Found Deceased WI - Kathleen Ryan, adult, teacher, car found burned with body inside, St. Francis, 2 Feb 2019

[Rosiebones]

Suicide is the last possibility to me. She is Catholic and has been brought up Catholic and that is more than frowned on. Besides she was in the passenger side of the car. How would she take something to pass out and still be able to start the fire with an accelerant. Plus, she loved her family and was on the way to see them. This makes no sense.

Random car jacking. Although LE is still checking, there is no record of her stopping anywhere. Car jackers want the car or money, the one thing they don't want is a passenger. Yet, there she was in the passenger seat. Her accounts were not accessed and the car was in the driveway. I don't see the car jacking angle.

In the nine hours between leaving home and the car being found, she was somewhere and most likely with someone. LE may know or have a good idea of who and where and why but just cannot prove it beyond a reasonable doubt. To me, this looks like a hired hit, because of the total lack of any clues. A professional job. The questions I have are where was she for the hours before she was found and WHY.

 

[nyonge]

Studies have suggested that those with religious affiliations are somewhat less likely to attempt suicide, but they don't really differentiate between Catholic and non-Catholic in terms of which attempt it less frequently.

Also, in terms of her family dynamic, we know only what the papers tell us.

 

[Joe Friday]

Suicide is the last possibility to me. She is Catholic and has been brought up Catholic and that is more than frowned on. Besides she was in the passenger side of the car. How would she take something to pass out and still be able to start the fire with an accelerant. Plus, she loved her family and was on the way to see them. This makes no sense.

Random car jacking. Although LE is still checking, there is no record of her stopping anywhere. Car jackers want the car or money, the one thing they don't want is a passenger. Yet, there she was in the passenger seat. Her accounts were not accessed and the car was in the driveway. I don't see the car jacking angle.

In the nine hours between leaving home and the car being found, she was somewhere and most likely with someone. LE may know or have a good idea of who and where and why but just cannot prove it beyond a reasonable doubt. To me, this looks like a hired hit, because of the total lack of any clues. A professional job. The questions I have are where was she for the hours before she was found and WHY.

BBM

Where was it reported that an accelerate was used?

As I posted early on in this thread, she may have pulled over, lite one or more candles in the car, taken some pills to make herself unconcsense, when the candles burned down the car started on fire.

The car could have been parked in the driveway for hours with a candle burning inside. That could explain the lapse in time from when Kathleen should have arrived at the game and when the car was reported on fire.

JMO

 

[Kittybunny]

Hi all, what a sad and horrifying case! I just spend some time reading the whole thread here and can't believe that LE has pretty much said they have no tips, no evidence, nothing! I remind myself that absence of evidence does NOT mean evidence of absence - meaning just because they said they haven't found any outright evidence that this was homicide doesn't mean it wasn't. Now, to me that leads me to lean way more towards either a known POI OR, as unlikely as it seems, self-harm, with the first being about 95% and the latter only at about 5%. Here's what leads me in that direction:

1. No evidence or indication of the following: Kathleen stopping anywhere along the way, no tips of anyone suspicious with her, no presumed debit or credit card activity, no surveillance from a gas station or anywhere where a random person could have followed her from. I believe that at this point they would have indications if this had been a carjacking gone wrong or outright robbery/murder.

2. The complete and utter silence regarding and from her (ex?) husband. 'Nuff said. One scenario here would be he followed her, called her on her cell phone, told her she forgot something or needed to talk to her OR she met him somewhere and he offered to drive her or did harm to her in advance, he drove her car and then either found another way home or had an accomplice pick him up.

3. Self-harm is still possible as far-fetched as it seems. The Cheryl DeBoer case, my personal experience with a friend's suicide, and other cases here on WS have led me to believe that you never ever know what is going on with someone internally, they rarely leave notes, and the circumstances can be very odd indeed.

