UK UK - Corrie McKeague, 23, Bury St Edmunds, 24 September 2016 #9

[JamesKing]

Interesting also is the question re the "bin lorry / phone / landfil" issue. And was not searching for it a "missed opportunity".

The upshot seems to be, it may have been destroyed as the rubbish had passed through a sorting centre and not been found and then onwards to wherever.... although this is kept "wooly" in the documentary.

But because this issue is even spoken about (for example, he couldn't have been in the rubbish bin, due to it's recorded weight), it would be fair to say, several people close to the investigation (here I mean the family) must see the possibility of Corrie phone being disposed of the horseshoe area.
Thus, he leaving the loading bay area unwillingly.

The subject of the 3 cars is not really covered...as that must be a huge part of the investigation and I can see why. So surely it must come down to that ?

 

[Dcflag]

But the cctv stills show there were plenty of people within minutes walking past and however many we don't see. An altercation involving binning a phone and putting him in a car surely would have been noticed by someone? He would have made some kind of noise you'd think?

Where as getting into a vehicle willingly is every day. No one would remember that.

 

[Dcflag]

I see getting a lift with the bin lorry more likely than Corrie changing clothes and walking out. The bin lorry at least gets him out of the city centre

 

[Clevercat]

Yes, but....

I think when police question people they can get a sense of whether or not the truth is being told or someone is holding something back.

I don't like such a long wait with so many people around.

Corrie allegedly told the USAF guy in Mama Mia's just 2 hours earlier that he didn't want to go to Mildenhall.

Why would the driver not tell the truth once he learns that Corrie didn't make it home safely?

Did the forensic exam check the cab? If it did, then it seems odd to me that the driver would manage to wipe it clean even before he knew Corrie was missing? Or if it was an innocent lift that he'd think to do that, and have the opportunity to do that as it's not his personal vehicle so he wouldn't have access to it unless he was on duty?

I think Occam would prefer the phone in the bin lorry rather than Corrie....assuming there's another vehicle that pulls down Short Brackland and close to the bin area before the bin lorry gets there. I think Occam would prefer Corrie to go in the first vehicle after 3.25am. Or maybe it's me and not Occam who prefers that?

I do agree with your points, it's just the way I am swaying at the moment, probably because I have lost confidence in some of the things we have been told in the past.

It is however feasible that in Mama Mia's it was his intention to head home but after the sleep and possibly seeing that there was still a party going on in Mildenhall (by looking at SM posts, or even receiving messages to say it was still in full swing, or any other communications requiring him to be in Mildenhall) that he changed his mind?

I would imagine that the driver would own up but I guess when he was first asked he may have denied it initially, almost instinctively, and now is too frightened to own up. (The weakest part of my theory imo)

I wasn't thinking that the driver wiped the cab but that maybe there is a cleaning process which happens regularly which just so happened to clean away fingerprints/stray hairs- not a big stretch imo

As for not being seen for 35 mins+, I don't think that's a big stretch either if he was sat out of the way. People are pretty self-absorbed in what they are doing, where they are going and unless there was something unusual to see, I think it is more than feasible that he wasn't seen.

I shall probably have a different theory tomorrow though lol

 

[Amonet]

I feel like I'm being pulled in all directions by Occam.

The phone pulls me to Mildenhall. Corrie's behaviour pulls me to him wanting to get back to base. He hasn't been found in either direction.

If Corrie tried to walk back to base via Looms Lane, which seems to be the obvious choice from his position, then he should have been caught on the Cornhill camera.

How would Occam make sense of this?

I can see why it was said earlier it's almost like Corrie was doing everything to get noticed and caught on CCTV until 3.25 on purpose. But that sounds like something out of a movie, and I don't think Mr Occam likes real life behaving like a far-fetched Hollywood movie script.

 

[Amonet]

Interesting also is the question re the "bin lorry / phone / landfil" issue. And was not searching for it a "missed opportunity".

The upshot seems to be, it may have been destroyed as the rubbish had passed through a sorting centre and not been found and then onwards to wherever.... although this is kept "wooly" in the documentary.

