2010.07.26 Grand Jury begins

[grandmaj]

freefallzzzz... Do you have a link? TYIA

I think this is it Emeralgem

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5483399&postcount=3"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - 2010.08.04 ~ Wednesday ~ TODAY's CURRENT NEWS ***No discussions please***[/ame]

 

[cypress]

This woman talking to Terri on June 4 would be another point on Terri's timeline, yes? Hmm.

I really wonder how big of a window LE believes Terri had to commit whatever crimes they're hoping to prosecute. The window seems very small to me, and abducting, murdering and disposing of a boy she raised would take some time, IMHO. It didn't happen lickity split, and then she supposedly went on about her day in a completely unhurried fashion. I know some believe this is further proof of her being a sociopath, but even sociopaths have a reaction to their crimes, even if it is euphoric. It just doesn't fit, IMHO.

Sometimes I believe Terri's seemingly guilty behavior is an unfortunate distraction from what really happened. If she's guilty, fine, charge her, win a conviction, and throw away the key, but something just doesn't fit. Argh!

 

[freefallzzzz]

freefallzzzz... Do you have a link? TYIA

I'll check the KPTV Fox 12 site, I saw it live on the local news..
I switched to KOIN, I think they had it on there a bit ago too..

**arghh I just need to get something to tape this stuff as they never put ALL
the stuff they say locally on those little videos on the news pages! =) =)

here ya go found one.. yay! =) =)

http://www.kptv.com/news/24531499/detail.html

 

[xin]

I've said this already, but this is really sounding like an investigative GR...did someone say whether or not they ever use them in Oregon?

Am anxious to hear if and when teachers and others from the school will start coming in, if they haven't already. Especially the little boy.

The school secretary is my favorite witness of all. Yes, and the little boy. And, MYSTERY witnesses!!!

 

[PDXMom]

It appears to me that Terri has some very loyal friends.

From the article: http://www.koinlocal6.com/content/n...pear-before-grand/2Ls683NdO0mfFAKnUn2ZHQ.cspx

"I can't tell you what happened, but I can tell you that you guys are going down a dead end," Aleshire said just before she entered the courthouse.

“She (Terri) was my friend, I talked to her that day as a friend, and that’s all,” she added.

I took that comment to mean that the reporters were not going to get any juicy info from HER, because she hadn't even talked to her since that day. Interesting that she said "was", instead of "is".

 

[PDXMom]

I've said this already, but this is really sounding like an investigative GR...did someone say whether or not they ever use them in Oregon?

Am anxious to hear if and when teachers and others from the school will start coming in, if they haven't already. Especially the little boy.

I don't know what that means. When you posted the first time, I thought you'd meant investigative GJ. What is a GR?

 

[cluciano63]

whoops that was a typo...i did mean GJ-sorry

 

[Calliope]

I took that comment to mean that the reporters were not going to get any juicy info from HER, because she hadn't even talked to her since that day. Interesting that she said "was", instead of "is".

I hope you're right. Otherwise, if it turns out they've been focused on the wrong person for 2 months ...

 

[Calliope]

whoops that was a typo...i did mean GJ-sorry

If it's an investigative grand jury, then the prosecutor might not be entirely sure of what these witnesses are going to say. That's quite a gamble if they've put all their eggs into the Terri basket.

 

[freefallzzzz]

In this video the reporter says,
"This friend was appearing before the Grand Jury, it has convened to hear evidence obviously in the Kyron Horman disappearance"

and near the end...

"We do know that this afternoon TH was actually meeting with her attorney SH which is just one street over from the court house.."

Now they will probably update it with the 6pm newscast =) Quick someone watch! =) =)

"Two of Terri's friends appear before Grand Jury"
http://www.koinlocal6.com/content/mediacenter/default.aspx

 

[rnmif]

This woman talking to Terri on June 4 would be another point on Terri's timeline, yes? Hmm.

I really wonder how big of a window LE believes Terri had to commit whatever crimes they're hoping to prosecute. The window seems very small to me, and abducting, murdering and disposing of a boy she raised would take some time, IMHO. It didn't happen lickity split, and then she supposedly went on about her day in a completely unhurried fashion. I know some believe this is further proof of her being a sociopath, but even sociopaths have a reaction to their crimes, even if it is euphoric. It just doesn't fit, IMHO.

Sometimes I believe Terri's seemingly guilty behavior is an unfortunate distraction from what really happened. If she's guilty, fine, charge her, win a conviction, and throw away the key, but something just doesn't fit. Argh!

This is another stumbling block for me. She genuinely seemed in earlier pictures to love Kyron. Somehow she went from loving him, to not caring whether he lived or died, and her daughter was the reason.