The biggest mystery to me and almost only thing pointing towards a random attack is the randomness of the location - if it was self-harm, why would she choose that location? If someone close/known to her did it, why choose that location when a more secluded one would delay discovery? Connections to that location or near that location for anyone known to her are very much worth investigating.

I would like to think LE knows a lot more than they are revealing but....I'm not that hopeful. Hopefully they at least have enough probable cause to get search warrants of her cell, cards, computers, as well as those of her close family and friends. And that they have reviewed surveillance videos, etc. of the key locations.

 

[Quiet Time]

IMO...if she did harm herself, which I can't see happening...why oh why would you burn yourself to death?
Seems rather drastic, and painful.

Idk what happened, but there are some good theories I've been reading.

 

[nyonge]

Again -- I wasn't expecting to consider suicide as the cause of Ryan's death until I read the officer's words:
"There is nothing that has brought us to any conclusion that somebody did this to Kathleen. We don't have any evidence somebody caused this to happen to Kathleen."
But, having read them, I read back through the thread and yes, vehicle suicides do occur. Various posts provide links. Then I googled "car fire suicide," then "vehicle fire suicide," and finally "truck fire suicide." It is always surprising to find evidence of a phenomenon you'd doubted could occur, but does. Also, we have to consider that many times, because of the stigma attached to the act, suicides sometimes are not reported in media. This can only mean there are more vehicle fire suicides than those we read or hear about. So if this was a suicide, the method was shocking but not really surprising.

 

[Rosiebones]

I don't believe it was a suicide. But, if it was, why was she in the passenger side? And if, as suggested up thread, she sat there with candles burning ( no accelerate used) where would those candles have to be placed to burn the car from inside the passenger area? I understand if something under the hood shorted out or sparked near the fuel line, but to simple light a candle and have it burn down and then start a fire that incinerated her and the car doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

 

[Curiousobserver]

BBM

Where was it reported that an accelerate was used?

As I posted early on in this thread, she may have pulled over, lite one or more candles in the car, taken some pills to make herself unconcsense, when the candles burned down the car started on fire.

The car could have been parked in the driveway for hours with a candle burning inside. That could explain the lapse in time from when Kathleen should have arrived at the game and when the car was reported on fire.

JMO

The fire may have been accidental after the suicide. She took the pills and decided to have one last cigarette. She falls asleep and it slips out of her hand and onto the seat. This would explain the 9 hours. It can take hours for the smoldering seat to ignite.

What doesn't make sense to me is why she was on the passenger side of the car (and I stated before the circumstances of suicide never makes sense to outsiders). It would be interesting to know if the ignition was in the "on" position and if any key was found.

 

[PayrollNerd]

Hi all, what a sad and horrifying case! I just spend some time reading the whole thread here and can't believe that LE has pretty much said they have no tips, no evidence, nothing! I remind myself that absence of evidence does NOT mean evidence of absence - meaning just because they said they haven't found any outright evidence that this was homicide doesn't mean it wasn't. Now, to me that leads me to lean way more towards either a known POI OR, as unlikely as it seems, self-harm, with the first being about 95% and the latter only at about 5%. Here's what leads me in that direction:

1. No evidence or indication of the following: Kathleen stopping anywhere along the way, no tips of anyone suspicious with her, no presumed debit or credit card activity, no surveillance from a gas station or anywhere where a random person could have followed her from. I believe that at this point they would have indications if this had been a carjacking gone wrong or outright robbery/murder.

2. The complete and utter silence regarding and from her (ex?) husband. 'Nuff said. One scenario here would be he followed her, called her on her cell phone, told her she forgot something or needed to talk to her OR she met him somewhere and he offered to drive her or did harm to her in advance, he drove her car and then either found another way home or had an accomplice pick him up.

3. Self-harm is still possible as far-fetched as it seems. The Cheryl DeBoer case, my personal experience with a friend's suicide, and other cases here on WS have led me to believe that you never ever know what is going on with someone internally, they rarely leave notes, and the circumstances can be very odd indeed.

