US threatens to annex Greenland - 2025/2026

[Gators North]

Can NATO just remove the U.S. as a member and continue to exist? Sorry if this has been addressed already.

 

[otto]

Can NATO just remove the U.S. as a member and continue to exist? Sorry if this has been addressed already.

The 14 articles are here. A few of the Articles address a country choosing to leave, but nothing about forcing a country to withdraw from NATO. My guess is that it's all or nothing. If the US violates the foundation of the agreement, the agreement is broken and NATO is gone.

The US violated Article 1 today by US imposing tariffs on NATO countries until one NATO country cedes territory to another NATO country.

Article 1​

The Parties undertake, as set forth in the Charter of the United Nations, to settle any international dispute in which they may be involved by peaceful means in such a manner that international peace and security and justice are not endangered, and to refrain in their international relations from the threat or use of force in any manner inconsistent with the purposes of the United Nations.

 

[Cryptic]

Can NATO just remove the U.S. as a member and continue to exist? Sorry if this has been addressed already.

Yes.

A potential NATO member must apply to join and one of the stipulations for membership is that members cannot be involved in any territorial disputes- with anyone, let alone another NATO country.

This provision was followed even during a small dispute between Slovenia and Croatia regarding use of a bay of off the Adriatic and whether the true border was the former natural course of a river- or a modern canal that had straightened it. And, who owned a historic castle (was it truly on a ridge line). I can't remember how they settled the dispute about canal- but they agreed to share the bay to some extent.

So.... my guess is that the US could be booted tomorrow for pursuing a territorial dispute with two entities (Denmark and Greenland). But.... the super sized US is a big component of NATO. My guess is that the US would get suspended from NATO, but not permanently booted.

 

[Ruminations]

Well, then they don't understand tariffs either.

It doesn't take much to educate yourself; I didn't know what they were before all this mess, either, as I never studied politics or economics. It took me all of an afternoon with Wikipedia and various news sources. And if I can understand it, with a learning disability that directly impacts my ability to do maths above a fourth grade level, the vast majority of people can learn to understand it, too.

MOO

I agree. People can understand if they want to. They would rather just join a side that lets them feel aggrieved and angry and superior, and will suspend all thinking to keep feeling aggrieved and angry and superior.

It feels so good to feel put first, "America first" and to think the other countries are the bad guys who got all the breaks before, that it would be a huge disappointment to learn that tariffs are just a way to make everything cost more for Americans.

(BTW, I am for tariffs that financially correct for things like: countries using slaves or impoverished workers, countries not abiding by anti-pollution measures. It's not fair to expect my country's manufacturers to compete with others with even more lax labor and environmental laws.)

In any case, tariffs should never be a war weapon. USA has no business saying, in effect, "Gimmee Greenland or I'm gonna make your products too expensive for my people to buy!"

MOO

 

[otto]

I cannot find any information about NATO having a formal process to expel members.

 

[Gators North]

I cannot find any information about NATO having a formal process to expel members.

Thanks for checking.

 

[otto]

I'm curious why the US government states that Greenland belongs to the United States.

"Stephen Miller, a top aide to President Trump, asserted on Monday that Greenland rightfully belonged to the United States and that the Trump administration could seize the semiautonomous Danish territory if it wanted.

“Nobody’s going to fight the United States militarily over the future of Greenland.”

The remarks were part of a vocal push by Mr. Miller, long a powerful behind-the-scenes player in Trump administration policy, to justify American imperialism and a vision for a new world order in which the United States could freely overthrow national governments and take foreign territory and resources so long as it was in the national interest.
...

The United States’ taking Greenland by force would rip apart the central agreement that underpins the NATO military alliance, of which Denmark and the United States are both founding members. Under that treaty, an attack on any member is treated as an attack on all members. Mr. Trump has previously said he would not rule out using the military to take Greenland."​

Stephen Miller Asserts U.S. Has Right to Take Greenland

In a CNN interview, the Trump aide also echoed the president’s intent to run Venezuela as he laid out a case for the United States to control weaker states by flexing its military might.

www.nytimes.com

“The international community as we know it; democratic rules of the game; NATO, the world’s strongest defensive alliance — all of that would collapse if one NATO country chose to attack another”​

What to Know About Trump’s Desire to Take Over Greenland

President Trump keeps saying he wants to take the semiautonomous Danish territory, citing U.S. national security. Denmark’s leader says an American attack would be the end of NATO.

www.nytimes.com

 

[Snoopster]

President Truman and Dwight Eisenhower must be turning over in their graves. NATO was formed to bring together democratic allies to keep the world safe from the threat of aggressor nations, like USSR. Now the US admin is spitting in the face of their allies. What's the purpose of this? Wouldn't the world be safer if democratic nations worked together?
Apparently the US has decided to bully others into meeting their demands to take over another nation. (goodbye democracy!) I thought the US believed in sovereignty. It seems that they have turned into an aggressor nation. IMO.
Let's work together! Let's keep focusing on making the world a better place for humanity. Most progressive nations want this goal.

 

[Andreee]

Can NATO just remove the U.S. as a member and continue to exist? Sorry if this has been addressed already.

