GUILTY UK - Helen Bailey, 51, Royston, 11 April 2016 #11

[cottonweaver]

Ben Ando BBC correspondent

Ben Ando‏@BenAndo 22h22 hours ago
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In more than a quarter of a century of reporting I have only seen two more pathetic defence cases - Mark Dixie and Peter Tobin.

 

[Moll]

If that's all they can come up with, it would have been better to say nothing. It's just a long-winded way of saying "Leave us alone".

But under pressure to say something, that's what people generally do rather than say nothing, which might be construed by the media in some more adverse way. They have acknowledged they know this investigation into their mother's death is going on.

 

[BatFace]

I feel terribly sorry for those young men- their whole lives have been blown apart by their disgrace of a father.


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[cottonweaver]

cremation is cheaper than a burial too so that may have relevance for an innocent man who has a hissy fit in paying £3 for afternoon refreshments during his crown bowling.

 

[BatFace]

cremation is cheaper than a burial too so that may have relevance for an innocent man who has a hissy fit in paying £3 for afternoon refreshments during his crown bowling.

So true, cottonweaver.


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[SweetCinnamon]

I agree. They come across to me as supportive of their father and churlish. I was shocked. But as they say 'instruct by your actions', a French proverb. He must have been their 'role model' to some extent.


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[MissTwiddle]

What do we have

1. confidence with his method.
2. avoidance of saying anything about her death other than that she died, when we know he loves telling a story.
3. moving on instantly after a 20+ year marriage.
4. lone presence at both deaths.
5. unexpected death with no obvious cause
6. family surprise and inability to process Diane's cause of death.
7. incapacity to feel love.
8. long premeditation.
9. a malignant narcissist and liar.
10. some financial benefit

more ???

off top of my head

11. He was no longer vulnerable and had quite a healthy life in front of him. (Pinto evidence)
12. The historical zopliclone prescriptions. 2005 & 2010. 2010's poss prompting him to get a re-issue in 2016.(7.5mg x 28each time)
13. days after killing HB he appears to make his first visit to the FB Diane Lem FB page, leaving his kiss, but not in preceding 6 years. Why?
14. Another very tenuous one I agree... but buying a sports car so soon after her death ( red MG) when he hasn't worked for 15 yrs and has two boys to support.
Your No. 3 - . unsubstantiated claims that he was dating new women and referring to one as his "wife" . Odd if true.
15. Why no coroners report mention in the local news* for Oct 2010. Has it been pulled since before trial? ( Depends on when police started an enquiry into Diane. I can't find *)

there'll be more.

Just as helpful what do we have against it's likelihood
1. Much less financial gain. ( Financial evidence)
2. Difficulty of accurately triggering a seizure to fit the circs, eg being alone, that afternoon.
3. Were toxicology tests already performed and came up blank?

Is a death insurance policy a good one?

I know a lot of people don't bother taking them out, they can be a blight on the monthly finances. He's tried to benefit form these twice.

I don't want to go off topic but if the survivor has enough income to survive then there's little point plus I have been led to believe that they are only really worth taking out for the period you have dependants. Example: Me and OH took one out when our son was 11 and cancelled it when he was 18.

 

[cottonweaver]

It doesn't appeal to everyone to do but with a bit of luck, someone may have saved a lock of Dianes hair to put in a locket maybe.

Don't suppose that Wendy would realistically keep a hair-brush? ( More usual with a mum of a child victim?)
However she may have retained some favourite clothing which hasn't been laundered. Quite common. On second thoughts a few single hairs wouldn't meet forensic evidential standards.

 

[BlueMosaic]

It's rather harsh to condemn someone for looking for the good things in others. You can't spend your life expecting everyone you meet to be a potential psychopath. IS must have been extremely adept at fabricating a convincing amiable personality while being so cold on the inside. It wasn't just Helen who was taken in by him, probably JSP would have been too if she'd had him on Loose Women to interview prior to these events.

I agree he was highly skilled at his act. It's easy to say someone was naïve in retrospect. If things turn out ok, it never arises..
From what I can gather, (forgive me if I'm wrong) Helen didn't have someone close to her (who really cared and had known her for a long time) nearby (apart from neighbours, dog walkers). IS effectively isolated her, spatially, from her London life and friends. Her family were miles away and I doubt he encouraged visiting them, or was particularly welcoming to John and his partner. The internet and phone calls don't give you any real feel for people, good or bad. I have to say I'm not a great fan of my son-in-law, but I know he cares deeply for my daughter, and she him. That has been borne out over the years countless times, through troubles and illness. That's not the same as feelings of misgiving, and she hasn't been widowed and isn't wealthy. She is, however, very astute about people. I have a ridiculous alternative version for Helen where she has a daughter (or son) like mine, who has been abroad for a couple of years, comes back and meets IS and gets the measure of him right away. Would Helen have wanted to know? In my version she does.