The biggest mystery to me and almost only thing pointing towards a random attack is the randomness of the location - if it was self-harm, why would she choose that location? If someone close/known to her did it, why choose that location when a more secluded one would delay discovery? Connections to that location or near that location for anyone known to her are very much worth investigating.

I would like to think LE knows a lot more than they are revealing but....I'm not that hopeful. Hopefully they at least have enough probable cause to get search warrants of her cell, cards, computers, as well as those of her close family and friends. And that they have reviewed surveillance videos, etc. of the key locations.

Option 2 or some form thereof, possibly held against her will prior to the fire....

 

[❤️61]

Could there have been a medical condition that Kathleen had, a heart attack, diabetic reaction, panic attack, where she decided to pull in somewhere and rest and calm herself and have a cigarette? She went to the passenger side (with no steering wheel to be in the way) and try to relax with her feet up on the driver's chair and smoked some cigarettes to calm down. Sadly, she may have passed out and the cigarette ignited the car. Prior to the fire, perhaps her cell phone was not charged properly and she was unable to let anyone know she'd be late and didn't think it was serious enough to call 911. This is just my opinion.

 

[OhThatVictoria]

All these theories are interesting but how do we explain her disappearance for approximately 10 hours and the fact she was off her driving route?

 

[kay74]

I has an eye opener today!! Kathleen was known to bring snacks for their game. Today I shopped at Walmart and loaded my items, left my car door unlocked and walked to put the cart away. They guy sitting in his car next to me, looked scary. If he had gotten out with a gun under his jacket and ordered me to get in my passenger seat, I probably would have done it. There probably is a Walmart on her route. This might have been what happened. LE check Walmart cameras!

 

[kay74]

Dollar Tree and Targets too. There must be numerous stores on her route. They all have cameras.

 

[cluciano63]

Police would know who she spoke to, who tried calling her and even more interesting, who did not, when she failed to arrive at game or return home.

So far, it sounds like nothing suspicious was found in her communications, which would be among first things checked. Also, alibis of everyone close to her. Assuming no video evidence turns up...this may be as much as we ever know. Jmo

 

[OhThatVictoria]

Kathleen was a cancer survivor who loved and enjoyed her work and most of all, her kids and Grandkids. I always thought that being a cancer “survivor” would gives one a new lease on life, hardly the attitude to take your life.

There is something we don’t know. Something major. It either involves a new medical issue, some sort of vice she may have had or someone with an “issue”. Suicide seems a stretch.

Edit to add: She had a birthday coming, I believe it was within a week (or so) of her death. Did she perhaps have a birthday lunch with someone scheduled?

 

[nyonge]

The idea that if someone survives something, that things are then, and forevermore, new-lease-on-life rosy, fails to take into account that life keeps right on coming, and its challenges in fact increase. After all, our ultimate destiny does not change, no matter that we have delayed it for a time.

 

[OhThatVictoria]

The idea that if someone survives something, that things are then, and forevermore, new-lease-on-life rosy, fails to take into account that life keeps right on coming, and its challenges in fact increase. After all, our ultimate destiny does not change, no matter that we have delayed it for a time.

Can you please explain by what you mean by: “After all, our ultimate destiny does not change, no matter that we have delayed it for a time.”

 

[nyonge]

Can you please explain by what you mean by: “After all, our ultimate destiny does not change, no matter that we have delayed it for a time.”

In the end we die.

 

[cluciano63]

I have no idea if this was a suicide, if so it was a bizarre method though not unheard of, as we have seen by several examples posted. But I do know that a person’s state of mind is known only to that person. No matter what one projects to the world, their inner life may be just the opposite. There have been some shocking but definite suicides over the years at WS...people that loved ones could not imagine under any circumstances. Yet they happened.
Jmo

 

[Rosiebones]

I know the neighbor saw her leave the house at 12 to 12:30. Perhaps she picked up her snacks locally and returned home and left later for the trip and the neighbor did not see her. Was there any other corroboration of the fact she left at 12to 12:30?