be in the direction of her home...

Walmgate Stray is a way to cut through from the uni onto Fulford Road which is a main route into the City Centre. It goes past the Barracks. It's a popular route.

 

[Pinkizzy]

Why does this say Linked to disappearance
of York’s Sarah Everard?

Its inaccurate from the start.

Ah! That's interesting. I was a student 2006-2010 and I recall getting cupcakes from Vanbrugh (they were well known for them). I guess the established bakery perhaps wasn't an official thing back then. Not sure.

I'm afraid I don't recall meeting CL and I didn't know her personally. I very likely did see her in the Roger Kirk though, especially if she served food as well as cooked. Interestingly, I don't remember ever seeing any police presence in the uni around the time. I would have thought there would be but apparently not... ?



Sorry -- I've edited the post to correct the link. It's the campus interactive map.
I've attached a pic where I've marked on the place I think CL is walking through in the foyer pics. It's a common route through the back towards the Roger Kirk Centre. I'm not sure why she would be coming from that direction if I'm correct though.

Where is she walking from?

 

[aworldofmadness]

Its inaccurate from the start.

Where is she walking from?

The Roger Kirk Centre (the building that looks a bit like an axe head). That's where the canteen is where she worked.

 

[AerieFaerie]

Yup agree with this. The way she walked was the sensible most obvious way to go. Don’t think there’s anything suss to find there.

 

[AerieFaerie]

a few more questions if I may?
1. You say your block was James who many and what were the names of other blocks.
2. Which blocks were the nearest to the locoation the of the rucksack found in the Uni grounds.
3. Did you know Claudia not personally but by seeing her in the canteen or around the College. If yes when was the last time you saw her.
4. Ive attatched a photo of a foyer, can you identify which building and where it is on campus.

York has colleges rather than accommodation blocks. James, Goodricke, Halifax, Vanbrugh, Alcuin, Derwent and the PG college Wentworth. James and Goodricke flanked the Roger Kirk centre.

The rucksack was on the route between CL’s and the Roger Kirk, near Walmgate Stray. This is mainly surrounded by the Biology department.

I am sure I did see Claudia around, and definitely ate food that I’m sure she prepared, but I wouldn’t have clocked it at the time.

I think this has been clarified now but the foyer is in the Maths building, right by Roger Kirk.

 

[BryterLayter]

I think trouble was a foot and she knew it. Wether she had been to police with her concerns or she had confided the fact to someone she was loyal to on the wrong side of the law (which in my opinion is more likely). She was in my opinion being watched and protected. I believe someone was accompanying her to work and someone was staying at her house wether that was the same person or two people but both were serving the same purpose to protect her. Something major happened on weds outside Melrosegate shops on weds afternoon and that lead to her having to leave Heworth road on Weds.
I dont think things would have taken such an abrupt turn of events if it wasnt for events at the NH on Gold Cup day which bought together a group of hard drinking violent individuals involved in criminal activities around Heworth and beyond. A disagreement between these was the cause of what ensued in the days following and the events of the evening of the 18th.

Peter said when he rang the police on Friday to report Claudia misssing they were round to the house in about 5 minutes. Police just dont turn up that quickly unless they had prior knowledge of a situation that could potentially become a cause for concern.

These are my opinions only.

Really interesting. When you say protected so you mean the red van in the university car park and the similar or same van at Melrosegate that may have been following her?

 

[keep-it-real]

It looks to me like she is walking towards Walmgate Stray from the uni.
That wouldn't be in the direction of her home...

Sorry I think you misread what I meant .. the Photo I posted was said to be from the footage of Cluadia leaving the uni on the 18th from the Goodricke main entrance.
The police later confirmed that Caudia was not the female in the highlighted circle but she is the females at the top of the photo waking right to left there is a portly male following her and police asked who is this male?
Could you look again at the direction claudia is walking in relation to you map of the Uni please

In respect of the foyer photo. Would this particular foyer entrance give Claudia easy access to the Canteen.
Would this foyer entrance be used by Claudia if she wanted to be discreetly dropped off by someone in the morning without being seen?

 

[cortina]

this is definitely getting to me too much....I. still think the reply about Peter Lawrence was a bit odd and apparently I was mumbling not necessarily in my sleep last night.

I think the police are being very sensible in keeping quiet. about what they. have or haven't found.....this keeps any suspects stewing and if they have found anything I hope they evaluate it before saying anything...if. they do find claudia I hope they tell the family before the media

 

[BryterLayter]

this is definitely getting to me too much....I. still think the reply about Peter Lawrence was a bit odd and apparently I was mumbling not necessarily in my sleep last night.

I think the police are being very sensible in keeping quiet. about what they. have or haven't found.....this keeps any suspects stewing and if they have found anything I hope they evaluate it before saying anything...if. they do find claudia I hope they tell the family before the media

Sorry what reply? Thanks!

 

[Brandysnapblue]

Can you imagine yourself - you’ve just killed someone and the clock is running - “ o I know what I will do go to her house and set the scene???”

You would go back if you had left something or dropped something or to wipe fingerprints etc...........anything at all that after the fact, made you think there was something that could identify you as being in the house.

 

[aworldofmadness]

Sorry I think you misread what I meant .. the Photo I posted was said to be from the footage of Cluadia leaving the uni on the 18th from the Goodricke main entrance.
The police later confirmed that Caudia was not the female in the highlighted circle but she is the females at the top of the photo waking right to left there is a portly male following her and police asked who is this male?
Could you look again at the direction claudia is walking in relation to you map of the Uni please

In respect of the foyer photo. Would this particular foyer entrance give Claudia easy access to the Canteen.
Would this foyer entrance be used by Claudia if she wanted to be discreetly dropped off by someone in the morning without being seen?

Okie doke. So, if she is going right to left then she is going past the Biology Department towards Wentworth Way which eventually reaches University Road.

This is still an odd way to go if she was headed home. There are more direct routes from the RKC to Heworth.

Regarding the foyer entrance as a discreet drop-off -- I think it would be more discreet than the drop-off on the James College side. It would make sense if she was being dropped off/picked up by car though

 

[cortina]

I can't comment on the details but basically I suspect that keep it real is right....hello again kir.
summat was definitely going on....I think claudia was involved in something, but she could also be. blinkered and. naive....I think she. was being either protected or followed or possibly both

 

[cortina]

You would go back if you had left something or dropped something or to wipe fingerprints etc...........anything at all that after the fact, made you think there was something that could identify you as being in the house.

I think whoever it was or a friend of whoever it was was used to dodgy. stuff....to put it mildly...and would have reacted in a much calmer and more organised way than you or i....I dont know to what extent this involved rearranging things. in the house