UK UK - Claudia Lawrence, 35, York University, 18 March 2009 - Chef - #2

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  • #1,141
And if Claudia was to end her days as a bit of scrap metal-Who would benefit from this ?
.... someone she was close to at the time owned/owns a scrap metal business. I have my own personal theory on this aspect of Claudia's life at the time/later. The poi's involved in these businesses/business deals going on in 2009 have (as I've said b4) been thoroughly investigated and I'm loath to say anymore as all personal point of view, but money matters are often strong motives for strong action! I believe Claudia used to frequent the Vudu Lounge in Swinegate at that time also? Which I found interesting on a number of points. But I don't feel I should say anymore on that due to legal reasons/pure speculation on my part.
 
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  • #1,142
.... someone she was close to at the time owned/owns a scrap metal business. I have my own personal theory on this aspect of Claudia's life at the time/later. The poi's involved in these businesses/business deals going on in 2009 have (as I've said b4) been thoroughly investigated and I'm loath to say anymore as all personal point of view, but money matters are often strong motives for strong action! I believe Claudia used to frequent the Vudu Lounge in Swinegate at that time also? Which I found interesting on a number of points. But I don't feel I should say anymore on that due to legal reasons/pure speculation on my part.
Yes there's a very unsavoury story in the press about the behaviour of a co-director of the Vudu lounge towards a young female in his club, which came to court in May 2009.
 
  • #1,143
How do you know about the Vudu lounge thing?
Yes there's a very unsavoury story in the press about the behaviour of a co-director of the Vudu lounge towards a young female in his club, which came to court in May 2009.
 
  • #1,144
How do you know about the Vudu lounge thing?
Yes there's a very unsavoury story in the press about the behaviour of a co-director of the Vudu lounge towards a young female in his club, which came to court in May 2009.
 
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  • #1,148
Yes and it is interesting that 8 years later the NYP appeal for these 3 women is on their website in the same thread as the Claudia investigation:
upload_2019-7-9_23-40-54.jpeg
 
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  • #1,150
CCTV Cameras-Heworth Place.

I have been looking in more detail at Heworth Place and in 2008 onwards it can be seen that there are actually Three CCTV Camera covering the area.
Perhaps it was my mistake but I only ever saw two. My assumption was that it was the camera above the Limes Reception offices. (Camera 1)
Earlier analysis here and on other weblogs is inaccurate regarding timings of the Dark Man out of sight and activity?

The CCTV Images that NYP used were from Camera 3 in Limes Car Park.
I know this because in the CCTV of Dark Man it shows Dark Man and also The CCTV Camera 1 above Limes Court reception.

These images can only have come from this CCTV Camera in the Car Park-Fact...

I have attached an image of Camera 3. (Title-Third Camera-Limes Court Car Park)

I have also attached an illustration showing the other Two CCTV cameras; 1 and 2
(Title-Both Cameras, Heworth Place)

This image shows the two CCTV cameras and ranges.
They are located close to one another on The Limes building and cover quite a range. (Heworth Place as far as Number 13-15 and out towards Heworth Road)
Camera One, above Limes reception offices and Camera Two, facing further into Heworth Place.

Neither of these cameras were used to show any movement by Dark Person but would have been able to show if they went into Claudia's Back Lane or further up into Heworth Place.

Why were they not shown???

As a reminder:

The morning CCTV was first shown shortly after Claudia's Disappearance.
The Evening CCTV was only shown much later following a relaunch of investigation on 18th march 2015

Did NYP not wish to show Dark Persons destination?
Did he disappear between all 3 cameras at a Blind Spot?

The Blind Spot Area (Illustration attached)

A. Blindspot One is the rear of the house with a small open back yard just before the lane

B. Blindspot Two is the kerb outside of Limes Place just past reception, where in the 2008 image the maroon Volvo was parked.
the
I have made an assumption that all 3 cameras were working but this does change some of previous assumptions on this Thread:

1. It is unlikely that Claudia could be moved from the rear of her property along the lane and into Heworth Place unseen on CCTV. If she was at home then she would have to have been moved up the lane towards Nags Head Car Park / Store in Car Park or the Car Repair depot beyond.

