4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, 2022 #78

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Ethan's parents wise advice how they deal with their grief. Lots of adorable photos!


The Chapins aren’t angry, they insisted, although no one would blame them. Jim offered a firm and brief explanation about why.

"That’s negative energy, and it’s not worth it," he said.

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This is where I’m at with this theory.

I can reason seeing a guy wearing a COVID mask making his exit from a home accustomed to the comings and goings of roommates, friends, SOs, and the occasional party goers they host. I can even reason brushing off the appearance of said guy following the commotion that prompted DM to get out of bed. But if I opened my bedroom door in the dead of the night and saw a guy in a Tyvek suit (who I have to imagine kept the hood propped up over his head and had his shoes wrapped in booties to have even gone the route of the protective suit in the first place) with the COVID mask looking like an out of place painter/exterminator/mechanic/whatever, I would definitely find THAT bizarre enough to remember.

That’s just me though.
/jmo
Your post made me realize that I don't think I saw a single mask wearer on any of the bodycam videos of the visits to the house. I think a mask wearer might be something abnormal at the house. Going to go back and look now.

JMO
 
What a bummer for his family, that he bombed out of his job at their school district where they were well known, if true he had to resign, jmo.

"Kohberger’s two older sisters attended the same school system, and their parents also spent lengthy tenures working there. Kohberger’s father retired in June 2019 after 12 1/2 years as a maintenance worker with the district, followed by his mother retiring in June 2020 after 16 years as education support staff, their school district personnel records obtained by the Statesman showed.

In the nearly four months since Kohberger was taken into custody, the Pleasant Valley School District has remained tight-lipped. That’s in spite of repeated requests for comment from more than a dozen media outlets, including the Statesman, according to email records, and the Kohberger family being well-known within the district."


https://www.bellinghamherald.com/news/state/article274755381.html
I feel so bad for his parents. They are just regular people trying to live a life and now they've been plunged into this horror show. All their laundry, both clean and dirty thrown all over. Their hearts must be broken.
 
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It appears the sheath was left in place from the time LE responded until the documenting officer got there. There is no evidence of the sheath being in that room before the murders. The crucial detail has to be that the knife wounds were made by a knife that fits into that sheath, which the ME's can determine with fair accuracy.

Further, BK had few friends or associates who could have gotten access to his DNA (and only his DNA - not their own mixed in). BK would have to remember that someone handed him a sheath to mess around with, at some point. It's very unlikely to have gotten to the use point of the sheath in any other way.

I do expect them to test the sheath further. If someone else's DNA has been found on the use point of that sheath, then I would expect the Defense to have petitioned the Court in some manner.

IMO.
 
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<modsnip: quoted post was snipped> The sheath doesn't have to be "planted." Its existents in and of itself is suspicious. The very existence of the DNA may be a defense. We see only the prosecution side of the case so far. And we all KNOW that. Why do we see so many convictions overturned these days? Because prosecutors sought a path and made the evidence fit it. And disregarded anything to the contrary. IF (and its a big if) it is his DNA on the sheath, what does that show? It shows it is his DNA on the sheath. Nothing more.
 
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<modsnip: quoted post was removed> It seems to me that LE gathered a bunch of evidence before they focused on BK. They had a physical description, they had a knife sheath, with a single source DNA sample, they had video of a car, that they then investigated, they looked up phone records and investigated, they put all that together, then got DNA from Pennsylvania trash, ETA: the rest of my post: They compared the DNA samples, and came to a conclusion on a SUSPECT, who they then arrested.
 
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It seems to me that LE gathered a bunch of evidence before they focused on BK. They had a physical description, they had a knife sheath, with a single source DNA sample, they had video of a car, that they then investigated, they looked up phone records and investigated, they put all that together, then got DNA from Pennsylvania trash, ETA: the rest of my post: They compared the DNA samples, and came to a conclusion on a SUSPECT, who they then arrested.
The police putting those things in an affidavit is one thing. Now the prosecutor much meet legal standards to get them all admitted. And it is complicated, and in my opinion, going to be challenging. We have all gotten used to the idea that "the police said his phone was in the area," and just assuming that is true. But is it? How do you prove it? That is his DNA? Really? Prove it. Even if it is, what does that show? Does it meet evidentiary standards to be presented?
 
