US coal mine collapse traps six-Utah - Thread No. 2

[JanetElaine]

Where do they want to drill it??

It would take a very long time--up to a month to drill that type of hole.

The slightest seismic event could trap the rescue capsule.

Who would be willing to go down in the rescue capsule into a mine where the tunnel is at least partially filled from previous seismic events, and the air quality won't sustain life. The missing miners are in all probability buried; is this person going to dig them out when they have no idea where they are??

I have no idea Buzz. I am just relaying information that I am getting, as I have been doing. Right now I don't know but I will try to find out.

 

[cheko1]

Where do they want to drill it??

It would take a very long time--up to a month to drill that type of hole.

The slightest seismic event could trap the rescue capsule.

Who would be willing to go down in the rescue capsule into a mine where the tunnel is at least partially filled from previous seismic events, and the air quality won't sustain life. The missing miners are in all probability buried; is this person going to dig them out when they have no idea where they are??

I think that any of the trapped miners families who work in the mines would be more then willing to go in. Give them plenty of air tanks & let them try.

If it was my son / hubby etc my family would go get them, they wouldn't flinch!

If they're already talking about going into parts of the mine for coal the family must feel if its safe enough to make money off from / then they want there family member back.

I wouldn't want to put a family member in harms way at any time. They'd just go with there gut & volunteer.

 

[cheko1]

I understand the families wanting the 36" hole dug, but it is futile to dig it until they find where the miners are. They said on the news last night that would take around 2 weeks to dig a hole that large. At the rate of digging the smaller holes (4 of them) the first 36" hole would not have been completed during that time. They are starting on hole #5, and I guess all we can do is hope and pray this is the one where they will find the 6 miners. IF any of them are still alive, they can get water and food to them to sustain them while the 36" hole is dug, and if not, then they can still reach them to retrieve the bodies for the surviving families.

The mine owner and the VP of the mine are very careful when speaking to the public...watching their language to ensure they say "seismic activity" or "seismic event", and they have done this since day one...why? They don't want to be sued! There was no earthquake that started this.

Bob Murray stated many times at the pressers it was an earthquake.

Now they say seismic event.....to COA.

 

[drew]

I think that any of the trapped miners families who work in the mines would be more then willing to go in. Give them plenty of air tanks & let them try.

If it was my son / hubby etc my family would go get them, they wouldn't flinch!

If they're already talking about going into parts of the mine for coal the family must feel if its safe enough to make money off from / then they want there family member back.

I wouldn't want to put a family member in harms way at any time. They'd just go with there gut & volunteer.

cheko1.
Have you ever been anywhere near a coal mine, surface or underground, in the United States?

No one, absolutely no one, is going into that mine that is not approved by MSHA. Certainly not a family member.

"If they're already talking about going into parts of the mine for coal the family must feel if its safe enough to make money off from / then they want there family member back. "

Where did you see or "hear" that they were going to continue mining for coal in that mine?

 

[JanetElaine]

Where did you see or "hear" that they were going to continue mining for coal in that mine?

I actually just heard that on Fox13 (local).

In fact since 9 am this morning people have been in the mine taking equipment out.

 

[drew]

I actually just heard that on Fox13 (local).

Heard from who the media? Someone official?
Just asking
I doubt very much if that mine is opened back up any time soon.

 

[cheko1]

cheko1.
Have you ever been anywhere near a coal mine, surface or underground, in the United States?

No one, absolutely no one, is going into that mine that is not approved by MSHA. Certainly not a family member.

"If they're already talking about going into parts of the mine for coal the family must feel if its safe enough to make money off from / then they want there family member back. "

Where did you see or "hear" that they were going to continue mining for coal in that mine?

First of all they did send family members into the mine many of the rescuers were related to the 6. So why would this be ANY different???

The link was at post #112 on this thread!
Here is the link........its the last paragraph of the article!
It came directly from the owners of the mine!!!


http://kutv.com/topstories/local_story_218103238.html

 

[Earthbound Misfit I]

cheko1,
I do agree that is why the families are fuming! What a terrible thing to hear.