But because this issue is even spoken about (for example, he couldn't have been in the rubbish bin, due to it's recorded weight), it would be fair to say, several people close to the investigation (here I mean the family) must see the possibility of Corrie phone being disposed of the horseshoe area.
Thus, he leaving the loading bay area unwillingly.

The subject of the 3 cars is not really covered...as that must be a huge part of the investigation and I can see why. So surely it must come down to that ?

I thought the Superintendant in the documentary seemed to think that the phone would have been found during the conveyor sorting process to be honest? She seemed to think that was most likely, and second most likely is that the phone, if it did get through that process with no one remembering, would be out of commission and not really viable to search for now? Again, I wish there was another half hour of the documentary so that she could have explained those things better.

 

[JamesKing]

But the cctv stills show there were plenty of people within minutes walking past and however many we don't see. An altercation involving binning a phone and putting him in a car surely would have been noticed by someone? He would have made some kind of noise you'd think?

Where as getting into a vehicle willingly is every day. No one would remember that.

I completely agree. Hence why it's weird case.

 

[Dcflag]

Just my personal opinion, based on the amount of people about and lack of witnesses (that we know of) is his phone ended up in the bin and then the bin lorry then he binned it deliberately.

 

[Clevercat]

I feel like I'm being pulled in all directions by Occam.

The phone pulls me to Mildenhall. Corrie's behaviour pulls me to him wanting to get back to base. He hasn't been found in either direction.


If Corrie tried to walk back to base via Looms Lane, which seems to be the obvious choice from his position, then he should have been caught on the Cornhill camera.

How would Occam make sense of this?

I can see why it was said earlier it's almost like Corrie was doing everything to get noticed and caught on CCTV until 3.25 on purpose. But that sounds like something out of a movie, and I don't think Mr Occam likes real life behaving like a far-fetched Hollywood movie script.

I think Occam is saying the most likely scenario is he got into a vehicle willingly with his phone shortly after arriving in the Horseshoe. That then leaves two options:

The bin lorry- issues here are would the driver not tell the truth/lack of forensics/the wait for the lorry without being seen

or

Another vehicle which headed to the BM area- many issues with this as we have not a scrap of evidence to discuss the likelihood of this scenario

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

But the cctv stills show there were plenty of people within minutes walking past and however many we don't see. An altercation involving binning a phone and putting him in a car surely would have been noticed by someone? He would have made some kind of noise you'd think?

Where as getting into a vehicle willingly is every day. No one would remember that.

If he did willingly get into a vehicle with phone though, where did it go for an hour before then leaving the BSE ping area? You would assume if the car that picked him up left straight away to BM/Mildenhall the pings would have happened earlier? This is why I asked on the last thread about whether the BSE mobile mast could have a larger range than the micro mast at BM/Fiveways roundabout. Midsummer? did those maps showing both towers with a 5km range but if the BSE mast had a 20km range how would/could that affect the timing of pings?

I'm probably confusing myself but have to ask!

 

[JamesKing]

I thought the Superintendant in the documentary seemed to think that the phone would have been found during the conveyor sorting process to be honest? She seemed to think that was most likely, and second most likely is that the phone, if it did get through that process with no one remembering, would be out of commission and not really viable to search for now? Again, I wish there was another half hour of the documentary so that she could have explained those things better.

It was all a bit "wooly".
Again, the Ipswich Incinerator doesn't get a mention, but that's what they mean by "destroyed".

If it was there...and "sorted", it probably will be destroyed by now.

 

[Dcflag]

If he did willingly get into a vehicle with phone though, where did it go for an hour before then leaving the BSE ping area? You would assume if the car that picked him up left straight away to BM/Mildenhall the pings would have happened earlier? This is why I asked on the last thread about whether the BSE mobile mast could have a larger range than the micro mast at BM/Fiveways roundabout. Midsummer? did those maps showing both towers with a 5km range but if the BSE mast had a 20km range how would/could that affect the timing of pings?

I'm probably confusing myself but have to ask!

I always assumed bse had a bigger mast.

