UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 Jul 1986 #8

[lee sumner]

Was this the witness who was vague about the time of the sighting?

Am I right in thinking that only one witness at SR saw the beribboned bottle?

yes, doyle seen bottle. riglin did not.

 

[Konstantin]

On other group/s of friends ‘always calling’ NB: 1988 article. After the police had ruled out Sturgis re: mystery client other contacts needed a very deep dive. No point just focusing mainly on Putney friends. Is the clue in the contact book Putney friends & family didn’t know about (?)

It really does seem clear that she compartmentalized her life quite strictly. Such that each set of people didn't know her as well as they thought.

Perhaps true of many people though.

 

[kes1972]

If the police did anything well they looked into Sturgis clients efficiently, past, present - by the hundred. The thought was this ‘deal’ was with a client. They spent a huge amount of time here.

What they didn’t seem to do was assume this deal was with a contact in her lost book etc. This proved harder to verify, those that they did speak to had spurious reasons for knowing her. They apparently didn’t finish checking them all.

I don’t deny surmises though & very much agree or lean towards, this being an ‘in plain sight’ - re: the answers - case.

I agree with what you are saying but wonder if clive barwell owned property on finlay,ellerby or doneraile street or possibly this house too?

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

It really does seem clear that she compartmentalized her life quite strictly. Such that each set of people didn't know her as well as they thought.

Perhaps true of many people though.

Am not sure - not your average 25 year old, most very close friends know of your other circles vaguely at least,it was possibly harder in past in some ways (?) landlines etc. Maybe why SL used the local phonebox?

 

[kes1972]

yes, doyle seen bottle. riglin did not.

I read this article this morning about shani linked to clive barwell and donald robertson, the bottle of champagne caught my attention.

 

[kes1972]

Am not sure - not your average 25 year old, most very close friends know of your other circles vaguely at least,it was possibly harder in past in some ways (?) landlines etc. Maybe why SL used the local phonebox?

I sometimes think people are going too deep on her life and think it may just have been an opportunity taken by cb inncahoots withs dr and an other

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

I sometimes think people are going too deep on her life and think it may just have been an opportunity taken by cb inncahoots withs dr and an other

That’s def very true & all got to be factored in & you’re right. It’s very easy to read too much into everything in a case where there is infuriatingly little to go on.

But the facts are whoever was leaning on her & buying a property with she couldn’t otherwise afford never came forward & wasn’t identified. Sturgis clients past & present were ruled out as far as possible. There’s evidence from Mum & Dad this deal was real, possibly a bit problematic, even dangerous/mildly or majorly illegal, & amongst very last discussions.

We have ‘contacts’ in a book that puzzled police, what linked them? Some were shady, NB: AN. Then apparently the police gave up here as ‘too many’ of them. No one had seen this book before apparently. Was there a theme?

We have a flatmate saying another disparate group poss linked to the Hilton or QE2 ringing up. She herself thought this was significant enough, vital, that police bottomed out.

Then we have JC helping ‘Sue’ buy a property who lived about a mile or two away

Is ‘Kipper’ incognito in her ‘contacts’ to this day? I say that’s possible, whoever he was.

 

[kes1972]

I sometimes think people are going too deep on her life and think it may just have been an opportunity taken by cb inncahoots withs dr and an other

With the shani abduction and murder there was said to be 3 men standing at the bonnet of the car.

 

[WestLondoner]

Is ‘Kipper’ incognito in her ‘contacts’ to this day? I say that’s possible, whoever he was.

Even in 1986 it was possible for LE to do a reverse lookup of phone numbers. They must have done so and thus had the subscriber name and number behind each one. You wonder if the fact that none was any Mr Kipper prompted them to give up. Peterson, Jessop, and of course Taggart would have been interesting ones to follow up.

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

Even in 1986 it was possible for LE to do a reverse lookup of phone numbers. They must have done so and thus had the subscriber name and number behind each one. You wonder if the fact that none was any Mr Kipper prompted them to give up. Peterson, Jessop, and of course Taggart would have been interesting ones to follow up.