2. It means that if Dark person went out of sight for 68 seconds (Evening) and 50 seconds (Morning) That unless NYP are not sharing details then almost all of the time out of view would not be checking out Claudia's house from the alleyway or walking further into Heworth Place but doing "Something" in the Blindspot??? This would leave them sufficient time to do more than we initialy thought.
Either in the rear open yard at the house on the corner of Heworth Road /Place or possibly at a car "Deliberately" parked in the blindspot?
Also possibly time to have had a conversation with another person lurking somewhere?
 

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  • #1,152
CCTV Cameras-Heworth Place.

I have been looking in more detail at Heworth Place and in 2008 onwards it can be seen that there are actually Three CCTV Camera covering the area.
Perhaps it was my mistake but I only ever saw two. My assumption was that it was the camera above the Limes Reception offices. (Camera 1)
Earlier analysis here and on other weblogs is inaccurate regarding timings of the Dark Man out of sight and activity?

The CCTV Images that NYP used were from Camera 3 in Limes Car Park.
I know this because in the CCTV of Dark Man it shows Dark Man and also The CCTV Camera 1 above Limes Court reception.

These images can only have come from this CCTV Camera in the Car Park-Fact...

I have attached an image of Camera 3. (Title-Third Camera-Limes Court Car Park)

I have also attached an illustration showing the other Two CCTV cameras; 1 and 2
(Title-Both Cameras, Heworth Place)

This image shows the two CCTV cameras and ranges.
They are located close to one another on The Limes building and cover quite a range. (Heworth Place as far as Number 13-15 and out towards Heworth Road)
Camera One, above Limes reception offices and Camera Two, facing further into Heworth Place.

Neither of these cameras were used to show any movement by Dark Person but would have been able to show if they went into Claudia's Back Lane or further up into Heworth Place.

Why were they not shown???

As a reminder:

The morning CCTV was first shown shortly after Claudia's Disappearance.
The Evening CCTV was only shown much later following a relaunch of investigation on 18th march 2015

Did NYP not wish to show Dark Persons destination?
Did he disappear between all 3 cameras at a Blind Spot?

The Blind Spot Area (Illustration attached)

A. Blindspot One is the rear of the house with a small open back yard just before the lane

B. Blindspot Two is the kerb outside of Limes Place just past reception, where in the 2008 image the maroon Volvo was parked.
the
I have made an assumption that all 3 cameras were working but this does change some of previous assumptions on this Thread:

1. It is unlikely that Claudia could be moved from the rear of her property along the lane and into Heworth Place unseen on CCTV. If she was at home then she would have to have been moved up the lane towards Nags Head Car Park / Store in Car Park or the Car Repair depot beyond.

2. It means that if Dark person went out of sight for 68 seconds (Evening) and 50 seconds (Morning) That unless NYP are not sharing details then almost all of the time out of view would not be checking out Claudia's house from the alleyway or walking further into Heworth Place but doing "Something" in the Blindspot??? This would leave them sufficient time to do more than we initialy thought.
Either in the rear open yard at the house on the corner of Heworth Road /Place or possibly at a car "Deliberately" parked in the blindspot?
Also possibly time to have had a conversation with another person lurking somewhere?

How would they know where the blind spots were? Ie to know where to avoid being filmed? I always favoured NYP had more cctv footage ie a poi's car that they are not disclosing and that the cctv person/s are witnesses/accomplasis thar they need to ID/come foward to piece together the jigsaw ie 'there were 4 of you to carry/move Claudia etc' (maybe it involved a few cars). There must be a car involved? Either before or after whatever/wherever Claudia went to either in the PM/Eve/AM.
 
  • #1,153
@Yozzer Land sold for student accommodation in 2018
 
  • #1,154
How would they know where the blind spots were? Ie to know where to avoid being filmed? I always favoured NYP had more cctv footage ie a poi's car that they are not disclosing and that the cctv person/s are witnesses/accomplasis thar they need to ID/come foward to piece together the jigsaw ie 'there were 4 of you to carry/move Claudia etc' (maybe it involved a few cars). There must be a car involved? Either before or after whatever/wherever Claudia went to either in the PM/Eve/AM.
@Kiri It spretty straight forward to detect sight lines of the CCTV cameras of the fixed type at Limes. The one in the car park is far more difficult to detect as it can have up to 360 degree sight line.
Regarding NYP not revealing all of footage, you could well be right here as it is likely to be available and they have also stayed silent re where Dark Person went after returning to Heworth Road-They cant just disappear.
 
