AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #12

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katydid23 said:
But if he tried to move/crawl out of the house, how did he end up on his back, with his feet pointing towards the open door?

And what about the bullet holes going through the door? LE says that he was probably shot through the door. It seems that would be something they could tell with forensics.
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Do we know for a fact about bullet holes through the door? I think I may have missed that (not being snarky, being serious)
 
BRRI said:
As far as I know, we still don’t know if LE or a perp or a victim kicked in the door, correct? We also don’t know if it was shot through? The police log didn’t seem to completely clarify those issues, nor has LE since? I think we may be getting too wrapped up in that. LE could have needed to bust the door in
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If LE busted the door in, it would likely have been stated in the log.

You don’t kick a door in as a member of LE, and not make that clear.

We don’t know for sure if that door had bullet damage, and that goes along with lots of unknowns here.
 
bodester413 said:
Yea I did. Like several others in here said at first I thought ok the fbi must think that having the aunt say those things would help humanize her. Something kept bugging me like I was missing something so I watched it a few more times. Now I'm wondering if there were two reasons for saying those things. To humanize Jayme to whoever took her and to let Jayme know that she should humanize herself. Do the same thing...talk about herself with whoever took her. Of course all that assumes she is someplace where she can watch the press conference or at least listen to it somehow.
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No, more than that... I hear a dog whistle.
 
BRRI said:
As far as I know, we still don’t know if LE or a perp or a victim kicked in the door, correct? We also don’t know if it was shot through? The police log didn’t seem to completely clarify those issues, nor has LE since? I think we may be getting too wrapped up in that. LE could have needed to bust the door in
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No, but the sheriff clearly said on the Ashley Banfield show that the door was "ajar" and James' feet were visible as the LEO approached. He also said James was found dead. LE did not kick the door in. James did not answer the door still alive for LE. He was dead at the door and the door was already open per the sheriff.
 
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MsBetsy said:
We have tried and tried to figure out when he may have gotten home, but it hasn't been confirmed. All we know is that he was working during the day at the time of the party. Unless that's changed and I missed something.
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I am not sure if we really know that. My husband has really odd work hours. And when he does have a free and clear Sunday, going to a young relatives Birthday Party, at my relatives, is not usually how hw likes to spend his rare free time. Unless it is OUR grandchild, he is going to pass. LOL

I have said many times, at such events, ' oh , he has to work , he sent his love...' Which does not always mean he is actually at his job that moment. It means roughly ' he has a demanding job so he needs to stay home today and read his fave book and drink a craft beer. '

So I do wonder if maybe that was what was really being said. JMO
 
katydid23 said:
OK, but I have some questions about the theory that Dad kicked in the door. Number one, why would he do so without calling 911? Wouldn't he want armed back up to come help him rescue his family?

I can totally understand him not waiting for them to arrive. But I cant understand him kicking in the door and not calling 911 first.


Also, WHY kick it in? Doesn't he have a key?


And isn't that a risky and slow way to gain entrance. Why not smash a rock through a window?

Besides all of that, the way his body was found, seems to show that he was standing, facing the door when he fell backwards. Looks like someone who was shot as they approached the door.

If he kicked in the door, who shot through it?


I just have a hard time working that out, that he came home and kicked in the door. It doesn't seem to fit with where and how his body fell.

And he knows the police station is only 4 minutes away. So why not call for help?
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Everybody is different when it comes to responding to danger. Fight or flight. Some people would just try to get into the action without batting an eye, some people would call 911 before going in, and some would call 911 and wait for them to arrive, or even get out of the situation and leave before they become a victim. It’s hard to say what you would do, until you’re in that situation.
 
BIC said:
Everybody is different when it comes to responding to danger. Fight or flight. Some people would just try to get into the action without batting an eye, some people would call 911 before going in, and some would call 911 and wait for them to arrive, or even get out of the situation and leave before they become a victim. It’s hard to say what you would do, until you’re in that situation.
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That’s precisely why I try to look at situations like this, and think about what other people would do. What most people would do.

It’s like when you’re watching Family Feud. The correct answer isn’t how you would respond, its how you expect most other people would respond.

The best way is to look at similar situations, and analyze how people reacted in those cases.
 