AS said they gave up on contact book as too many in it - only some/a sample looked at AND they were following other, better, leads as they saw it I believe. They never completed a full search in other words.

They also apparently gave up on BMW look up outside Shorrolds - petrolhead RT gave make & model details.

They also seemed to think these people not relevant in book. Barley said they looked at ‘boyfriends’ where they could & ruled out, but did they exhaust everything here & thoroughly in reviews? Was she really buying or selling a car at time stated etc? Couldn’t a ‘boyfriend’ be listed here?

Too many on this case seem unfamiliar with earliest details so I do wonder about a very rich seam of evidence languishing in a filing cabinet…I really hope not.

Not to be too negative on early case detective work - all up against it & they cared very much.

Taggart & shared car & JC aliases all came to light at SB time and later. Has pocket contact book/diary been scanned with all this in mind & more recently? Barley doesn’t seem to know Taggart had a council flat…Looking now for any small ads placed by all the numbers another line. They’ll be a couple of hits at least especially if so numerous.

That’s interesting on number searches in 86.

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

I read this article this morning about shani linked to clive barwell and donald robertson, the bottle of champagne caught my attention.

She was off to see a boyfriend & had Birthday presents etc from memory. I did notice the seat pushed back & lack of keys.

 

[kes1972]

She was off to see a boyfriend & had Birthday presents etc from memory. I did notice the seat pushed back & lack of keys.

And the champagne bottle

 

[Lady Stoddart-West]

And the champagne bottle

Yes but if memory serves Shani had bought that.

 

[Klclevi]

Hello

I was wondering if someone could just give me a brief rundown of the M and A motorways out of London. What is the meaning of the M and the A please? If its not too much trouble. Sorry. Just trying to get my bearings when people are talking about these routes. and how they connect to SL. I am familiar with the basic geographical areas of SC etc and NB, but not really the connecting highways that link them.
Thankyou

 

[tes1984]

I sometimes think people are going too deep on her life and think it may just have been an opportunity taken by cb inncahoots withs dr and an other

A random abduction is possible, but I haven't seen anything to link CB or DR with each other, or with the Fulham area.

 

[tes1984]

With the shani abduction and murder there was said to be 3 men standing at the bonnet of the car.

There was a sighting of three men, but the focus seemed to shift towards another sighting closer to where Shani was found, which only involved one man and a woman.

You never know, but the forensic evidence and his known MO suggest that DR acted alone.

 

[Klclevi]

Another question if I can

JCs murder trial was held at Exeter crown court ( why there please ). As opposed I guess to the terrible Soham case which was conducted at the Old Bailey.

 

[Rookie D]

Hello

I was wondering if someone could just give me a brief rundown of the M and A motorways out of London. What is the meaning of the M and the A please? If its not too much trouble. Sorry. Just trying to get my bearings when people are talking about these routes. and how they connect to SL. I am familiar with the basic geographical areas of SC etc and NB, but not really the connecting highways that link them.
Thankyou

An "M" stands for "Motorway," which is similar to the interstate road network in the States.

An "A" road is the next step down. Prior to motorways being constructed, the "A" road was the main road network to navigate the UK. "A" roads often pass through or around towns and cities.

A "B" road is next. These are minor roads found in most towns and villages, and more rural settings that are almost always single lane roads (one lane in each direction)

There are also other smaller roads than a "B" road, that are termed as unclassified (doesn't meet the "B" road criteria) and which are essentially single lane (only room for one direction of travel) roads, dirt tracks, and rural tracks for horses etc...

The M4 was built to improve the west to east A4 route, the M1 was built to improve the north to south A1 route, etc etc...

You also have "The ridgeway" road that runs between Buckinghamshire to Wiltshire and is around 5000 years old.

 

[kes1972]

A random abduction is possible, but I haven't seen anything to link CB or DR with each other, or with the Fulham area.

15 miles as the crow flies not that far

 

[kes1972]

15 miles as the crow flies not that far

Both drove lorries, i guess it would be fairly difficult to find the connection after all these years, maybe we will never know