GUILTY UK - Helen Bailey, 51, Royston, 11 April 2016 #4

[Joely 123]

And he plays bowls, it was mentioned, which is quite strenuous as far as I know!

Yes - you are absolutely right faybradshaw - sorry for my error on your information.

 

[Alyce]

I also remembered someone saying bedding was draped on dining room chairs at Royston - and checked on JS's time in Court, but can't see him saying this in the script.
But you're right Florrie - any distinction in IS methods differing from Helen's are interesting to the prosecution - asking the reasons for his 'new' methods.

From Jamie's evidence
Jamie is asked about how Helen and Stewart normally dried bedding. He said it would be put over dining room chairs and wouldn’t be put in the tumble dryer.

 

[DollyDiamond]

This is my third attempt at writing this post, it keeps crashing (Aaargh!) so I'll keep it brief though it's quite a big subject. I may have to write this in short posts rather than one big one. Essentially my question to my fellow Websleuthers is this:

We've now seen several pieces of the jigsaw that make up IS defence that he neither killed Helen nor knowingly concealed her body. But how on earth is he going to elaborate on the events of Monday April 11th, the day of her disappearance/murder, to suggest that anyone other than him put her and Boris in that cesspit, within the family home? Obviously the mysterious Nick and Joe will be blamed - but how? I am really intrigued to hear the story his lawyer is going to tell when he opens the case for the defence.

Random thoughts - might he suggest N&J kidnapped her while he was out doing errands, and forced her to write the 'Broadstairs note'? Could he use the fact the bodies weren't found for 3 months to his advantage in some way? I would love to hear some possible theories. Presumably his story will have been scrutinised by defence and pros and there will be no tangible evidence of N&J?

 

[Lit Up]

OOOH. I've taken mirtrazapine it's an anti depressant and it knocked me out for basically a whole weekend. Woke up after it and ate everything in the house I could find. I couldn't take it for more than 2 days. I was out of it! Diazepam is way more tolerable than that.

Funny you say that, it's prescribed to cats and dogs as an appetite stimulant I know, because I was prescribed it for my cat

 

[snoopydog]

Funny you say that, it's prescribed to cats and dogs as an appetite stimulant I know, because I was prescribed it for my cat

Yes. I've never been hungrier in my life!


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[DollyDiamond]

Funny you say that, it's prescribed to cats and dogs as an appetite stimulant I know, because I was prescribed it for my cat

Wow, the things you learn on the Websleuths forum! I mustn't ever give it to my dog, if her appetite's stimulated any more the greedy little beggar will eat ME!

 

[Squamous]

It's flimsy though, isn't it? And JS will have had three months in the house without Helen there so time enough for a lad who probably has little interest to adjust his ideas of normal.

I'm really struck by how many people IS seemed to invite into his life after Helen disappeared. We have the police (reluctantly invited), and then he self referred to mental health services, social services (unless that was triggered by the MH referral?), he's been hopping off to the GP at many opportunities plus all the follow up from his op. Then we've had the solicitor too (two solicitors? The flat sale one and the will/POA one?), Tony Hurley...anyone else?

I know normal is different for everyone but surely this is not normal? It does seem a lot like he wanted as many experts as possible so he could use them to justify the things he wanted to do.


ETA But didn't mention Nick and Joe to any of them, obv.

 

[Lit Up]

Finding it odd this is a prosecution witness.....

This man was the only witness I've noticed who tried to say hello to Ian and catch his eye on the way out of the courtroom. Not even his sons did that.

 

[DollyDiamond]

This man was the only witness I've noticed who tried to say hello to Ian and catch his eye on the way out of the courtroom. Not even his sons did that.

OMG - how could he?

 

[Cherwell]

Ah, so you were in court today, Lit Up.

Can you expand on any of the evidence and witnesses? The reporting has been scanty today.

 

[Moll]

OMG - how could he?

Never mind, he also said he'd never heard of Joe and Nick.

 

[DollyDiamond]

Never mind, he also said he'd never heard of Joe and Nick.

True - I bet IS could have cheerfully throttled him!

 

[Lit Up]

OMG - how could he?

I don't think Ian expected Chris to try and make eye contact with him and acknowledge him; by the time he looked at Chris, Chris had already moved out of the room. They had both tried to acknowledge each other, but synced it wrong. IS must be feeling very lonely.

 

[Lit Up]

Ah, so you were in court today, Lit Up.

Can you expand on any of the evidence and witnesses? The reporting has been scanty today.

Ask away. I have nothing in particular to add. It was not the most gripping day in court. Interesting to see Christopher Priest, the long term friend of IS and the only witness I've noticed who tried to exchange a friendly gesture with Ian. No Ian getting emotional today. We had the cleaner and her interpreter in, saying that apparently she cleaned at the house for the previous owners, and then continued doing so after Helen went missing! She said that there was a green bedspread which had gone missing around the time of Helen's disappearance and she had never seen again.

