UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 Jul 1986 #7

[Kasparthecat1]

Crime Guy (Paul Dettman) has written other articles on the case such as a recent two-parter about the River Thames:

"Anyway, the most convenient disposal site in the whole of Fulham and Putney is staring us in the face."

He stands by his assertion that Suzy did indeed go to Stevenage Road:

"My belief, using only logic and reason, is that Suzy was meeting someone in that area. And indeed at least two witnesses saw someone fitting her description talking to a man and looking at properties with Sturgis sale boards. Someone said the woman they saw was wearing a straw hat. A straw hat, Suzy’s hat, was found on the back parcel shelf of the Fiesta.

If she did meet a man then there are surely only two possible outcomes: either they stayed in the area and she died close by, or she was driven away from the scene in another car and killed elsewhere. The latter seems improbable. And there are no credible eyewitnesses for it."

Suzy: The River

Why is the most obvious feature on the Suzy Lamplugh crime scene always ignored?

www.crimeguy.com

Suzy 2: The River (continued)

The previous post was the most successful ever on Crime Guy. Why?

www.crimeguy.com

See also: CRIME GUY | Paul Dettmann | Substack (some of these pieces are subscriber only)

Apparently he's going to write a book about Fleetwood Mac, having travelled "the world" watching them. I mean the Mac are okay but a bit too AOR/MOR for my taste, at least in the Buckingham/Nicks era. Prefer Steely Dan meself. My own gig going days, long over, were spent mainly watching punk/post punk and the more experimental "alternative rock" bands in the late '70s and the '80s, along with an eclectic mix of soul/jazz/reggae/hip hop etc.

This piece which CG recommends has some interesting photos etc:

Suzy Lamplugh - And Some Personal Recollections Of The Summer of 1986...

I 'v e just read The Suzy Lamplugh Story by Andrew Stephen - and what a fascinating read it was...

www.1980sactual.com

I agree with Crime Guy that the Thames did not feature as much as one would expect as a possible deposition site.

As to the rest of what he's suggesting..not so sure....afaik the workmen nearby noticed nothing out if the ordinary and did not notice the Fiesta at all.

 

[Kasparthecat1]

Are the Stevenage Road witnesses any more credible than the Shorrolds Road ones, though? The one property on Stevenage Road that we know for certain was on the market with Sturgis, belonging to WJ, was being sold by MG, not Suzy. WJ maintains Suzy’s car didn’t move all day and two workmen said they saw nothing suspicious, so if Suzy was ‘abducted’ she would’ve surely been taken inconspicuously in another vehicle - how did her hat then end up back in her car, and why was the driver’s seat pushed back as if the vehicle had been driven by a man?

I’m not saying it’s an impossibility, far from it. But there are lots of holes in this theory - as with all of them.

Yeah - if she'd been "abducted" from Stevenage Road against her will I reckon someone woukd have seen or heard something. One theory I've read is that Sjl did indeed meet "kipper" at Shorrolds then drove off with Kipper in the driving seat; they transferred - perhaps temporarily - to Kipper's own car at Stevenage then drove off to somewhere else. Sjl is expecting to return to her own car, hence the purse left behind in the unlocked vehicle and the seat pushed right back. (I think AS may have suggested something similar in his own theory.).

 

[Kasparthecat1]

Yeah nothing makes much sense! Add in BW's sighting later in the afternoon and things become even more puzzling. If BW is to believed, SJL was alive and well in her Fiests at 2.45 - but where has she been in the meantime? She's without her bag too - she's left it at the office as if intending to return there within a short period of time.

 

[rvlvr]

She's without her bag too - she's left it at the office as if intending to return there within a short period of time.

Completely agree, this is the key detail for me - it’s behaviour typical of someone who’s just popping out and won’t be long. I don’t believe she’d have left her vehicle unlocked with the purse inside on Stevenage Road either, not when the issue of her lost property had been playing on her mind that morning.

I find the Shorrolds Road to Stevenage Road abduction theory implausible, there are too many moving parts for me. The perfect place to do Suzy harm was 37 Shorrolds Road, the property was empty and as evidenced by the paucity of witness sightings the street wasn’t exactly a hive of activity that lunchtime. Travelling on to Stevenage Road would’ve added an unnecessary layer of complexity, imo.

