US coal mine collapse traps six-Utah - Thread No. 2

[cheko1]

In support of the families of the coal miners, Helper City will be hosting a benefit (auction, food, prayers and song) on Aug. 24 at 7 p.m. at the Main Street Park in Helper. Any contributions that the public wishes to make towards this fund raising event would be greatly appreciated. Contact Debbie Jones at 435-650-1882 or Mava Farrell at 435-472-5954. Donations can be picked up on request, money donations can be made payable to Helper Crandall Canyon Fund at Wells Fargo Bank.
http://www.ecprogress.com/index.php?tier=1&page=happenings

Has Murray Energy yet announced what his intentions are for the miners families? Did they have excellant benefits?
Large life insurance policies?
Did they have pensions for the families?
Many times kids left behind are given college grants 100% paid.

 

[cheko1]

The Salt Lake Tribune
Article Last Updated: 08/21/2007 05:12:07 PM MDT

Posted: 4:53 PM- Gov. Jon Huntsman Jr. asked the federal Mine Safety and Health Administration today to immediately inspect two additional mines owned by Murray Energy Corp. in Carbon County, according to a news release from the governor's office.

The call came as Murray Energy Corp. said a fifth bore hole would not punch through in the Crandall Canyon mine until Wednesday morning. Four previous attempts to locate six trapped miners were unsuccessful, and company representatives have indicated this might be the last attempt. It was first thought the drill might penetrate into a cavity sometime Tuesday.

Huntsman also is preparing to appoint an independent investigation committee to make recommendations to ensure safety in Utah mines, his office said.
"These additional inspections are only the beginning of a larger investigation that needs to be conducted in Utah's deep mines to secure safety for our miners," Huntsman said in the release. "We must do all we can, at every level, to be prepared for a catastrophe like this one. This is the least we can do to ensure that the lives lost have not been in vain."

Source: http://www.sltrib.com/ci_6680768

Wow it sounds like the Gov isn't very happy with the way things are being done. Maybe he'll get to the bottom of it. He doesn't want anymore accidents in his state. I'm happy he is having an investigation into this. The Gov spent alot of time with the families of the miners & he probably wasn't real happy with what he heard.

He has stated he doesn't want any part of the mine reopened, its to unsafe. Wonder if that means the equipment might have to stay inside indefinately too?

 

[Buzz Mills]

Wow it sounds like the Gov isn't very happy with the way things are being done. Maybe he'll get to the bottom of it. He doesn't want anymore accidents in his state. I'm happy he is having an investigation into this. The Gov spent alot of time with the families of the miners & he probably wasn't real happy with what he heard.

He has stated he doesn't want any part of the mine reopened, its to unsafe. Wonder if that means the equipment might have to stay inside indefinately too?

This is what governors do to CTA. They apppoint a committe to investigate. MSHA makes all decisions on whether a mine can be excavated anyway, so what is new about that.

MSHA may get a little tougher, in order to appease the public, too.

While they are doing all of this, Utah Mining will shut down operations and layoff all remaining ??? employees, etc.. It won't be that long before all remaining ??? employees won't be very happy being out of work. That's reality for you.

 

[cheko1]

This is what governors do to CTA. They apppoint a committe to investigate. MSHA makes all decisions on whether a mine can be excavated anyway, so what is new about that.

MSHA may get a little tougher, in order to appease the public, too.

While they are doing all of this, Utah Mining will shut down operations and layoff all remaining ??? employees, etc.. It won't be that long before all remaining ??? employees won't be very happy being out of work. That's reality for you.

From all accounts many people were afraid of that mine. For instance the 12 that asked to be reassigned. Also Dale Black's brother stated he had so many phone calls from miners in regards to unsafe conditions he quit answering his phone.

MSHA has deemed it totally unstable. Murray bought it a year ago, the mine was only scheduled to be open until 2008, which is only a little over 4 mo to go. Some say that was the reason for the retreat mining it was to get every morsel of coal available.

Miners were well aware the job wouldn't last until they chose to retire. So most wouldn't be to surprised /if the mine was totally shut down & may welcome it. Rather then get buried 2000 ft below ground & left like your a nothing & a nobody!