I understand that there is no court tomorrow because the defence counsel is doing a case at southwark crown court; then the prosecution case will conclude on Friday, and then the defence case beings next week, with Ian taking the stand on Monday apparently.

 

[ColourPurple]

I have googled 'why do herbal vitamins taste so bad?' And there are comments on forums - saying such as 'in the industry we do not sweeten them to protect accidents with children' - and 'they make me want to puke'.

I was also thinking if Helen may have been recommended (in her searches) to use Mexican Yam, which I was by a herbalist as a natural antidote to the Menopause. And is brilliant - and comes in capsules.
No doubt IS has thrown away her products in her 'medicine cabinet' and IF so, why so? Nobody would throw out their 'missing partner's' belongings .. and most people, as Helen said in her book, can't even begin to face it when a beloved has died.
If he can clear her online history to support his 'innocence' he can hope to destroy her personal products - but he needs to answer the question, WHY!!!

If he was trying to make it look like she'd left then he'd get rid of them and say she took them with her.

 

[snoopydog]

Ask away. I have nothing in particular to add. It was not the most gripping day in court. Interesting to see Christopher Priest, the long term friend of IS and the only witness I've noticed who tried to exchange a friendly gesture with Ian. No Ian getting emotional today. We had the cleaner and her interpreter in, saying that apparently she cleaned at the house for the previous owners, and then continued doing so after Helen went missing! She said that there was a green bedspread which had gone missing around the time of Helen's disappearance and she had never seen again.

I understand that the prosecution case will conclude this week, and then the defence case beings next week, with Ian taking the stand on Monday apparently.

That's exciting. I can't wait to hear what rubbish he comes out with


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[Squamous]

I'm looking forward to the claptrap too, although not to the inevitable anxiety that he might somehow sow enough doubt in the minds of the jurors.

I was thinking earlier that a defence based on panicking after a sudden accidental/natural death would have been a bit more plausible. I guess admitting anything would be too much for his ego though.

 

[DollyDiamond]

I'm looking forward to the claptrap too, although not to the inevitable anxiety that he might somehow sow enough doubt in the minds of the jurors.

I was thinking earlier that a defence based on panicking after a sudden accidental/natural death would have been a bit more plausible. I guess admitting anything would be too much for his ego though.

I guess he blew any hope of a manslaughter plea out of the water by a/ drugging Helen for months and b/ dumping Helen and Boris in the cesspit. A clearer case of premeditated foul play it's hard to imagine! So he had 2 stark choices, to plead guilty or not guilty of murder. Great to get confirmation from Lit Up today that IS WILL take the stand. What fanciful, Grim(s) fairy tale will he come out with? I bet the prosecution lawyer is rubbing his hands with glee as I type this!

 

[Joely 123]

It's flimsy though, isn't it? And JS will have had three months in the house without Helen there so time enough for a lad who probably has little interest to adjust his ideas of normal.

I'm really struck by how many people IS seemed to invite into his life after Helen disappeared. We have the police (reluctantly invited), and then he self referred to mental health services, social services (unless that was triggered by the MH referral?), he's been hopping off to the GP at many opportunities plus all the follow up from his op. Then we've had the solicitor too (two solicitors? The flat sale one and the will/POA one?), Tony Hurley...anyone else?

I know normal is different for everyone but surely this is not normal? It does seem a lot like he wanted as many experts as possible so he could use them to justify the things he wanted to do.


ETA But didn't mention Nick and Joe to any of them, obv.

IS has had a busy 'social' life since the absence of Helen. Spending more time with his Sons - and Oliver's girlfriend. Enabling himself a holiday. Building restorations in the Hartwell Lodge with C Priest. Driving to JS bowls tournament when, JS was 'surprised he was there' - busy, busy man on phone to social workers, doctors to HELP him ..fixing clearance of his internet - driving to Broadstairs and then on to Surrey to help himself. OH dear - this is energy created by madness in escaping HIS truth.

 

[ZaZara]

Thank you all for all the updates of today. It was a bit chaotic, but one thing I have learned is that when planning a crime, remember to put the alarm into the equation.
As if our little Big Brothers phones and internet combined are not enough of a complication. I wasn't aware that an alarm could be watching you too nor that every member of the family may have their own code if I understood that well.

:gaah:

a question:

IS told the cleaning woman that he had already changed the bedding.

http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge-news/helen-bailey-murder-trial-jury-12538102

Ms Pedrosa: “He told me not to change the bedding because he had already done that. Mrs Helen’s clothing [was upstairs on wash basket] some of her clothes like t-shirt, trousers all on top of the basket.

“There was never any clothes on top of the basket. She would put it in the basket.

“There was bedding drying in the dining room. Clothes usually dried in the dryer.

“Mr Ian had made the bed. I don’t know whether it was freshly done but it had been done. “

(BTW, her name is Pedrosa, the reporter has corrected that in the video.)

IMHO you would dry bedding in the dining room only if you had no other space available, and this house is big, or is this some English quirk?