I think Suzy’s behaviour was indicative of someone who wanted to run an errand and felt pushed for time. Popping a house viewing appointment in the diary allowed her to get out of an office that was short staffed and to tick off a task - the retrieval of her possessions from the pub - that was understandably preoccupying her, thus freeing up her afternoon for calls, paperwork and the like, followed by the legitimate house viewing she had scheduled for that evening.

 

[Kasparthecat1]

Popping out on an errand makes perfect sense. I do feel though, that if she WERE going to collect her stuff, she would've taken her bag to put her stuff in. The errand should've taken around the same time as a viewing would've done, so collecting her stuff seems credible, perhaps getting a sandwich on the way back (hence the purse).

I agree with you that Shorrolds seems a better place for an abduction if there was one. On balance I feel the Fiesta was dumped by the perp (or someone acting for/with the perp, perhaps unknowingly.)

 

[tes1984]

I agree with Crime Guy that the Thames did not feature as much as one would expect as a possible deposition site.

As to the rest of what he's suggesting..not so sure....afaik the workmen nearby noticed nothing out if the ordinary and did not notice the Fiesta at all.

I don't rate this Crime Guy fella in the slightest. JMO but for me, he's like DV, someone who has dabbled in the case, but isn't really an authority.

 

[tes1984]

My view is that Suzy was abducted by JC.

I'm far from the type to always believe the official story, but there's a lot that's never been released into the public domain.

 

[tes1984]

I think Suzy went to Shorrolds for a 'genuine' appointment.

There's been a lot of misinformation about how Sturgis employees took viewings.

They took a lot of last minute type bookings, without registering more than basic details.

 

[Spy Versus Spy]

After reading the AS book recently....I think there are some accurate portrayals of the Parents, Police, etc. Personally was disapointed at any investigative insight. I'm yet to read any other book (not sure I want to,).

For me, the Witness statements are crucial. All cannot be correct within a workable synopsis?

I agree with prev posters about the authenticity of the viewing booking. Why leave bag etc behind at Office?

Im not sure how or why but I somehow believe that SJ and Mr K did meet per the SR appmnt, without ever exploring or entering the Property. Maybe this was a front for a more offbook sale on StR somehow?

I also worry about the Couple investment chats/reality.

All v puzzling. X

 

[Spy Versus Spy]

Ps...The abandoned BMW, Mr Kiper, link is underexplored imho. So many coincidences in this case

 

[rvlvr]

My view is that Suzy was abducted by JC.

I'm far from the type to always believe the official story, but there's a lot that's never been released into the public domain.

Really? The guy’s dead, so presumably there’s nothing to stop this stuff being released now, if it exists.

 

[Klclevi]

Is there no public information on exactly what JC was doing the three days prior to Monday 28th?
What would have stopped him abducting her on Friday afternoon as she left work? Or for that matter the Saturday lunchtime when she left? To me it seems odd to wait until the Monday if he was that opportunistic - unless he did not have access to a property until the weekend.

 

[tes1984]

Really? The guy’s dead, so presumably there’s nothing to stop this stuff being released now, if it exists.

The police won't release information. Despite naming a prime suspect in public, they still treat this case as 'unsolved' when it suits them.

 

[Klclevi]

The police won't release information. Despite naming a prime suspect in public, they still treat this case as 'unsolved' when it suits them.

That is just terrible... so wrong on their part - IMO tes1984. I fully respect your viewpoint. I have no doubt there is alot of information that has not been released to the public - I do not know the laws in the UK but its probably time it all was made available.
The more i read , no doubt the cogs and wheels of legality sit alongside this. DL and PL had control of things they probably should not have in the media , and therefore actually put at risk in the end of finding out what happened. No disrespect meant at all , thye were doing what they felt was right - and what ultimately came of it with the development of the trust is truely innovative and wonderful. Some great things can be borne of terrible grief. It is truly sad - I mean look at the amount of people on this thread - this young woman and this case are not forgotten and are not likely to be in the next decade or more.
Yes we banter back and forward about the 'what ifs' - everyone here has their own views and theories. (respected by everyone ) . You can sit and ponder for days on what may have happened. You think about a simple , logical explanation in your head but then there is so much in this that is not explained - it is confounding.
Ultimately its about trying to find her remains, and what happened to her and that is what matters.
I really respect and am interested to hear what everyones thoughts are on this forum each day.

IMO I think there is something else that has not come to light or has been protected all this time - not JC . I think the answer lies in what has been unsaid. Hidden relationships (not necessarily sexual, but may well could have been as well)..

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

The police won't release information. Despite naming a prime suspect in public, they still treat this case as 'unsolved' when it suits them.