 

[Earthbound Misfit I]

I would think that being the Gov asked MSHA to immediately inspect 2 other mines that MSHA will take this very seriously when coming to a conclusion on whether the mines are safe. Something has to be done to make sure things are as safe as possible for miners. There is always a risk going down in the mines but there are ways to make it safer for them & those steps should be taken.

 

[Earthbound Misfit I]

Last I read they had extended it so that the mine (CCM) wasn't to close until 2011. I need to look that up again to be sure.

From all accounts many people were afraid of that mine. For instance the 12 that asked to be reassigned. Also Dale Black's brother stated he had so many phone calls from miners in regards to unsafe conditions he quit answering his phone.

MSHA has deemed it totally unstable. Murray bought it a year ago, the mine was only scheduled to be open until 2008, which is only a little over 4 mo to go. Some say that was the reason for the retreat mining it was to get every morsel of coal available.

Miners were well aware the job wouldn't last until they chose to retire. So most wouldn't be to surprised /if the mine was totally shut down & may welcome it. Rather then get buried 2000 ft below ground & left like your a nothing & a nobody!

 

[Earthbound Misfit I]

This is where I read it...

<snip>
At the Crandall Canyon Mine, where six miners are trapped, there may not be much coal left to harvest. The tragedy of the mine collapse may not help.

"The mine is running short of resources, so this will probably hasten the ultimate closure of that mine if they have to close off a portion of that mine because it's not safe," said Dave Tabet, the energy and minerals program director for the Utah Geological Survey.

According to the latest coal report prepared by the UGS, the Crandall Canyon Mine was scheduled to close next year. Longwall mining equipment used in the Crandall Canyon Mine already had been sent to another mine near Helper.

"Genwal is currently pulling pillars in Crandall Canyon and plans to close the mine in 2008," the report said.

An updated report due to be released next week now says the mine is scheduled to close in 2011, thanks to an increase in the price and value of coal.

Genwal Resources operates the mine. It is owned by UtahAmerican Energy, which is owned by Murray Energy Corp. The company has not disclosed its plans for the mine.
</snip>

More at link: http://deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,695199903,00.html

 

[Buzz Mills]

From all accounts many people were afraid of that mine. For instance the 12 that asked to be reassigned. Also Dale Black's brother stated he had so many phone calls from miners in regards to unsafe conditions he quit answering his phone.

MSHA has deemed it totally unstable. Murray bought it a year ago, the mine was only scheduled to be open until 2008, which is only a little over 4 mo to go. Some say that was the reason for the retreat mining it was to get every morsel of coal available.

Miners were well aware the job wouldn't last until they chose to retire. So most wouldn't be to surprised /if the mine was totally shut down & may welcome it. Rather then get buried 2000 ft below ground & left like your a nothing & a nobody!

All mines are basically unsafe; some are just more unsafe than others. Those miners who allegedly complained to their brothers, family, friends, don't want their names in the paper especially if they are going to be out of work. Complaining among each other, doesn't do any good. You have to direct your complaints to the right people. In this case MSHA. I think it is the nature of the occupation to complain about the business. I never met one steelworker, and I met a lot, who, after a drink, or two, wouldn't begin b*tching about the way U.S.Steel was running the company, and how they were taking advantage of the employees, etc,, etc..

 

[Earthbound Misfit I]

August 21st, 2007 @ 6:10pm


John Daley Reporting

Utah has vast coal resources, but its reserves, the amount immediately available, will run out within the next few decades, according to geologists and mining experts.

Much of the coal that's easiest to get to has already been mined. That means in the future companies will need to dig deeper or move elsewhere. The Crandall Canyon tragedy highlights this reality.

One longtime miner predicts just as the September 11 terrorist attacks changed our worldview, so will Crandall represent a realization that the easy coal in that region is now gone.

"They've been mining coal here for years. It's honeycombed. We've taken the cream off the top, now we're mining the hard-to-get coal. I don't know how they're going to fix that to where we can get in there and mine safely," veteran coal miner Wade Norton explained.

Miners, industry leaders and geologists all agree Utah has plenty of coal. The question is, at what cost? "All of our fossil fuels are finite in supply so it depends on how much we're willing to pay to get these resources out of the ground," David Tabet of the Utah Geological Survey said.

This is a growing issue for Utah. Upwards of 95 percent of the state's electric power is generated by coal.

