GUILTY UK - Ellie Butler, 6, brutally murdered, Sutton, 28 Oct 2013 #1

[Legally Bland]

I don't know if there's a legal minimum time a jury has to spend deliberating, an hour or two perhaps, but when it comes to that time I predict they will be back with their verdict. Unless there is a rogue juror of course.

Having heard his account I don't think the prosecution even needs to finish cross examination.

I feel for you. It must be incredibly emotional and frustrating listening to that.

 

[Gigi-G]

Sequence of events according to BB. I couldn't decide which bit to quote, but here he admits an ambulance wasn't called for at least 2 hours.



http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/n...eps-over-ambulance-call-mistake-34722646.html

What a load of bullsh1t!
He means oh fk oh fk fk fk fk fk. ......
'Walks around head in hands as he walks around the house. Falling in a heap on the floor crying'

He's realised he's gone too far this time....

Jmoo

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[Tortoise]

And as for JG

:behindbar


:liar:

Oh, did I really pick the same emoticons? Must be a coincidence.

 

[Tortoise]

I think there was a millisecond of truth in his testimony today. The part where he said he was in her bedroom in a state of shock. That's when he had just finished pulverising his daughter's head. Monster.

 

[Tortoise]

That being (not a man) is not suicidal. His life is not finished, as he claims. He is fighting for it.

 

[Gigi-G]

JG's nose in that pic looks askew, as though it has been broken or squashed and it hasn't healed right.

Quite possibly Squish.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[Gigi-G]

I don't know if there's a legal minimum time a jury has to spend deliberating, an hour or two perhaps, but when it comes to that time I predict they will be back with their verdict. Unless there is a rogue juror of course.

Having heard his account I don't think the prosecution even needs to finish cross examination.

I'm not sure on a 'minimum' I was under the assumption that if all members of Jury were in agreement then Court can be called back.

One of the quickest I've seen in recent times was Becky Watts case.. just under 3 hours.

Prosecution started cross-exam after the afternoon tea break. They are going to pick up tomorrow morning with the 999 call recording.

It really is too sad to hear how Ellie was left to die on the floor, all alone, with her bedroom door closed.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[Tortoise]

Today he stated that he did not find out JG was pregnant until March 2013 when she was in hospital.

How is he going to explain this text? "In a text to Ms Gray on January 16, 2013, Mr Butler said: “Im disg that ur preg again and think its irresponsible and shocking.. had engh of ur weight and looks..and the trble u bring.”


He also said today that he hasn't bothered reading the text messages, even though he's had them for a year.

 

[Tortoise]

When JG was admitted to hospital in March 2013 (with complications from ectopic pregnancy/failed abortion - and injuries) she admitted herself under a false name again. BB says this was because SS had said they would take the two children back into care because they did not think JG could cope as a mother to 3 children.

I would like to know what that's all about. If it's true, because I just have to doubt everything he says, who assessed her as being able to cope with 2 but not 3? Why did they have ANY concerns about her? Why did they risk Ellie and her sister in her care if they had concerns about her?

 

[Gigi-G]

That being (not a man) is not suicidal. His life is not finished, as he claims. He is fighting for it.

He's looking for sympathy. For any glimpse of hope. He feels the world owes him something.....becuz he fought for 5 years to get Ellie back.
He's hoping that will be his redeeming value.
Just as he called out at the prosecuting QC that they wrongly let Ellie's body go for cremation.
He had a playing card that would he hoped throw a different light on the case. But now she's Cremated the chance has gone.
He still might try to play that card. Given he's nothing to loose.
That's when hopefully Prosecution can question Dr Marinades. Who specialises in head/skull/brain/neuro issues. That's his specialised field.
Hopefully he will be able to direct the Jury in the fact that once the skull was being examined in the autopsy. There was significant bleeds and bruising and also older bleeds and bleeding behind the optics. With the rear of the skull disintegrated.
That alone was the fatal injury.

There is a Syndrome that people can suffer from. I'll post up on the bottom of this post. As to what I mean. This is imo what BB would of used (may still use) in his defence.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[Tortoise]

When JG was admitted to hospital in March 2013 (with complications from ectopic pregnancy/failed abortion - and injuries) she admitted herself under a false name again. BB says this was because SS had said they would take the two children back into care because they did not think JG could cope as a mother to 3 children.

I would like to know what that's all about. If it's true, because I just have to doubt everything he says, who assessed her as being able to cope with 2 but not 3? Why did they have ANY concerns about her? Why did they risk Ellie and her sister in her care if they had concerns about her?

thinking this through - surely she'd had the abortion already because this was an admission to deal with the botched up termination, so in March she wasn't planning on having a 3rd baby, she'd already dealt with it, and therefore SS' 'concerns' about her not coping with 3 must be a lie.

goodness me where do the lies start or end...