IMO what the police are doing is wrong and they must state their case to the public and release the info they have. JC is dead and SJL's parents are no longer with us.

Perhaps her siblings are the people who could force the issue?

This situation should be carefully scrutinised. The police are an unaccountable institution, this has been identified by experts, they only answer to central government and central government is not asking anything of them so they remain an unwieldy and corrupt behemoth of an organisation failing everyone and themselves IMO.

Also, separate issue but to illustrate the above, it was perfectly clear (to me) when serving armed police officer, Wayne Couzens, abducted and killed his victim, that this was not his first rodeo, he performed his crime meticulously and systematically. News came out about his past and locations that he had operated from in previous employment. We were all told via mainstream media that there would be a deep dive into his past, past associations, locations, other missing women and complainants etc. Yet we have never heard another thing since.

JMO MOO

 

[tes1984]

Is there no public information on exactly what JC was doing the three days prior to Monday 28th?
What would have stopped him abducting her on Friday afternoon as she left work? Or for that matter the Saturday lunchtime when she left? To me it seems odd to wait until the Monday if he was that opportunistic - unless he did not have access to a property until the weekend.

No and he's the only long term prisoner I've ever heard of who can't remember where he went after he was released. JC always had selective amnesia though.

My view is that he chooses the Monday because he's posing as a Bristol businessman.

I doubt he planned to murder Suzy, but like the seasoned serial rapist he was, he would have always had his rape kit (gloves, knife etc) with him just in case. He had a long history of exploding into severe violence when challenged or rejected by women.

 

[Klclevi]

mmm good point -

 

[rvlvr]

DV says Cannan could account for his movements:

“Cannan provided alibi witnesses to the police, which were accepted during the 1980s and through to the mid-nineties. But then in 2000, after these witnesses had passed away, the police decided that these witnesses were no longer suitable and began questioning the evidence that those alibi witnesses would have provided.”

Suspect in disappearance of Suzy Lamplugh should not have been named - Property Industry Eye

Suspect in disappearance of Suzy Lamplugh should not have been named - Breaking news for estate agents and the residential property industry. Independent, unbiased, and factual reporting. A forum for discussion and debate of topics of the day. Subscribe for our free daily newsletter.

propertyindustryeye.com

JMO, the fact that no one has ever been able to link Cannan and Suzy, never mind demonstrate that he was responsible for her disappearance, really is extraordinary. It beggar’s belief that in all this time the Met haven’t leaked something that provides support for their theory, imo.

 

[Kasparthecat1]

No and he's the only long term prisoner I've ever heard of who can't remember where he went after he was released. JC always had selective amnesia though.

My view is that he chooses the Monday because he's posing as a Bristol businessman.

I doubt he planned to murder Suzy, but like the seasoned serial rapist he was, he would have always had his rape kit (gloves, knife etc) with him just in case. He had a long history of exploding into severe violence when challenged or rejected by women.

My understanding is that he did give an alibi - he says I think that he went directly to his mother's home in the West Midlands by train. I'm not sure though at what point in the investigation he gave this statement, or even if he did at all, because by the time LE got around to checking it, the corroborating witnesses had passed away (sister and mother). Convenient.

 

[Kasparthecat1]

DV says Cannan could account for his movements:

“Cannan provided alibi witnesses to the police, which were accepted during the 1980s and through to the mid-nineties. But then in 2000, after these witnesses had passed away, the police decided that these witnesses were no longer suitable and began questioning the evidence that those alibi witnesses would have provided.”

Suspect in disappearance of Suzy Lamplugh should not have been named - Property Industry Eye

Suspect in disappearance of Suzy Lamplugh should not have been named - Breaking news for estate agents and the residential property industry. Independent, unbiased, and factual reporting. A forum for discussion and debate of topics of the day. Subscribe for our free daily newsletter.

propertyindustryeye.com

JMO, the fact that no one has ever been able to link Cannan and Suzy, never mind demonstrate that he was responsible for her disappearance, really is extraordinary. It beggar’s belief that in all this time the Met haven’t leaked something that provides support for their theory, imo.

Although it has its faults I think DVs book is the only source (up till then, anyway) that challenges the notion that JC was responsible. Even the most well-known and renowned commentators (looking at you, Prof David Wilson) seem to be completely taken in by JCs guilt. It's really disappointing. And even if there IS more evidence pointing to JC which has never been released into the public domain, it was still not sufficient to put him in front of a jury.