The price of coal in recent years is up roughly 25 percent compared with five years ago. When prices are higher that leads to mining in places that were, perhaps, passed over when prices were lower.

Utah has 22 coal fields. Three of the mines; The Wasatch Plateau, Book Cliffs and Emery mines are active, but have been heavily mined. There are also several mines of marginal quantity and quality. And a few are promising, but may face other hurdles regarding things like ownership, quality and distance to existing power plants.

More at link: http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148&sid=1675275

 

[Earthbound Misfit I]

<snip>


Gov. Jon Huntsman said he wants all mines owned by Robert Murray investigated. The governor is asking MSHA to conduct immediate inspections of the other two Carbon County mines owned by Murray Energy.

"Furthermore, if it takes every dollar this guy has in his bank account, he needs to bring closure to this darn thing. We've got families of six good people who are currently sitting in that mine," Gov. Huntsman said.

Everything now seems dependent on this fifth borehole, which seems to be the last hope of finding anything out about the six men who have been unaccounted for over the last 16 days inside the Crandall Canyon mine. Those answers should all come tomorrow.

</snip>

More here at link: http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148&sid=1672137

 

[Buzz Mills]

August 21st, 2007 @ 6:10pm


John Daley Reporting

Utah has vast coal resources, but its reserves, the amount immediately available, will run out within the next few decades, according to geologists and mining experts.

Much of the coal that's easiest to get to has already been mined. That means in the future companies will need to dig deeper or move elsewhere. The Crandall Canyon tragedy highlights this reality.

One longtime miner predicts just as the September 11 terrorist attacks changed our worldview, so will Crandall represent a realization that the easy coal in that region is now gone.

"They've been mining coal here for years. It's honeycombed. We've taken the cream off the top, now we're mining the hard-to-get coal. I don't know how they're going to fix that to where we can get in there and mine safely," veteran coal miner Wade Norton explained.

Miners, industry leaders and geologists all agree Utah has plenty of coal. The question is, at what cost? "All of our fossil fuels are finite in supply so it depends on how much we're willing to pay to get these resources out of the ground," David Tabet of the Utah Geological Survey said.

This is a growing issue for Utah. Upwards of 95 percent of the state's electric power is generated by coal.

The price of coal in recent years is up roughly 25 percent compared with five years ago. When prices are higher that leads to mining in places that were, perhaps, passed over when prices were lower.

Utah has 22 coal fields. Three of the mines; The Wasatch Plateau, Book Cliffs and Emery mines are active, but have been heavily mined. There are also several mines of marginal quantity and quality. And a few are promising, but may face other hurdles regarding things like ownership, quality and distance to existing power plants.

More at link: http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148&sid=1675275

In West Virginia, as we saw in a previous articles, the mining industry is leveling mountains. While the Utah mountains are a little more rugged, I'm sure the mining industry can accomplish the task. Of course, afterward, everything looks liike sh*t, so the environment pays a very heavy price.

 

[cheko1]

All mines are basically unsafe; some are just more unsafe than others. Those miners who allegedly complained to their brothers, family, friends, don't want their names in the paper especially if they are going to be out of work. Complaining among each other, doesn't do any good. You have to direct your complaints to the right people. In this case MSHA. I think it is the nature of the occupation to complain about the business. I never met one steelworker, and I met a lot, who, after a drink, or two, wouldn't begin b*tching about the way U.S.Steel was running the company, and how they were taking advantage of the employees, etc,, etc..

Apparently MSHA isn't the one to complain to they gave CCM a clean bill a few weeks before Aug 6.

Gov is wanting to know why? Especially with written warning about the ceiling being bad. Gov Dad died in a mining accident 50 yrs ago. He is wanting something set up so a catastrophe like this never occurs again.

This accident will divide the towns, without a doubt. I feel so sorry for all the miners & there families. What a awful thing to have happen.

I think anyone gripes & complains about there job.

 

[Buzz Mills]

Apparently MSHA isn't the one to complain to they gave CCM a clean bill a few weeks before Aug 6.

Gov is wanting to know why? Especially with written warning about the ceiling being bad. Gov Dad died in a mining accident 50 yrs ago. He is wanting something set up so a catastrophe like this never occurs again.

