GUILTY UK - Joe McCann, multiple victims kidnapped & assaulted, April / May 2019

[Kasmeer]

The more I read of this case the more horrifying it gets And I know the defence have to try and say something but really, could they not find anything a bit less ridiculous than saying ALL these awful kidnaps and rapes are really consensual? I guess they can only work with what he'll give them but it must make the victims' suffering so much worse to hear rubbish like that after reliving such horrible experiences.

 

[Mrs Marple]

I wonder what prompted this rampage. It's aa unprecedented level of sexual violence in that timeframe in the UK, that has been discovered at any rate.

 

[dotr]

I wonder what prompted this rampage. It's aa unprecedented level of sexual violence in that timeframe in the UK, that has been discovered at any rate.

It is hard to think that this is JM's first rodeo, imo.

 

[scapa]

I wonder what prompted this rampage. It's aa unprecedented level of sexual violence in that timeframe in the UK, that has been discovered at any rate.

It's certainly at a level of intensity that I've only read about before a few times. Multiple rapes and assaults in a short span of time with astonishing levels of violence and sadism and the clear desire to destroy lives of persons and families, with seemingly no cooling-off period. I mean, how was he physically able to continue the rampage, especially given the amounts of alcohol he seems to have consumed.

Maybe the references to Hayley have some bearing? Then there's the white rosary, 'call me daddy' and so on. He's like a giant jumble of pathologies disguised as a human.

 

[Rocksy]

Joseph McCann was originally said to be from London, linked to Aylesbury but from what I’ve seen he had very strong links with Manchester (‘Beswick’) which explains why he was up there. I think the McCann’s moved to Bedford area in early 2000’s from Manchester. They were in the news in the late 90s/early 2000’s.

 

[Rocksy]

It is hard to think that this is JM's first rodeo, imo.

Think he was in prison for a long time. Would his DNA have been scanned against unsolved cases upon arrest? Not sure what the UK processes are.

Interesting point: A man with the McCann name was jailed in April this year, just before Joseph McCann’s spree. He was sneaking up to drivers getting into cars and stealing their bags etc. This was in Bedford, where Joseph McCann is based.

Joseph McCann is alleged to have used a similar technique when he allegedly took/got into the car of his 71 year old female victim on the final day these events.

 

[dotr]

Think he was in prison for a long time. Would his DNA have been scanned against unsolved cases upon arrest? Not sure what the UK processes are.

Interesting point: A man with the McCann name was jailed in April this year, just before Joseph McCann’s spree. He was sneaking up to drivers getting into cars and stealing their bags etc. This was in Bedford, where Joseph McCann is based.

Joseph McCann is alleged to have used a similar technique when he allegedly took/got into the car of his 71 year old female victim on the final day these events.

Welcome to Ws Rocksy, thanks for the interesting tidbits!

 

[bluebird69]

Joseph McCann was originally said to be from London, linked to Aylesbury but from what I’ve seen he had very strong links with Manchester (‘Beswick’) which explains why he was up there. I think the McCann’s moved to Bedford area in early 2000’s from Manchester. They were in the news in the late 90s/early 2000’s.

Thanks rocksy that is very interesting

 

[Legally Bland]

Looks like they weren't in court yesterday or today. Don't think this got reported from Wednesday:

On Wednesday, a tearful woman told jurors she was "terrified we was all going to die" when McCann allegedly tied her up and molested her two children at their Greater Manchester home.

During the lunch break, a female juror spoke to the woman in the street outside the Old Bailey.

[...]

The judge said he had considered the matter and decided the trial should continue with all 12 jurors.

But he warned there should be no contact with witnesses, adding that jurors should "positively keep your distance".

Judge warns McCann trial jury "keep your distance"

 

[Mrs Marple]

Looks like they weren't in court yesterday or today. Don't think this got reported from Wednesday:

On Wednesday, a tearful woman told jurors she was "terrified we was all going to die" when McCann allegedly tied her up and molested her two children at their Greater Manchester home.

During the lunch break, a female juror spoke to the woman in the street outside the Old Bailey.

[...]

The judge said he had considered the matter and decided the trial should continue with all 12 jurors.

But he warned there should be no contact with witnesses, adding that jurors should "positively keep your distance".

Judge warns McCann trial jury "keep your distance"

For goodness sake. Is she trying to get a mistrial??

 

[Legally Bland]

In a police interview played to a jury on Monday, the 71-year-old woman said she had finished shopping at Morrisons when McCann allegedly approached her car.

"He got into the passenger seat. I shouted, 'Get out, get out' and that is when he punched me in the face," she told Greater Manchester Police.

"He said, 'I don't want to do that, I have got a grandma'.

"He said he wanted a lift. He said, 'I don't want to hurt you. I have got a knife. I have killed somebody'."

The woman, who said she had been to church that morning, claimed she initially drove on the M66 motorway, but said she was made to switch seats with McCann as he wanted to buy cigarettes.

After they stopped at a service station, the alleged victim said she was driven to the entrance of an industrial estate.

"He got a bottle of wine out from my car and was drinking that while driving," the woman said.

"We got into this car park and he said, 'We'll have sex now whilst we are waiting'."

Woman, 71, 'punched in the face before being raped in car'

 

[dotr]

In a police interview played to a jury on Monday, the 71-year-old woman said she had finished shopping at Morrisons when McCann allegedly approached her car.

"He got into the passenger seat. I shouted, 'Get out, get out' and that is when he punched me in the face," she told Greater Manchester Police.

"He said, 'I don't want to do that, I have got a grandma'.

"He said he wanted a lift. He said, 'I don't want to hurt you. I have got a knife. I have killed somebody'."