Below is a portion of the article. I am certain this part has the families fuming! This would be very hard for the families to swallow...do you agree or not?

Quote:
If tunneling doesn't restart, part of the mine will have been turned into a tomb. Despite that, Moore said there is recoverable coal in other parts of the 5,000-acre mine, and the company expected to resume operations at some point. He said he didn't discuss that prospect with family members.

 

[cheko1]

Heard from who the media? Someone official?
Just asking
I doubt very much if that mine is opened back up any time soon.

They do plan to continue operations in the mine.

 

[JanetElaine]

Heard from who the media? Someone official?
Just asking
I doubt very much if that mine is opened back up any time soon.

Like I said it was on Fox 13 plus it was confirmed by a miner's wife in Price. Her husband got called in to help take equipment out of the mine as well. The families are fuming. (And so am I).

 

[cheko1]

cheko1,
I do agree that is why the families are fuming! What a terrible thing to hear.

Yes, RKnowley if it were my family member I'd be SCREAMING, at the top of my lungs!

If its safe enough to resume mining its safe enough to get the trapped miners out for closure to the families. They honestly deserve that.

 

[drew]

First of all they did send family members into the mine many of the rescuers were related to the 6. So why would this be ANY different???

The link was at post #112 on this thread!
Here is the link........its the last paragraph of the article!
It came directly from the owners of the mine!!!


http://kutv.com/topstories/local_story_218103238.html

It's different because those family members were MINERS. Certified by MSHA, miners. Completely different then a bunch of family members strapping on an oxygen tank and going into the mine.

 

[drew]

Like I said it was on Fox 13 plus it was confirmed by a miner's wife in Price. Her husband got called in to help take equipment out of the mine as well. The families are fuming. (And so am I).

Taking equipment out of the mine is not that same as starting operations back up to mine the coal.

 

[Earthbound Misfit I]

HUNTINGTON - Robert Murray, the outspoken co-owner of the Crandall Canyon mine, emphasized at every interview and news conference that the needs of the families of the trapped miners came first.

He made sure that the families were briefed on any updates from the various boreholes and rescue attempts before he spoke to the news media crowded at the mine's entrance.

Murray, donning mining coveralls, even took two family members, who are experienced miners, into the mine with him so that they could give detailed bilingual progress reports to the families.

But after Thursday's "mountain bump" that exploded tunnel walls and killed three rescue workers and halted the underground re-entry effort, the irrepressible Murray has not been seen at media briefings.

Company officials explained that Murray was "ministering" to the miners' families or at the mouth of the mine consulting with mining experts on the next strategy to reach the trapped men.

But it turns out Murray also had become a stranger to the trapped miners' families.

"We feel that Bob Murray has abandoned us. Mr. Murray has not been present since the tragic accident Thursday night," said Sonny Olsen, a spokesman for the trapped miners' families - who until Sunday never communicated directly with the media, except through Murray.

More at link: http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_6668016

 

[FlowerChild]

The "mine" covers over 5000 Acres - this occurred in just one section - this mine is HUGE with many tunnels and entrances. It will put hundreds - if not a thousand or more men out of work if they shut down the entire mine. The families of the men who are missing might be screaming now - but there will be a thousand instantly unemployed men's families (and the families of 3000 people who work in supporting businesses) screaming if they close the entire operation permanently.

It is a tragedy - but we don't close entire airlines when a plane of theirs crashes - even the devastated companies in the World Trade Center resumed operations nearby eventually. We don't stop driving cars because people die in them and we don't stop re-building because of a deadly flood or a hurricane or an earthquake. The miner's families will (and should) receive financial compensation - but I don't see why an entire 5000 acre operation needs to be shut down and turned into a memorial because of an ACCIDENT. It would be like turning the entire city of New Orleans into an unoccupied memorial because a hurricane hit it and many people died.