This accident will divide the towns, without a doubt. I feel so sorry for all the miners & there families. What a awful thing to have happen.

I think anyone gripes & complains about there job.

Cheko, do you mean the governor's father died in the mines 50 years ago too; I heard the mayor of Price say his father died in the mines 50 years ago; what are the odds. Next thing we know, they will be the same age.

 

[Buzz Mills]

<snip>


Gov. Jon Huntsman said he wants all mines owned by Robert Murray investigated. The governor is asking MSHA to conduct immediate inspections of the other two Carbon County mines owned by Murray Energy.

"Furthermore, if it takes every dollar this guy has in his bank account, he needs to bring closure to this darn thing. We've got families of six good people who are currently sitting in that mine," Gov. Huntsman said.

Everything now seems dependent on this fifth borehole, which seems to be the last hope of finding anything out about the six men who have been unaccounted for over the last 16 days inside the Crandall Canyon mine. Those answers should all come tomorrow.

</snip>

More here at link: http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148&sid=1672137

There must be an election coming up; the governor is saying things the people want to hear. Easy to say; hard to do. Let's see which way MSHA blows. A lot of business is dependent on coal being dug out of the ground.

 

[PrayersForMaura]

Yes, I'm also sure that holocaust victims who were murdered, cremated or buried in mass pits are resting in peace.

IMO, the disposition of one's earthly remains does not determine whether or not one is at rest.


Just think of all the missing and murdered people among us whose bodies have never been found.


What a horrific idea to think that not only did their killers take their lives but also their eternal rest.

would you feel the same, honestly, if it were your son trapped in there ... alive or not??

 

[cheko1]

Did Murray Energy honestly do everything they could to get to the miners?
They drilled 5 holes in 16 days. Couldn't they of brought in more drills? Sitting thinking about it I have many questions.

They claimed the 4th hole never produced much but they would evaluate the pictures according to Rob Moore & he sounded very optimistic.
Did the pix show proof of a very illegal type of mining?

Or was there totally unsafe mining being deployed?

If they don't want to send a person down in a capsule why not send a K-9 search & rescue unit in?

Honestly the families aren't asking for much. They are very good people, just frustrated & in deep grief. They're asking for 1 big hole...the equipment should of already been in place. In all actuality the big hole should of been in the process of being dug. In case of an accident to the rescuers. The owners of mine were well aware of the bumps. They'd happened many times.

So I ask myself why the change of heart & mind? What really happened between Sat night & Sun?

 

[Buzz Mills]

One big hole will take a month to drill, so why would they drill an escape hole until they know that, the area, where they are going to drill, is where the miners are. Otherwise it doesn't make any sense.

Even if they get lucky, and do find the bodies with this 5th hole; they will still have to be very lucky to get the bodies out, or even find all six of them, as they were likely in different areas at the time; that is unless they were lucky enough to survive the initial seismic event, and gathered together.

 

[cheko1]

Cheko, do you mean the governor's father died in the mines 50 years ago too; I heard the mayor of Price say his father died in the mines 50 years ago; what are the odds. Next thing we know, they will be the same age.

On that Buzz I'm going to concede your right & I am wrong. I knew it was someone speaking at the podium. I knew I should of checked it out before I posted it......just give me 50 whacks with a wet noodle or put me in the :behindbar I am sooooooo wrong/ so sorry for posting wrong information!!!:doh:

 

[Buzz Mills]

np Cheko.

 

[Buzz Mills]

SNIP

If they don't want to send a person down in a capsule why not send a K-9 search & rescue unit in?

Honestly the families aren't asking for much. They are very good people, just frustrated & in deep grief. They're asking for 1 big hole...the equipment should of already been in place. In all actuality the big hole should of been in the process of being dug. In case of an accident to the rescuers. The owners of mine were well aware of the bumps. They'd happened many times.

So I ask myself why the change of heart & mind? What really happened between Sat night & Sun?

Dogs require oxygen too; I don't know that they have oxygen masks for dogs, but even if they did, how would the dog use his/her scenting abilities to find the miners, if his nose was covered with an oxygen mask??

They would have to know in advance where to drill any 30", or 36", escape hole. It will take up to a month, or more, to drill a hole that big, and if it wasn't drilled ALMOST EXACTLY where the miners are, it would be all for naught.