But she's willing to kill her daughter's beloved brother in front of her, and dispose of him, either with while she's with him, or endangering her while leaving her alone while she disposes of the body?

I can't really get my head around how that is even possible, let alone the trail of evidence that would have been left behind, and she had very little time to erase it and compose herself. Either MCSO are the most incompetent LE agency on earth, or TH is the most brilliant human ever to live.

 

[gitana1]

[/b]


Above BBM..
wrinkles, you are spot on with the last part of your post(aboveBBM). Speaking on that exact thought is that for instance we, here at WS are all of the "pool" from which the jurors[for both GJ and Trial Jury] are so randomly drawn from. That said, just look at the W-I-D-E AND BROAD spectrum of the very many DIFFERENT(and sometimes polar OPPOSITE) views of the many aspects of just this case alone. With each us standing fairly firmly(atleast the majority are sure with the little facts known of who in our opinion was at the very least "involved" in Kyron's "disappearance")in our opinion of who WAS or was NOT involved...

With the opinions and views so very drastically varying (in this case as well as many others)IMO it truly is a wonder that juries EVER come to a joint decision of GUILT or of NOT GUILT....

If we had all the info a jury is going to get in this case, I would bet that the spectrum would shorten quite a bit. There is a wider spectrum here because we don't have any facts from LE yet except that Kyron is missing.

If it's an investigative grand jury, then the prosecutor might not be entirely sure of what these witnesses are going to say. That's quite a gamble if they've put all their eggs into the Terri basket.

I keep hearing people posit about LE putting all their efforts into investigating TH, to the exclusion of any other possibility. There is no proof of that. I seem to remember massive searches around the school to see if Kyron wandered off, for example. Why would we assume that LE has not checked the whereabouts of all sex offenders in the area, have not interviewed every potential witness at the school, questioned everyone they could about possibly strangers, checked out all the family members etc.? We do know TH was not the only one polygraphed, just that her results probably did not help to clear her. But the point is, she was not the only one to be polygraphed.
I see not one thing that would allow me to question LE's investigation and/or that it has been a thorough one. Yes, the media reports show that the focus is no on TH but those reports do not show that no other possibility has been examined.
In general, LE tends to consider all possibilities, narrowing their focus as the facts they learn narrow the possibilities. I think that is what has happened here. JMO.

 

[cluciano63]

I don't doubt that LE looked into other possibilities than Terri being guilty; but they appear to be invested in a need for her to be guilty, in a way, at least to me. Maybe that is partly due to D&K needing it to be Terri so badly and being so vocal about it. They are really the ones who brought all the focus on to Terri, not counting the flyer from LE.

With the GJ meeting, however, it does seem that whatever they have learned, they are pretty convinced Terri is the culprit. I still can't figure out how they can prove it if no one saw her leave school with Kyron. Her saying she left him there should make perfect sense, if not for her oddities since that day. So taking away her behavior (if possible)- what points to Terri, really?

 

[lillys]

cuciano63.
I'm sitting close to where you are. AS far as we know, no one saw Kyron leave with Terri. I would love to know what evidence LE has. Im not convinced about Terri's guilt quite yet.

 

[cypress]

I don't doubt that LE looked into other possibilities than Terri being guilty; but they appear to be invested in a need for her to be guilty, in a way, at least to me. Maybe that is partly due to D&K needing it to be Terri so badly and being so vocal about it. They are really the ones who brought all the focus on to Terri, not counting the flyer from LE.

With the GJ meeting, however, it does seem that whatever they have learned, they are pretty convinced Terri is the culprit. I still can't figure out how they can prove it if no one saw her leave school with Kyron. Her saying she left him there should make perfect sense, if not for her oddities since that day. So taking away her behavior (if possible)- what points to Terri, really?

Exactly.

No one saw Kyron leave with Terri, there's no evidence of a murder, and yet how likely is it that he's alive?

I honestly don't understand on what grounds they'll indict her. We KNOW there's no evidence of a murder. It's not as if there was a large area bleached inside the home or truck. Desiree and Kaine have asserted vehemently and often that they believe Kyron is alive. LE may be changing their story, but with the way in which Desiree and Kaine have openly accused Terri and yet in the next breath stated they don't believe Kyron is dead, well, somehow I believe Houze will work their statements to his benefit. All he'll need to do is replay the many press conferences in which Desiree and Kaine asserted that Terri abducted Kyron, and yet turn to the jury and say, "But not even they believe she could've killed him." Then he'll only have to create reasonable doubt with regard to the abduction, and if no one saw them leave together, then LE can trot out the sexts and Terri's bizarre behavior and her cell phones, but IMHO, it's not going to matter.