The woman, who said she had been to church that morning, claimed she initially drove on the M66 motorway, but said she was made to switch seats with McCann as he wanted to buy cigarettes.

After they stopped at a service station, the alleged victim said she was driven to the entrance of an industrial estate.

"He got a bottle of wine out from my car and was drinking that while driving," the woman said.

"We got into this car park and he said, 'We'll have sex now whilst we are waiting'."

Woman, 71, 'punched in the face before being raped in car'

Now i am really wondering about the quality of the people who apparently hid the alleged monster when LE were searching for him.
Surely one of them was not his grandmother?! imo, speculation.
From link, thanks..

"The woman claimed she was made to partially undress and forced to perform a sex act on McCann.

"At some point he threw my phone into the undergrowth," the woman said.

He later drove them to a cash machine where he used her bank card to withdraw money, before meeting with a group of "youngsters", the woman claimed.

She was then made to get in the driver's seat again, while a "little girl" got into the back seat with McCann, the court heard.

The woman said she was ordered to drive to Manchester, but said that because McCann was "messing about" he was not looking where they were going.

She told police she drove in the wrong direction, and eventually pulled up to a service station as they were running low on fuel.

As she got out of the car, McCann "woke up" and ran after her, the woman alleged.

She told police that the girl in the back seat also ran out, while McCann allegedly grabbed the car keys and drove off at around 6pm."

 

[Elainera]

He does not seem human, more like a wild animal. How do people become like that? Alcohol is mentioned but no other drugs so far. I wonder if he has brain damage.

Terrible ordeal for the victims. I hope they can heal and move on from it.

 

[Scorpiette]

He said he's already killed someone?!?! (See Legallybland's quote above)

 

[Mrs Marple]

Rape at any age is a devastating crime but l really feel for her. This took place at a time in her life when she should be enjoying retirement.

 

[LadyL]

I'm actually glad he's not in the courtroom so the victims don't have to look at him or be in his presence. That would make their ordeal even worse and more terrifying I think. JMO.

ETA: I just read that the mother victim was behind a screen in court. I imagine they all were given that option.

 

[Legally Bland]

I missed this from last week, some evidence from the 11 year old. It makes pretty grim reading. (It's not in the main body of the article, it's inset on the right hand side.)


The 11-year-old cut his mother free from where she lay bound by cables on the bed after the alleged attacker chased his sister out of the house when she escaped and ran for help.

He told an officer in his police interview: 'We were all asleep and I heard my sister screaming. He was above her with a knife and there was a massive cut on her eye.

'He told us all to go on my sister's bed then he separated me and my sister from my mum and put my mum in my room and me and sister in my mum's room.

'He cut all the cables to my TV and X-box and everything and he tied her up with them.

Mother tells court 'knife-wielding sex attacker' abused her children | Daily Mail Online

 

[dotr]

I missed this from last week, some evidence from the 11 year old. It makes pretty grim reading. (It's not in the main body of the article, it's inset on the right hand side.)


The 11-year-old cut his mother free from where she lay bound by cables on the bed after the alleged attacker chased his sister out of the house when she escaped and ran for help.

He told an officer in his police interview: 'We were all asleep and I heard my sister screaming. He was above her with a knife and there was a massive cut on her eye.

'He told us all to go on my sister's bed then he separated me and my sister from my mum and put my mum in my room and me and sister in my mum's room.

'He cut all the cables to my TV and X-box and everything and he tied her up with them.

Mother tells court 'knife-wielding sex attacker' abused her children | Daily Mail Online

Although it is the least of the 11 year old's problems at this point, hoping that somebody fixes up the cables that were cut.
The tv and x- box could be useful distractions at this time, assuming and hoping the boy does not now associate those things with his family's ordeal. imo.
imo, speculation.

 

[Rocksy]

He said he’d killed someone, good chance that is true given that these group of crimes as a whole are about as psychopathic as one could get.

Obviously there are murderers who have done as bad or worse but there is something quite unique about the sustained thought and action in this spree, and it’s absolutely sickening.

I posted the other day about how J McCann and his family were in the news in Manchester from a young age for terrorising their neighbourhood but J McCann seems to have been involved in robbery through adulthood.

One thing I noticed is that there is a double rapist called Derry McCann from the Bow area who looks very similar to J McCann and had some similarities in his crimes (multiple attacks/robbery with a knife. Both would then pretend the victim was one of their many girlfriends/wives). They are not brothers as far as I can tell but could be related. Was Derry McCann part of the traveller community in Bow?

 

[Legally Bland]

Jurors heard yesterday how McCann, 34, grabbed a 71-year-old woman as she loaded her car with shopping at Morrisons in Bury, Lancashire, on 5 May.

She was sexually abused before he pulled up next to the schoolgirl and two boys in Heywood, Greater Manchester.

[...]

Giving a video statement to police, the girl said McCann asked them: 'Which one of you has been calling my sister names?'

He gave a name for the sister they had never heard of and ordered all three into the car.

The Old Bailey heard they drove a short distance before the two boys were ordered out.

[...]

The girl said: 'They were telling me to get out the car so I got, out but I got dragged back in.'

The pensioner was then made to drive and McCann sat next to the girl.

[...]

After an ordeal lasting more than two and a half hours the girl said he fell asleep on the back seat and the pensioner took her opportunity to escape.

They pulled into Knutsford Services on the M6 and she ran off after helping the girl to get away as well.

'She opened the door and ran so I could escape,' the teenager said.

McCann chased them briefly and shouted abuse at the pensioner - but then got back into the car and drove off.

They were helped by members of the public and called the police.

Girl, 13, tells jury how she tried to escape from 'serial rapist' Joseph McCann | Daily Mail Online