WI - Madison, school shooting at Abundant Life Christian School 16 Dec 2024

[Trino]

<Modsnip: quoted post was removed> Her father's comment about her at gun range: "We joined NBSC (North Bristol Sportsman's Club - gun club) this spring and have been loving all every second of it!"

Most likely, her father has rearranged his thinking..

 

[Seattle1]

Officials said the father allowed them entry with consent. So, why did police blast the door down? Break into a window?

Reportedly, a SWAT team was taking the lead. Generally, in cases like this, it has nothing to do with the parents but concern that the teen could have booby trapped the home. We saw the same following the shooting of Trump after Thomas Crooks identified as the shooter.

 

[al66pine]

Safe Storage Law or Child Access Prevention Law?
From WISC. law below, seems there's no criminal liability for leaving or storing a loaded firearm within the reach or easy access of a 16 YEAR OLD person, at least not under that section.

I don't think LE has yet located how shooter got the gun. Altho maybe statistically/logically likely imo, it came from parents/ parents' house, but neither is necessarily the source. After all, Samantha spent time at NBSC, may have filched one there or from friend's house. IDK.

WISC. STATUTE re Secure Storage or Child Access Prevention:
"948.55 Leaving or storing a loaded firearm within the reach or easy access of a child.
(1) In this section, “child” means a person who has not attained the age of 14 years.
(2) Whoever recklessly stores or leaves a loaded firearm within the reach or easy access of a child is guilty of a Class A misdemeanor if all of the following occur:
(a) A child obtains the firearm without the lawful permission of his or her parent or guardian or the person having charge of the child.
(b) The child under par. (a) discharges the firearm and the discharge causes bodily harm or death to himself, herself or another."

Wisconsin Legislature: 948.55

docs.legis.wisconsin.gov

Link also lists DEFENSES.

Wiki summary of ^ WI. law:
"Leaving a firearm within reach of a child under 14 is generally a misdemeanor if that child points it at anyone, harms anyone, or shows it to anyone in a public place. Defenses include having the gun locked in a gun safe or container, having it holstered on their person, having a trigger lock on the gun, removal of a key operating part, illegal entry by anyone to obtain the firearm, or a reasonable belief a juvenile could not access the firearm. WI statute 948.55[37]"


BTW, cases against Crumbley's parents were in MICH., where their son was 15 YEARS OLD in the 2021 school shooting deaths & injuries. Did MI have a safe storage/ child access prevention statute in place at that time? ETA: I did not search, not terribly relevant to m
this discussion.

Oxford High School shooting - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Trino]

Firearms Experience. Handgun, Long Gun, or Both?

@MassGuy Thx for your post & link,* w image from (alleged shooter's) Father's FB page referring to "NBSC."

Father posted "he and his daughter joined a local gun club in the spring and 'we have been loving all every second of it!'"

The outdoor pic on FB, imo appears to be Samantha at NBSC's trap shooting location w clay target in the air, when compared w pix on NBSC website,** but I could be wrong.

In pic, was Samantha holding a long gun? Seems likely imo, but I can't really tell. AFAIK, handguns like the 9mm used in this school shooting, are not used in trapshooting or skeet shooting. Again, AFAIK.

School shooting was w 9mm handgun.
Would entry level clay-target w long gun SKILLS TRANSFER to fairly close-range handgun competence?

Of course, Samantha may have also gained handgun experience at NBSC or elsewhere.

__________________________
*Dad of Wisconsin Christian school shooter's chilling Facebook post

** North Bristol Sportsmans' Club

Home | North Bristol Sportsman's Club

www.northbristolsportsmansclub.com

"....Trapshooting is a specific form of clay target shooting. It is a game of concentration, movement, action, and timing that requires the accuracy and skill to repeatedly aim, fire, and break a clay target...."

Trap | North Bristol Sportsman's Club

www.northbristolsportsmansclub.com

"If you are looking for a location to shoot your handgun and perfect your skills, our 50 meter 8 station range is for you....
Members that have not completed the First Shots Program must also have a Range Safety Officer (RSO) present on site when shooting on the pistol range. The Safety Orientation is conducted once per month by the Pistol Range Safety Committee and is for Members only."

Handgun | North Bristol Sportsman's Club

www.northbristolsportsmansclub.com

Seems the NBSC helped train her well.

 

[Sundog]

Seems the NBSC helped train her well.

Training for use of a firearm, but not for murder.

 

[Trino]

Training for use of a firearm, but not for murder.

But how do you know? I don't think these parents expected this outcome. And, kids change. What happens if a kid is trained at say age 15 but by age 17 has problems?

 

[MassGuy]

Natalie ‘Samantha’ Rupnow’s motive remains elusive in fatal Abundant Life Christian School shooting

Madison Police Chief Shon Barnes said Monday’s shooting at a Christian school in Wisconsin was the result of “a combination of factors,” but did not divulge additional information…

nypost.com

-“There are always signs of a school shooting before it occurs,” the police chief said.

“We’re looking into her online activity,” he said of Rupnow. “We’re asking for anyone who knew her or may have insight into her feelings leading up to yesterday’’ to come forward.

“On the question of bullying, we’re talking to students to understand whether bullying was one of those multiple factors that I mentioned earlier,” he said.