 

[Gigi-G]

He's looking for sympathy. For any glimpse of hope. He feels the world owes him something.....becuz he fought for 5 years to get Ellie back.
He's hoping that will be his redeeming value.
Just as he called out at the prosecuting QC that they wrongly let Ellie's body go for cremation.
He had a playing card that would he hoped throw a different light on the case. But now she's Cremated the chance has gone.
He still might try to play that card. Given he's nothing to loose.
That's when hopefully Prosecution can question Dr Marinades. Who specialises in head/skull/brain/neuro issues. That's his specialised field.
Hopefully he will be able to direct the Jury in the fact that once the skull was being examined in the autopsy. There was significant bleeds and bruising and also older bleeds and bleeding behind the optics. With the rear of the skull disintegrated.
That alone was the fatal injury.

There is a Syndrome that people can suffer from. I'll post up on the bottom of this post. As to what I mean. This is imo what BB would of used (may still use) in his defence.

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

REPETITIVE HEAD INJURY SYNDROME.

becuz 'they' claimed that Ellie was 'always' falling. Just a thought imoo.

http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/92189-overview#a5

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[Tortoise]

So we've learned more today about JG,

- she's violent (split his jaw by punching him with her ring)
- she's a drinker
- she spits at him
- she is confrontational, argumentative, not submissive, and up close in his face.

How is any of that conducting arguments by text so the children don't know?????

 

[Gigi-G]

Thanks to Tortoise. And Legally Bland.
For all the up to date tweets. And coverage of detailed court events.

And to everyone else yr posts are much appreciated. ♡

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[Tortoise]

Her barrister had to shut her up today. She was calling out repeatedly from the dock "cremation" over and over again. He turned around in his seat to look at her, and a minute later the court usher was delivering her a note from him. She sort of smirked and tucked it into her sheaf of notes and didn't say another word.

 

[Gigi-G]

Today he stated that he did not find out JG was pregnant until March 2013 when she was in hospital.

How is he going to explain this text? "In a text to Ms Gray on January 16, 2013, Mr Butler said: “Im disg that ur preg again and think its irresponsible and shocking.. had engh of ur weight and looks..and the trble u bring.”


He also said today that he hasn't bothered reading the text messages, even though he's had them for a year.

That's why Mr Brown said he lies to get out of things.... errrmmm

Yup

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

 

[cottonweaver]

Thankyou everyone for both the links & the commentaries.
I am only just catching up with posts and going to read all those fab links now.

All I can say , having not read links yet, is this guy is supremely arrogant thinking he won't get caught out with his lies and these discrepancies.

He has zero humility which is sickening as I was thinking about Ellie today, about her life with these two whom she barely knew.
I'm not being OTT when I imagine the hell of life with these two. It almost feels as if she was "kidnapped" by strangers/monsters and kept captive - like those awful abuse cases you read about.

The fatuous jokes again. Plus links to kiddies TV, is he trying to imply that he knows the progs well as he is a good dad watching them with the kids? Bizarre

Squish was wondering what his strategy would be in an earlier post re. "throwing JG under a bus if his Defence started to fail". He really is doing that isn't he. Wonder what her expression was like and if flutterby got to go down today.

"The rope for me" WTH! He's back in "old lag lingo". ( Sorry guv)
and there was something about momentary amnesia after Ellie dies!! Looking up to the heavens- an apology to Ellie from the dock.

Tell you what BB, I'll arrange for you some blo*dy "regression therapy" to assist you with your amnesia. Makes me angry

Right going to read the links now. TX to all.

 

[Tortoise]

I'll write up the incidents with Ellie in a while. It's an understatement to say how upsetting it is.

I know the papers have a good coverage of today's proceedings but it might be interesting to some posters, each paper seems to have covered slightly different things to the others, and there are some small details that I haven't seen reported.

 

[cottonweaver]

Her barrister had to shut her up today. She was calling out repeatedly from the dock "cremation" over and over again. He turned around in his seat to look at her, and a minute later the court usher was delivering her a note from him. She sort of smirked and tucked it into her sheaf of notes and didn't say another word.

Do you mean you went today Tortoise?

 

[Tortoise]

Do you mean you went today Tortoise?

yes, I was there all day. I think I'll be going every day now unless something gets in the way of it. It's like starting a book and then not getting to finish it otherwise.