  • #1,155
Since starting to look at this case less than 3 weeks ago and for far less than most of the Sleuths online who are totally dedicated to this case. I have realised that the identification work of us Sleuths who in the main are basically "Lay People" when it comes to solving crime, have certainly achieved more and looked at far more and provided greater substance than the earlier investigation by NYP.

What is really stopping us from progressing our investigation is in fact the people we are setting out to help the most-The Police.

I say again NYP are stinting our assistance.

Take note

I'm parking that one in the same way that Ex DCI Lucy's Pope did on this thread a few days ago....

It is clear to me that they have provided, for whatever reason, very sketchy content and had they come out with more to help us then for sure we could wrap this up.

It is fairly obvious that Claudia will never be found, the Perps have done a good job of disposing of the body. The suspects only need to sit tight and say nothing from now on in and they are in the clear.
All they need to do is to continue to run their profitable businesses and sell off their land with the help of a few local and well cone ted council dignitaries.

But if I was NYP I would hound the life out of them in such a way that as Claudia, bless her, has no life today, that these people have no life either until they have the spine to admit to what they did.

It is suggested that some men full of testosterone took her life.
Men going through a mid life crisis with all Brawn and no brains.
I would say that they are reptiles with no regard for human life.
They are probably suffering from "Little Man Syndrome" and to correct this they should step up to the plate and admit to what they have done

Bastards......
 
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  • #1,156
Since starting to look at this case less than 3 weeks ago and for far less than most of the Sleuths online who are totally dedicated to this case. I have realised that the identification work of us Sleuths who in the main are basically "Lay People" when it comes to solving crime, have certainly achieved more and looked at far more and provided greater substance than the earlier investigation by NYP.

What is really stopping us from progressing our investigation is in fact the people we are setting out to help the most-The Police.

I say again NYP are stinting our assistance.

Take note

I'm parking that one in the same way that Ex DCI Lucy's Pope did on this thread a few days ago....

It is clear to me that they have provided, for whatever reason, very sketchy content and had they come out with more to help us then for sure we could wrap this up.

It is fairly obvious that Claudia will never be found, the Perps have done a good job of disposing of the body. The suspects only need to sit tight and say nothing from now on in and they are in the clear.
All they need to do is to continue to run their profitable businesses and sell off their land with the help of a few local and well cone ted council dignitaries.

But if I was NYP I would hound the life out of them in such a way that as Claudia, bless her, has no life today, that these people have no life either until they have the spine to admit to what they did.

It is suggested that some men full of testosterone took her life.
Men going through a mid life crisis with all Brawn and no brains.
I would say that they are reptiles with no regard for human life.
They are probably suffering from "Little Man Syndrome" and to correct this they should step up to the plate and admit to what they have done

Bastards......

Let's hope that the police ARE still looking at this case (sometimes cases are actually being looked at despite what police say publically), did Lucy Pope say something on here?
Anyhow I think Claudia will be found....maybe when a new cold case team take it on/maybe sooner. I'm going to remain positive. Well as positive as you can be. The family need closure. It is not fair. I do agree with your last word though, yes they are Bastards!
 
  • #1,157
Let's hope that the police ARE still looking at this case (sometimes cases are actually being looked at despite what police say publically), did Lucy Pope say something on here?
Anyhow I think Claudia will be found....maybe when a new cold case team take it on/maybe sooner. I'm going to remain positive. Well as positive as you can be. The family need closure. It is not fair. I do agree with your last word though, yes they are Bastards!
Yes she came on here a few days ago and made a comment about parking some of her comments and that she had worked with superintendent in first phase of case.
 
  • #1,158
Yes she came on here a few days ago and made a comment about parking some of her comments and that she had worked with superintendent in first phase of case.
 
  • #1,159
Yes she came on here a few days ago and made a comment about parking some of her comments and that she had worked with superintendent in first phase of case.
Can you copy and paste her post?
 
  • #1,160
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