The place where the miners were lost will never be re-opened or mined again - in fact, the entrance is dangerous and unstable - it is basically unusable due to the collapse. There will be an appropriate memorial dedicated to the lost men for the families if they are unable to recover the men. That does NOT mean that the balance of the property should also be closed forever. The miners KNEW the risks and the miners who continue to work that site will be painfully aware of what can and does happen. It is their CHOICE whether to continue working there - I assume they will desire to do so.

In OTHER countries, there would not have been a 2-3 week recovery effort costing millions to begin with. Americans are growing used to heroic and miraculous mine rescues...but those are very MUCH the exception, and not the rule in mining accidents worldwide. The only solution is to eliminate the world's dependence on coal, stop mining all uncut new diamonds and gems, stop using ALL raw metals - from steel to copper to silver to gold and platinum and use recycled metals and gems and stones only. THAT isn't going to happen soon, so mining will continue and men will continue to die - from coal mines in Utah to diamond mines in Africa. Until we are willing to make some HUGE changes, mining is going to continue - and most of it in places much LESS safe and worker friendly than the USA. All shutting down the mine in Utah will do is create unemployment there and send jobs to other countries where safety isn't a concern. ..we just won't HEAR about THOSE accidents or the grieving families. Out of sight - out of mind...

My Opinion

 

[Earthbound Misfit I]

This .pdf shows a diagram (graphic) of the locations of the bore holes that have been drilled.

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/li...0820/20070820_034843_5th borehole graphic.pdf

 

[cheko1]

It's different because those family members were MINERS. Certified by MSHA, miners. Completely different then a bunch of family members strapping on an oxygen tank and going into the mine.

I certainly never meant just ANY family member. Sorry I never clarified it! I meant miners!!!!!

Could you please tell me how the miners get certified by MSHA? What type of schooling do they have to take?

Murray sent his own employees into that mine. Miners that work there everyday. Are they certified by MSHA???? Just wondering....

 

[JanetElaine]

Taking equipment out of the mine is not that same as starting operations back up to mine the coal.

But it does conflict with the mine being closed, nobody being allowed in it etc.. The community there is outraged about this 'equipment rescue'. The mining community.

 

[cheko1]

HUNTINGTON - Robert Murray, the outspoken co-owner of the Crandall Canyon mine, emphasized at every interview and news conference that the needs of the families of the trapped miners came first.

He made sure that the families were briefed on any updates from the various boreholes and rescue attempts before he spoke to the news media crowded at the mine's entrance.

Murray, donning mining coveralls, even took two family members, who are experienced miners, into the mine with him so that they could give detailed bilingual progress reports to the families.

But after Thursday's "mountain bump" that exploded tunnel walls and killed three rescue workers and halted the underground re-entry effort, the irrepressible Murray has not been seen at media briefings.

Company officials explained that Murray was "ministering" to the miners' families or at the mouth of the mine consulting with mining experts on the next strategy to reach the trapped men.

But it turns out Murray also had become a stranger to the trapped miners' families.

"We feel that Bob Murray has abandoned us. Mr. Murray has not been present since the tragic accident Thursday night," said Sonny Olsen, a spokesman for the trapped miners' families - who until Sunday never communicated directly with the media, except through Murray.

More at link: http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_6668016

RKnowley what do you think of the lies that is coming out of the owners of the mine???? They lie then try to cover it / then tell more lies....personally I don't like it! I feel if they lie about something as trivial as administering to the needs of the families what big lies are they going to tell?

Such as below from the link you posted.

Murray Energy Corp. Vice President Rob Moore confirmed that Bob Murray has not visited with the families of the missing six since Thursday. Moore said Murray has been attending to the needs of the three men who died and the six who were injured on Thursday.

 

[cheko1]

But it does conflict with the mine being closed, nobody being allowed in it etc.. The community there is outraged about this 'equipment rescue'. The mining community.

Yes it does conflict with the mine being closed........
The families are meeting now with the mining reps, according to MSNBC the presser is delayed for that reason.

Its all about the almighty dollar, heaven help the fact if the equipment got damaged. :slap: