GUILTY UK - Sadie Hartley, 60, murdered, Helmshore, Lancs, 14 Jan 2016 #1

[Alyce]

'It's not the kind of thing I have done before'

We are now back underway after the lunch adjournment.

Over the break Mr Johnston was shown a number of explicit images Miss Williams` defence say he sent to her via text message.
After viewing them he says he may have sent them but he didn’t recognise them and that “it’s not the kind of thing I have done before.”

He also says he is “absolutely sure” he never gave Miss Williams a set of keys to his house.

In the weeks before Sadie died Mr Johnston said “there were no issues per say” in their relationship.
“There was a lot of pressure on our relationship from external factors.
“I attempted to talk to her about these because she appeared teary and stressed about it.
“But there were lots of reasons that could have been.”


http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/local-news/sadie-hartley-murder-trial-live-11612481

 

[Alyce]

My main concern was an embarrassing outburst if we were to meet'

The court hears Mr Johnston and Sarah Williams were still exchanging texts in November and December 2015, just weeks before Sadie Hartley was killed in January 2016.
Mr Johnston says: “I remember very little of this period.”

Mr Cole says many of these messages were also sexually explicit.
He says Miss Williams sent an explicit photograph to him which he replied: “Oh my. xx”
Mr Cole says he was “actively encouraging her” to continue this contact.
“You’re not telling her to stop or to go away are you?”

Mr Johnston says he was “doing his best to keep her on board” in order to maintain relations within the ski group.

He says he would often be at the Chill Factore, where Sarah worked, and “my main concern was an embarrassing outburst if we were to meet.”


http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/local-news/sadie-hartley-murder-trial-live-11612481

 

[Tortoise]

He really ought to admit it and save himself from looking more stupid than he is.

 

[Alyce]

Well, that's a new one to me. Sending explicit texts and photos in order to keep someone on board !!

 

[Tortoise]

[h=3]Texts 'were a moment of weakness'[/h][FONT=&quot]Mr Johnston says despite his efforts to merely maintain relations with Sarah “I would sometimes fall foul of that.”
There are more emotional scenes as he again sobs in the witness box.
He says fighting back tears that the texts “were a moment of weakness.”

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/local-news/sadie-hartley-murder-trial-live-11612481[/FONT]

 

[Alyce]

[h=3]Texts 'were a moment of weakness'[/h][FONT="]Mr Johnston says despite his efforts to merely maintain relations with Sarah “I would sometimes fall foul of that.”
There are more emotional scenes as he again sobs in the witness box.
He says fighting back tears that the texts “were a moment of weakness.”

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/local-news/sadie-hartley-murder-trial-live-11612481[/FONT]

Bit more than a moment though - seems to have been an ongoing dialogue. He really is coming across very cringey and I think Williams' barrister is doing a good job.

 

[Tortoise]

Bit more than a moment though - seems to have been an ongoing dialogue. He really is coming across very cringey and I think Williams' barrister is doing a good job.

True, but it's not making me doubt her guilt, which would seem to be the point.

He's not credible in the slightest.

 

[Tortoise]

[h=3]Letter sent to Sadie Hartley's home[/h][FONT=&quot]We are hearing more about the letter the prosecution say Sarah Williams sent to Sadie Hartley in September 2014.
Mr Johnston says he remembers that the letter was hand-written and he destroyed it.
However, the court hears the letter found in Mrs Hartley’s home was typed and had a phone number on it.
Mr Johnston says Sadie told she him had phoned the number on it “but she didn’t know it was Sarah”.
However he says from the content “it was pretty clear who it was from.”

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/local-news/sadie-hartley-murder-trial-live-11612481[/FONT]

 

[Alyce]

True, but it's not making me doubt her guilt, which would seem to be the point.

He's not credible in the slightest.

I agree. It's just showing how obsessed and manic Williams was, which is surely what the Pros need.

Am back to wondering just what the Defence is trying to achieve. IanJ might be cringey etc but there is no evidence that I can see that he had any idea what Williams would do.

 

[Alyce]

[h=3]Letter sent to Sadie Hartley's home[/h][FONT="]We are hearing more about the letter the prosecution say Sarah Williams sent to Sadie Hartley in September 2014.
Mr Johnston says he remembers that the letter was hand-written and he destroyed it.
However, the court hears the letter found in Mrs Hartley’s home was typed and had a phone number on it.
Mr Johnston says Sadie told she him had phoned the number on it “but she didn’t know it was Sarah”.
However he says from the content “it was pretty clear who it was from.”