While lots of people discount drugs I used to know many young adults pull up to smoke weed in a car park.

 

[Clevercat]

If he did willingly get into a vehicle with phone though, where did it go for an hour before then leaving the BSE ping area? You would assume if the car that picked him up left straight away to BM/Mildenhall the pings would have happened earlier? This is why I asked on the last thread about whether the BSE mobile mast could have a larger range than the micro mast at BM/Fiveways roundabout. Midsummer? did those maps showing both towers with a 5km range but if the BSE mast had a 20km range how would/could that affect the timing of pings?

I'm probably confusing myself but have to ask!

Good point- so I'm back to the bin lorry again and him not being seen during the wait

 

[hazel324]

One of the things that has struck me- is that there has been so much reliance put on potential witnesses and what they may have seen that night/morning- however, I do question how much people really do notice or remember.
I was out last night in Chichester and this morning I tried to remember who I saw when I was walking back to my car in the dark- I know there were people around but I can honestly not remember anything about them- I wasn't trying to be especially observant last night, but presumably people generally aren't. (especially if there's nothing out of the ordinary going on- and by the sounds of it, people wandering around the area at that time in BSE was nothing out of the ordinary)

Many studies also show that even when people get a clear picture at the time, memories can be warped.

It's amazing how our minds can fool us into a recollection that just isn't accurate....the more you think about it, picture it, the more the 'fake' memory is solidified

 

[JamesKing]

If he did willingly get into a vehicle with phone though, where did it go for an hour before then leaving the BSE ping area? You would assume if the car that picked him up left straight away to BM/Mildenhall the pings would have happened earlier? This is why I asked on the last thread about whether the BSE mobile mast could have a larger range than the micro mast at BM/Fiveways roundabout. Midsummer? did those maps showing both towers with a 5km range but if the BSE mast had a 20km range how would/could that affect the timing of pings?

I'm probably confusing myself but have to ask!

Well, that question IS the million pound one.

But, ping data is "that" accurate.
The "pauses between pings" isn't known to us.
And we don't know the time the bin lorry came.
It's all a bit "up in the air".

BUT, this is why the CCTV appeals come into play, I think.
We know nothing about the "times the cars came and left".

Say a car came (0330) and left later (0355).
The bin lorry arriving later at 0400
It's easy to think it came and left rapidly.
Or came....and left but parked up on Short Brackland.

This bit of the story is confusing... and it is based on "data which isn't accurate in the first place" (my quote).

 

[MelmothTheLost]

I thought the Superintendant in the documentary seemed to think that the phone would have been found during the conveyor sorting process to be honest?

I wonder if the sorting was done entirely by hand or did it also under a metal detector that would have detected the phone even if it slipped through the hand-sorting process.

 

[Amonet]

Just my personal opinion, based on the amount of people about and lack of witnesses (that we know of) is his phone ended up in the bin and then the bin lorry then he binned it deliberately.

I do feel that if the phone ended up in the bin that the most likely person to put it on/in the bin is Corrie himself.

 

[Northern Light]

So if he sat quietly on the steps, for the lorry to arrive, would this mean that he could have been waiting for the lorry to arrive, otherwise why wait on the steps for that length of time, unless he was waiting for a lift, that failed to show. Just so confusing that no one has come forward who saw him anywhere.

 

[Miss_French]

Going back to the subject of Corrie being seen on CCTV drinking in his car.

I would think that this is probably true as Nicola volunteered that information at a later date, admitting that it was an offence and Corrie shouldn't have done it. I would think that the Police maybe spoke to her about it.

Sorry, just catching up on this thread. I have tried and failed to find the link to Nicola's discussion with college students that I have seen on here. Did it say Corrie had been on cctv in his car? Or could the drinking be something that Corrie mentioned during the phone call to his brother?

 

[Clevercat]

So if he sat quietly on the steps, for the lorry to arrive, would this mean that he could have been waiting for the lorry to arrive, otherwise why wait on the steps for that length of time, unless he was waiting for a lift, that failed to show. Just so confusing that no one has come forward who saw him anywhere.

That would be my assumption