 

[Mamietwo]

I know it may appear that when an investigation is going on in a crime of this magnitude or even murder, it may seem like LE needs a certain party to be guilty and looks at nothing else, but that's not true. What LE does is they look at each individual that is closest to the victim, family and others that are closest first. In this way they can eliminate who they need to so that they can go on. If they cannot eliminate persons close for one reason or several, then they try harder to look for things that could allow them to eliminate those people. So while it may appear that they have a need for someone that they've chosen to be guilty, that couldn't more wrong. LE doesn't care whether it's Terri or Joe Blow across the street. I remember early on when I thought Terri was responsible, that it seemed to me LE was dragging their feet and not seeing what I thought they should be seeing. While they may have a POI, they certainly still have not come out and named one so I can't accuse them of putting the cart before the horse, so to speak.

In this case, it won't be just one thing, it will be the adding up of everything that's not adding up.

 

[Janeumayer]

If Terri hasn't testified at the GJ, then who testified as "the last person who saw him" then?

 

[cypress]

Also, with regard to Terri's friend, obviously she doesn't think Terri is guilty, so I doubt there was some explosive revelation about whatever they talked about on the phone that day. Terri talking to this girl only confirms another plot point on her timeline. We may not know what it is, but it's something else she did that day.

When I think about the GJ indicting Terri and a possible trial, I wonder:

How are they going to disprove that Terri drove baby K around too soothe her earache? They'll get some doctors and friends who say "Yes, in fact, driving a baby around while she's teething would be soothing." It's something that can't really be disproved.

Her pings don't quite match up? Experts, and a lot of them, to cast doubt on the exact science of cell pings, or Terri doesn't remember exactly where she was driving because she was worried about calming her daughter so maybe she did ping off that tower and didn't realize it. Suavie Island has been searched extensively, and LE found nothing.

What do the cell phones prove? Desiree has said she was suspicious of Terri from the first phone call. Houze will trot out some friend who tells some sad story about Terri not even being able to talk on her phone because everyone was so suspicious of her. All she wanted to do was find her son, she had no one to talk to, blah blah blah.

The sexts? IMHO, even though it's among the more supposedly damning evidence, it's also the easiest to explain. Trot out some expert who says Terri has low self-esteem and only feels self-worth when engaged sexually with a man. Lord help us if there is some revelation or accusation that Kaine was emotionally or otherwise abusive. Kaine left Terri, took the baby, accused her of something horrendous, Terri was grieving for her son, and voila, ugly coping. Everyone was pushing her to break, and she did, but not in the way anyone thought or hoped she would.

I just don't understand how they're going to indict her without witnesses seeing Kyron leave with her and without a body and without evidence that a murder even occurred.

Also, IMHO, if DS was going to reveal something explosive, she'd have done it by now and the case would've progressed in a mighty way (his body found, the bloody shovel, whatever). There has been plenty of time for immunity to be worked out, and yet Kyron hasn't been found.

 

[For The Kids]

This is another stumbling block for me. She genuinely seemed in earlier pictures to love Kyron. Somehow she went from loving him, to not caring whether he lived or died, and her daughter was the reason.

But she's willing to kill her daughter's beloved brother in front of her, and dispose of him, either with while she's with him, or endangering her while leaving her alone while she disposes of the body?

I can't really get my head around how that is even possible, let alone the trail of evidence that would have been left behind, and she had very little time to erase it and compose herself. Either MCSO are the most incompetent LE agency on earth, or TH is the most brilliant human ever to live.

On the same basis she is allegedly happy to attempt to hire someone to kill her beloved daughter and step sons father. A guy who just a year or so ago said yes hes all that and a bag of chips.

And IMO she had plenty of time to compose herself. As its been said...Shes Like Ice...

JMO

 

[For The Kids]

Exactly.

No one saw Kyron leave with Terri, there's no evidence of a murder, and yet how likely is it that he's alive?

I honestly don't understand on what grounds they'll indict her. We KNOW there's no evidence of a murder. It's not as if there was a large area bleached inside the home or truck. Desiree and Kaine have asserted vehemently and often that they believe Kyron is alive. LE may be changing their story, but with the way in which Desiree and Kaine have openly accused Terri and yet in the next breath stated they don't believe Kyron is dead, well, somehow I believe Houze will work their statements to his benefit. All he'll need to do is replay the many press conferences in which Desiree and Kaine asserted that Terri abducted Kyron, and yet turn to the jury and say, "But not even they believe she could've killed him." Then he'll only have to create reasonable doubt with regard to the abduction, and if no one saw them leave together, then LE can trot out the sexts and Terri's bizarre behavior and her cell phones, but IMHO, it's not going to matter.

Cindy Anthony still says she doesnt believe Caylee is dead even though she cleaned the car boot out herself that Caylee was in. Because they say they believe he is alive publically it doesnt mean that deep down they feel that way.

jmo