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/local-news/sadie-hartley-murder-trial-live-11612481[/FONT]

Oh interesting. Were there two letters then ?

 

[Tortoise]

'Tried for months to end relationship'

[FONT=&amp]Mr Johnston says he had “tried for months” to end the relationship with Sarah Williams.
“I probably wasn’t forceful enough as it turns out” he adds.
He says by summer 2014 his relationship with Sadie Hartley “had been rekindled.”
The court is now being read extracts of a letter which Sarah Williams is said to have sent to Sadie Hartley telling her about her relationship with Ian Johnston.
Mr Johnston says Miss Williams showed him a similar, hand-written letter but he destroyed it as he thought “most of it was nonsense.”
He says he didn’t know Mrs Hartley had kept a copy of the letter she received.

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/local-news/sadie-hartley-murder-trial-live-11612481[/FONT]

This is what he said about the letter in his evidence in chief Alyce

 

[Tortoise]

Why is he saying he didn't know Sadie kept a copy? I think it's obvious she kept the original, not a copy. He thinks he destroyed the original but it wasn't the one Sadie received.

Ah never mind.

 

[Tortoise]

[h=3]Miss Williams was 'delusional', says Mr Johnston[/h][FONT=&quot]Concluding his cross-examination Mr Cole tells him it is “complete nonsense” he wanted to get rid of Sarah Williams.
“You may have wanted her as a bit on the side but you wanted her didn’t you?” Mr Cole asks him.
Mr Johnston replies: “Once me and Sadie decided we were going to be together I did not want Sarah Williams as a bit on the side.
“I have flirted with her but I never saw her.”
Anthony Cross QC, defending Katrina Walsh, said: “You may have never intended to perform the sexual acts you were talking about but you were talking about them.
“There is no good excuse for that is there?”
Mr Johnston says he “didn’t need an excuse”.
He is read a text from Miss Williams about wanting to be with him and he says she was “delusional.”

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/local-news/sadie-hartley-murder-trial-live-11612481[/FONT]

 

[Alyce]

It is odd that one is typed and one hand written.... did Williams send a second one when she got no reaction from the first one, or did Sadie copy the handwritten one, by typing it out ...... which doesnt make sense as she would surely just photocopy the handwritten one.

I think the Defence barristers - both of them - are now going a bit mad, accusing IJ of still wanting to be with Williams. Yes, clearly he did, but he's not on trial here for his morals.

 

[Tortoise]

Don't like him, not one bit. ughh, makes me shudder.

 

[Tortoise]

It is odd that one is typed and one hand written.... did Williams send a second one when she got no reaction from the first one, or did Sadie copy it out by typing it, which is mad, you would just photocopy the handwritten one.

I think the Defence barristers - both of them - are now going a bit mad, accusing IJ of still wanting to be with Williams. Yes, clearly he did, but he's not on trial here for his morals.

exactly

I think SW hand wrote (drafted) the letter, typed it to send to Sadie. Kept the draft hand written one and showed it to IJ. He tore it up. I don't think Sadie typed it or copied it.

 

[jessie]

I don't see what either of those barristers are hoping to gain by their cross examinations, IJ is not on trial here.


ETA Crossed post with you there Alyce !

 

[Tortoise]

Perhaps they think the jury can only cope with the idea of one villian in this.

 

[Tortoise]

[h=3]'It was just electronic flirting and nothing more'[/h][FONT=&quot]Mr Johnston says he repeatedly tried to end contact with Miss Williams but “she would turn back up, I would be flattered by it and I would fall for it.”
“You’re weak aren’t you?” Mr Cross asks him.
“Probably yes” he replies.
“You may have been vulnerable and may have been reduced by your circumstances but the reality is you simply couldn’t resist what she was doing by text?” Mr Cross adds.
Mr Johnston says “it was just electronic flirting and nothing more.”

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/local-news/sadie-hartley-murder-trial-live-11612481[/FONT]

 

[Tortoise]

If it wasn't a court of law I'd think these barristers were playing to the interests of the gutter press. What a diversion, a waste of court time.