That's a good question that I guess legal channels would have to deal with. Obviously, the alliance would be broken but could it continue? Not sure. If it wasn't for Trump, we wouldn't have to be dealing with this. IMO he won't last the 4 yr term due to his self serving narcisissm, failing thought processes, old age, insatiable need for power and immense ego, to name a few things lol. I can't imagine Americans and the rest of the world enduring all this turmoil for several more years!

 

[SouthAussie]

I'm curious why the US government states that Greenland belongs to the United States.

"Stephen Miller, a top aide to President Trump, asserted on Monday that Greenland rightfully belonged to the United States and that the Trump administration could seize the semiautonomous Danish territory if it wanted.​

​

Because Miller has invented a pretend new "law". One that seems to say that if he feels that a country cannot adequately defend itself, it's up for grabs. imo


Miller presented a new law to defend the U.S.’ aggressive campaign to acquire Greenland, a semiautonomous territory of Denmark, during an appearance on Hannity on Friday night.

He claimed that, under “the law,” nations were not entitled to their territory if they were unable to defend it. The Trump aide belittled the Danish government, saying its “tiny” military was inadequately protecting Greenland.
"...Under every understanding of law that has existed about territorial control for 500 years, to control a territory you have to be able to defend a territory, improve territory, inhabit a territory. Denmark has failed on every single one of these tests.”

Stephen Miller Invents New Law to Justify Trump’s Obsession

White House Deputy Chief of Staff Stephen Miller gave a new defense for Donald Trump’s Greenland power grab. Miller presented a new law to defend the U.S.’ aggressive campaign to acquire Greenland, a semiautonomous territory of Denmark, during an appearance on Hannity on Friday night. He claimed...

www.yahoo.com

 

[Andreee]

Because Miller has invented a pretend new "law". One that seems to say that if he feels that a country cannot adequately defend itself, it's up for grabs. imo


Miller presented a new law to defend the U.S.’ aggressive campaign to acquire Greenland, a semiautonomous territory of Denmark, during an appearance on Hannity on Friday night.

He claimed that, under “the law,” nations were not entitled to their territory if they were unable to defend it. The Trump aide belittled the Danish government, saying its “tiny” military was inadequately protecting Greenland.
"...Under every understanding of law that has existed about territorial control for 500 years, to control a territory you have to be able to defend a territory, improve territory, inhabit a territory. Denmark has failed on every single one of these tests.”

Stephen Miller Invents New Law to Justify Trump’s Obsession

White House Deputy Chief of Staff Stephen Miller gave a new defense for Donald Trump’s Greenland power grab. Miller presented a new law to defend the U.S.’ aggressive campaign to acquire Greenland, a semiautonomous territory of Denmark, during an appearance on Hannity on Friday night. He claimed...

www.yahoo.com

What utter nonsense!

 

[Hexe]

But.... the super sized US is a big component of NATO.

This component became actively harmful.

 

[Hexe]

"...Under every understanding of law that has existed about territorial control for 500 years, to control a territory you have to be able to defend a territory, improve territory, inhabit a territory. Denmark has failed on every single one of these tests.”

So he decided to double down on insults. Well... Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall, Mr Miller.

 

[Sarahlou]

• Trump's tariff threats over Greenland "risk a dangerous downward spiral", Nato members say in a joint statement
• The leaders of Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, the Netherlands, Norway, Sweden and the UK add that they stand firmly behind "the principles of sovereignty and territorial integrity"
• The US president yesterday announced plans to impose a 10% tariff on goods from those eight countries from 1 February
• Meanwhile, thousands have been protesting against Trump's plans in Greenland and Denmark

BBC News - Trump tariffs threat over Greenland 'risk dangerous downward spiral', warn Nato members - follow live
Trump tariffs threat over Greenland 'risk dangerous downward spiral', warn Nato members - follow live - BBC News

 

[Ruminations]

Because Miller has invented a pretend new "law". One that seems to say that if he feels that a country cannot adequately defend itself, it's up for grabs. imo


Miller presented a new law to defend the U.S.’ aggressive campaign to acquire Greenland, a semiautonomous territory of Denmark, during an appearance on Hannity on Friday night.

He claimed that, under “the law,” nations were not entitled to their territory if they were unable to defend it. The Trump aide belittled the Danish government, saying its “tiny” military was inadequately protecting Greenland.
"...Under every understanding of law that has existed about territorial control for 500 years, to control a territory you have to be able to defend a territory, improve territory, inhabit a territory. Denmark has failed on every single one of these tests.”

Stephen Miller Invents New Law to Justify Trump’s Obsession

White House Deputy Chief of Staff Stephen Miller gave a new defense for Donald Trump’s Greenland power grab. Miller presented a new law to defend the U.S.’ aggressive campaign to acquire Greenland, a semiautonomous territory of Denmark, during an appearance on Hannity on Friday night. He claimed...

www.yahoo.com

And the sad thing is, it would be a slam dunk that it could be adequately protected, if the US were acting like they were still part of NATO.