 

[MissTwiddle]

cremation is cheaper than a burial too so that may have relevance for an innocent man who has a hissy fit in paying £3 for afternoon refreshments during his crown bowling.

Bolded by me.

Good point, well made.

 

[MillyM]

Glad it's not just me. What do they mean, since Helen went missing ? They know now what happened, even if they choose not to believe their father is a murderer, they can't talk about Helen as if she is still just a missing person ?

I have to say - and I know this will not sit well with everyone but - neither of these two adults have said one single word of kindness or compassion for Helen, not when she was thought to be missing, not during the trial and not even now, when their father has been found guilty of her murder.
This is a woman that they shared a home with and, knowing Helen's generous spirit, received much from over a period of almost 3 years. Even if she was not their favourite person, a little bit of respect and a word or two of compassion would not come amiss, for the loss of Helen to her family and friends even if they personally do not miss her at all.
No one would expect them to give interviews to the Press and I would take a very dim view of any media who tried to do so. Nevertheless, their complete lack of care for Helen shines through in their every action.

Well, you know I am going to agree wholeheartedly with you with all the above as I have said same. Maybe they are the type not to display their feelings openly in public, with strangers, but not just in these last weeks and during evidence giving, but also during time of her missing, there appeared no signs of emotion, concern, warmth towards Helen at all. Given that their father had taken up with her so soon after their mother's death, I can't help feeling there was maybe a little friction at times particularly if they felt she was trying to 'replace' their mother.

 

[SweetCinnamon]

The only stipulation (I'm Catholic) is that ashes must be properly interred i.e. buried no 'scattering'.


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[BatFace]

I agree. They come across to me as supportive of their father and churlish. I was shocked. But as they say 'instruct by your actions', a French proverb. He must have been their 'role model' to some extent.


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We have had Michelle here describe them as really lovely young men though, and she's seen a fair bit of them over the course of the trial. I also gather that they are both quite assured of their father's guilt too.

 

[cottonweaver]

Is a death insurance policy a good one?

I know a lot of people don't bother taking them out, they can be a blight on the monthly finances. He's tried to benefit form these twice.

I don't want to go off topic but if the survivor has enough income to survive then there's little point plus I have been led to believe that they are only really worth taking out for the period you have dependants. Example: Me and OH took one out when our son was 11 and cancelled it when he was 18.

Yes we know he has his £2k a month and


from the forensic auditor at trial:

Stewart, following the death of his first wife, received a number of lump sums.
He received £28,000 from Cambridge County Council,
a £33,000 life insurance policy
and £16,000 Legal and General policy.

Then there's the £43K of Diane's estate which he hadn't yet touched.

I'm not sure what the L& G Policy is Miss Twiddles.
From the cop's evidence , the 43k has to be his, ie. not in trust for sons, or she would have said so in evidence surely and either Def or Pros would have scored a point with that, either way.

 

[SweetCinnamon]

Oh I'm sorry. Just a snap judgment by me.


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[Duchy]

The only stipulation (I'm Catholic) is that ashes must be properly interred i.e. buried no 'scattering'.


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As someone else said...you learn all sorts on here!

 

[Tortoise]

Oh I'm sorry. Just a snap judgment by me.


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Trust yourself.

 

[MillyM]

G💋 (@OddlyFamiliarYT) tweeted at 8:22 PM on Thu, Feb 23, 2017:
On Channel 5 at 10pm, 'Murdered By My Fiancé' is about Helen Bailey, a friend of mine and my moms. So glad Stewart's going to be behind bars

 

[SweetCinnamon]

By the way 'assured of their father's guilt' I'm nosy and wonder what they know about their father's behaviour and character. Someone will research and write a book I'm sure. Unless they change their names and flee the country their lives will be a living hell


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[cottonweaver]

As someone else said...you learn all sorts on here!

Sweet Cinnamon definitely doesn't want to end up stored in a double garage and who can blame her.

( I'm an ex-catholic SCinnamon so most of my family opt for burials even though it's prob not the green choice anymore. )