Barnes said the department is still working to determine the authenticity of a “manifesto” widely circulating online that’s been attributed to the shooter.

 

[Cryptic]

Her father's comment about her at gun range: "We joined NBSC (North Bristol Sportsman's Club - gun club) this spring and have been loving all every second of it!"

Most likely, her father has rearranged his thinking..

There might be criminal charges coming against him if he knew the daughter had problems- but still hyped the gun range experience.

As other posters have implied, prosecutors are getting real tired of the: I"ll introduce my troubled son / daughter to weapons to develop a sense of personal responsibility. Then.... I"ll be "shocked" if something goes wrong." approach.

 

[Sillybilly]

Hey everyone, please remember that this discussion is not about gun control or gun culture in general. Discussion about gun control is not allowed at Websleuths.

 

[Cryptic]

Training for use of a firearm, but not for murder.

I agree. But.... that probably wont save the parents from being prosecuted if they knew the daughter had behavior problems- and still sought out firearms training for the daughter.

 

[Cryptic]

I don't handle guns, so no, but again, we can't blame her like of a band for a school shooting. She appears to have had an agenda, yes, but how does KMFDM play into that?

It depends on the totality. By itself, it means nothing. But as part of a totality, it could mean something very different. For example, a person:

- Likes reading about the military accomplishments of WWII German Panzer Generals-Rommel and others (Yawn).

- Buys a T-shirt featuring a German Tiger tank- the ultimate WWII tank. (So what, no big deal).

- There is a dark side. Tiger Tanks were only given to Waffen SS units. So, the T-shirt also features a historical Waffen SS unit insignia. But Waffen SS were not Death Camp SS. (He could just really like history- right?)

- Now, the guy is selecting the historically accurate Tiger Tank T-shirt to wear to a shooting range?

That totality might be quickly building towards something other than just a love of history. It might not take many more big links in the chain to draw a conclusion about what the choice of T-shirt really means.

 

[Seattle1]

The photo on Dad's fb at "NBSC" being referenced here is his daughter engaging in skeet shooting, an Olympic Sport. Skeet shooting is a competitive sport where shooters use shotguns to break clay targets that simulate flying birds.

I'm from UK and there are similar clubs all over England going back more than 125 years where its members participate in both the Commonwealth Games and the Olympics.

In UK, while the recommended minimum age is about 12 -- it depends more on the build of the individual. The Madison, WI shooting is is a horrific tragedy but I'm not following the vitriol against "NBSC" and its members-- including the father. MOO

National Clay Shooting Center (NCSC):

Skeet & Trap Clay Shooting at NCSC Bisley

World Class Skeet & Trap shooting at the National Clay Shooting Centre Bisley, Surrey

www.ncscbisley.co.uk

ETA: add MSM image/quote

Jeff Rupnow posted the snap to his public Facebook page in August, showing his daughter pointing a shotgun at a clay pigeon while wearing a black top emblazoned with the name of the band KMFDM.

Daily Mail Photo Credit

 

[mickey2942]

It is so sad to me, that we are teaching five year old children how to respond in case of active shooters in school.

My heart goes out to the victims and their families. So difficult this time of year. Their "anniversary" will always remind them of Christmas.

 

[LAborn]

I can agree with this and should have said the safest way possible - nothing is 100% anymore - imo - especially when one is just one Google or YouTube search away from being able to break into even a gun lock or gun safe (not that there is any proof at this time that this is what happened in this case OR that there is such videos)

Then take the gun wherever you go if you believe the safe can be foiled. Or don't own a gun. I don't accept any excuses. NONE.

 

[Cryptic]

I'm from UK and there are similar clubs all over England going back more than 125 years where its members participate in both the Commonwealth Games and the Olympics.

Point well taken. The US range in question, however, also features pistol and rifle training. As a result, she and her father may of had other interests besides just trap and skeet (great past times).

 

[Cryptic]

I don't think that just because a parent gifts their teenager a gun (as long as its kept stored safely and can only be used and/or removed from the gun cabinet by the parent and while the parent is around to supervise) or takes their teen to shooting ranges or hunting that it constitutes negligence. IMO.

I agree. I have done all three regarding my teenager. (gifted him hunting weapons, hunting, trips to shooting ranges.) Guns are stored in a gun safe etc.

But.... deciding to gift weapons, facilitate an interest in hunting, taking him to shooting ranges etc after being informed about, or personally observing troubling behavior, is something totally different.

 

[airportwoman]

There's way too much money behind the NRA. In other words, possibly never. It would take a miracle to change anything.

Not any more. The organization is in rapid decline, and has been for quite some time.

I also heard that the 911 call was made by a second-grade teacher, NOT a second-grader.

Unfortunately, I also saw a story about a third-grade class who armed themselves with scissors. That's got to leave invisible scars on those kids, even if they didn't overtly see anything.

 

[airportwoman]

Second grade student reported shooting.

Don't know if you addressed this, but the 911 call was made by a second-grade TEACHER, which was bad enough.

 

[airportwoman]

It's possible the gun was properly stored in a gun safe and she found the key.

Don't most gun safes have combination locks?

 

[swanniee11]

Don't most gun safes have combination locks?

some have keys