This online edition of this article was published today by the Barron News-Shield, the local newspaper. In accordance with TOS, I'm only posting the preview since this online article is hidden behind a paywall, due to requiring a subscription.

Remembering: Jim the athlete, Denise the volunteer
Their lives ended with sudden violence shortly before 1 a.m. Monday, Oct. 15, 2018, at a one-story, frame home backed by heavy woods, less than two miles west of Barron.
 
Hexe7 said:
I thought the along the same lines as you, except that the door was kicked in - which could have happened at any time, but James was found shot in or close to the door... So that doesn’t fit with the perps being there prior to him coming home... imo
And now with the LE only asking for people being on US8 around 12.30 to 1.30 I wonder if it all went much faster...
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The thing I keep thinking about with the traffic on Hwy 8 between oo3o and o130 is along the lines of what the Manson family killers did. I'm showing my age now, but when I was in HS, we had a brand new state of the art media center with huge Sony Betamax tape players. ( the equivalent of a VCR tape, except Sony was not compatible with VCR format and stopped making Betamax).
I was a senior in HS and had taken a very full class load for all my prior years in HS. When I was a senior, there wasn't much left for me to take. So, I volunteered to work in the library/ media center for an hour a day.

I'd go and get a copy of " Helter Skelter" and watch it. I had barely ever heard of " true crime" in books or on TV until that movie based on D.A. Vincent Bugliosi's book was made. BTW, the year was 1976. :) The crimes were several years " old", the perps. were in prison, the film was made for TV, so it wasn't graphic. Mostly, the video was interesting because D.A. Bugliosi's first person narrative into the murders was riveting.

Point being, I learned that the prosecution looked for the girls' knives and bloody clothing for a long time and couldn't find it. One night, as a team of detectives was driving the most likely route in the canyon, they started removing shirts and shoes and so forth and seeing where it landed. Likewise with other knives believed to be the heft and size of the murder weapons.

Lo and behold, when they got out to retrieve their outerwear and knives from the bushes, they found the Manson Family ragged bloody clothing and the knives, rusting in the weeds, some of which had rolled down hillsides and such.

When I think of what police think people could see at night if they were driving and minding their own business out in the country, I imagine some flying articles of clothing with blood spatter... perhaps bindings, tape, and items we read about in a " crime kit". I would expect metallic objects would have been found with metal detectors before now.. not sure.

Sorry this was so long, but I needed to set the stage. I ordinarily would not have watched something so gruesome about a creature as loathsome as Manson except that Bugliosi made it all riveting.

Then, when I got home in time for the nightly national news, Ted Bundy filled the TV screen. My family and I spent a lot of time in church. I think that helped me a lot. :)
 
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Gosh I'm still on the last thread and just realized this one will be closed before I finish up to reply. A few comments, from older stuff.

The theory that DC was the target: If she was, it would have been less risky for the bad guy to attack when JC was at work.

LE can get the IP address from Jayme's social media posts: Home computers seldom have a dedicated IP. It's all sorted out by DHCP.

Facebook requires it's users to be at least 13: She has posts going back to spring of 2013. I've known many friend's children who had accounts younger than 13. One close friend I talked to about it; the parent had the password so they could check all interactions, if the password was changed the account would go away, and by letting the child have the account they had a privilege that they could revoke if a punishment was called for.

The creepy guy story: Someone asked, "Did we know she went to Radar or did Radar just see her story online and go with it?" I saw it on social media a couple days earlier.

I think the theory about dad shot through the small window in the door makes sense. That would explain why relatives said the door was shot in, while LE said the door was kicked in. It could be bad guy(s) opened the storm door and pounded on the door, or started kicking the door. Dad came to the door, they shot him through the small window, then kicked the door in. Remember, LE says dad "had answered" the door, not "had opened" the door.

What were they doing for 20 minutes?: My theory. Terrible things were happening to mom. Jayme was restrained. 2nd perp? The chair? When bad guy(s) realized someone had made a 911 call, mom was finished off with a gunshot. Remember they said that the COD was gunshot, not that it was the only injuries. If it took them a while to determine the COD all the more reason to think there could have been other life-threatening injuries. Rage against mom seems like a good possibility. Why did they take Jayme? Maybe she had escaped, one person finished off mom, the other grabbed the kid and threw her in the trunk to deal with later.
 
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