I still believe that the rest of NATO will not abide by the US hostilities in NATO territory. I hope this is not just wishful thinking on my part. I believe UK will align more forcefully with the continent now, brexit will become a historical word, and the US is going to finally realize that it is weak when it's cosplaying strong and doing a 1930's Germany, and strong when it works globally with democratic allies. I think a hostile action in Greenland might be our FAFO moment.

MOO

 

[Ruminations]

"The situation has now become so legitimate that soldiers on the ground have reportedly been told to essentially “shoot first and ask questions later.”

Denmark, which retains control of Greenland’s defence and foreign policy, has a rule for moments when there is no time to think. Written in 1952 at the height of Cold War anxiety, it instructs Danish forces that if the country is attacked, they must respond immediately — without waiting for orders, even if political leaders are unaware a war has begun.

The Danish defence ministry confirmed this week that the rule remains in force."

https://www.news.com.au/world/north-america/us-politics/shoot-firsttrump-greenland-threat-triggers-nato-crisis-and-europe-panic/news-story/3dbfc39f561afcc940e90af396c90bec

Smart. The US seems reluctant to actually declare war, although war crimes are becoming common.

There has never been a war declared on Venezuela, yet the ultimate war act of capturing its president has been accomplished militarily.

The Danish are right.

MOO

 

[Ruminations]

Up to $5.6bn for control of Greenland and its (potential) trillions of dollars of untapped resources?
(56,000 people @ $100,000 each)


"U.S. officials have discussed sending lump sum payments to Greenlanders as part of a bid to convince them to secede from Denmark and potentially join the United States, according to four sources familiar with the matter.

While the exact dollar figure and logistics of any payment are unclear, U.S. officials, including White House aides, have discussed figures ranging from $10,000 to $100,000 per person, said two of the sources, who requested anonymity to discuss internal deliberations."

Exclusive: Trump administration mulls payments to sway Greenlanders to join US

U.S. officials have discussed sending lump sum payments to Greenlanders as part of a bid to convince them to secede from Denmark and potentially join the United States, according to four sources familiar with the matter.

www.reuters.com

I think I've been promised a few payments here in the US-haven't seen one of them. For example, I was supposed to get a check for 2000.00 from the treasury for all the money it's supposedly collecting in tariffs.

So, Greenlanders, I speak from experience. Don't hold your breath. This administration does not keep its promises.

MOO

 

[Ruminations]

RSBM

Why is it up to the EU to stop Americans from doing exactly as they please? Why are they supposed to fight and die in a war they cannot win, in order to gain nothing?

Is democracy nothing? Are civil rights nothing?

MOO

 

[otto]

Because Miller has invented a pretend new "law". One that seems to say that if he feels that a country cannot adequately defend itself, it's up for grabs. imo


Miller presented a new law to defend the U.S.’ aggressive campaign to acquire Greenland, a semiautonomous territory of Denmark, during an appearance on Hannity on Friday night.

He claimed that, under “the law,” nations were not entitled to their territory if they were unable to defend it. The Trump aide belittled the Danish government, saying its “tiny” military was inadequately protecting Greenland.
"...Under every understanding of law that has existed about territorial control for 500 years, to control a territory you have to be able to defend a territory, improve territory, inhabit a territory. Denmark has failed on every single one of these tests.”

Stephen Miller Invents New Law to Justify Trump’s Obsession

White House Deputy Chief of Staff Stephen Miller gave a new defense for Donald Trump’s Greenland power grab. Miller presented a new law to defend the U.S.’ aggressive campaign to acquire Greenland, a semiautonomous territory of Denmark, during an appearance on Hannity on Friday night. He claimed...

www.yahoo.com

A new law that says the country with the strongest military owns all countries with a weaker military?

During war, that may be temporarily true. The Netherlands was occupied by Napoleon and Hitler because France and Germany at those times had a strong aggressive military, but today the Netherlands is a sovereign country. That is the counter-example to Miller's ill-conceived law.

 

[otto]

• Trump's tariff threats over Greenland "risk a dangerous downward spiral", Nato members say in a joint statement
• The leaders of Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, the Netherlands, Norway, Sweden and the UK add that they stand firmly behind "the principles of sovereignty and territorial integrity"
• The US president yesterday announced plans to impose a 10% tariff on goods from those eight countries from 1 February
• Meanwhile, thousands have been protesting against Trump's plans in Greenland and Denmark

BBC News - Trump tariffs threat over Greenland 'risk dangerous downward spiral', warn Nato members - follow live
Trump tariffs threat over Greenland 'risk dangerous downward spiral', warn Nato members - follow live - BBC News

Once again, we see that the US government decision to impose new tariffs on 8 European countries makes no sense.

Tariffs on 8 countries within a single European economic zone is like saying there will be tariffs on 8 states in the single country of United States, or tariffs on one province in Canada. How does the US expect that to work? It doesn't work, and doesn't make sense.

"There are immediate questions about how the White House could try to implement the tariffs because the European Union is a single economic zone in terms of trading, according to a European diplomat who was not authorized to comment publicly and spoke on the condition of anonymity."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/eight-countries-react-trump-tariff-threat-greenland-9.7050373