The police putting those things in an affidavit is one thing. Now the prosecutor much meet legal standards to get them all admitted. And it is complicated, and in my opinion, going to be challenging. We have all gotten used to the idea that "the police said his phone was in the area," and just assuming that is true. But is it? How do you prove it? That is his DNA? Really? Prove it. Even if it is, what does that show? Does it meet evidentiary standards to be presented?
Perhaps that's why they added the Special Assistant Attorneys General?
 

This is the song Ethan sent his mom, Stacy, last Mother's Day.

Thought You Should Know by Morgan Wallen​


From the Fox article @gliving posted: "I just realized the next milestone is gonna be Mother's Day. That's going to be a tough one," Stacy said. Last year, Ethan celebrated his mom by sending her the new Morgan Wallen song, "Thought You Should Know." Wallen wrote it for his own mother. The song includes the line, "All those prayers you thought you wasted on me must’ve finally made their way on through."

"He was like, ’Mom, that’s pretty fitting for you,’" Stacy recalled. "It will now always forever be my most favorite song," Stacy said. "You wish you could be like, ‘Hey, Morgan Wallen, let me tell you how much you’ve touched our life by that.'"
What an awesome family!

I'd never heard this song before. Maybe you haven't either. Plus good reason for a song break.
Thanks @gliving
Ethan's parents wise advice how they deal with their grief. Lots of adorable photos!


The Chapins aren’t angry, they insisted, although no one would blame them. Jim offered a firm and brief explanation about why.

"That’s negative energy, and it’s not worth it," he said.

View attachment 417879
 
Perhaps that's why they added the Special Assistant Attorneys General?
Oh I have no doubt that the DA knew he needed help in this matter. This is going to get very technical. He is a good DA and very experienced and certainly capable, but bringing on help that is already experienced in these sort of upcoming legal battles just makes sense. But at the same time, folks shouldn't balk too much if the defense asks for additional resources. They already work at a serious disadvantage.
 
<modsnip: quoted post was removed> To my understanding, they had a forensic van at the scene and the DNA was tested by Latah County Sheriff's department. I doubt that they exhausted the entire source of DNA, since so little is needed and test results can be achieved in about two hours.

The DNA code itself either matches BK's DNA or it doesn't. They have his DNA now. If it doesn't match, his attorney should be on their way into court to get him out of jail, IMO.

It's routine testing by a forensic team of the Sheriff, but without destroying any part of the sheath (that's why they do a tiny swab on the use point). The method is PCR in nearly 100% of forensic DNA testing (the same way we use tech to analyze DNA samples for genetic research into the history of our species). These techniques have changed only a little (computerization) since the 1980's. The methods have been peer reviewed literally thousands of times. The academic use of these techniques for ongoing health care and research are global.

This process (which is actually very simple - I can have my students isolate DNA from a banana with simple techniques in lab - I just don't have the PCR analysis). This is the same technology we use to find COVID variants. The US has many, many labs that use this same process.

I've never seen any trials where someone had to come in and qualify as a DNA expert in order to get DNA into court - because it's no different, technically, than blood type analysis (ABO) which preceded it. It simply looks at a much more microscopic aspect of a cell. DNA is produced only by living things. Human DNA is 60% the same as a banana's, so we look at the other 40% using a computer that "knows" exactly which locii on the DNA strand to analyze (each gene has a stop code preceding it, the entire system has been known and used worldwide since the 1990's).

I simply can't imagine any court doubting that DNA is unique to individuals (except identical twins). It's like a fingerprint.

The other question, about planting a sheath is sketchy, too. Who would do this? If someone stole BK's knife (using gloves), would he not have reported that to LE early on? If they determine the knife was not a 7", then we have big problems with the sheath. But as I've said, it's very doubtful that there's that inconsistency and his lawyer hasn't already brought to the Judge. Instead, it's likely the autopsy mentions a knife consistent with being a Ka-Bar and if forensic radiology was used, they might also have detected the proprietary coating that Ka-Bar uses in its knives.

I think if all of this is the case, the DNA will come in, in the ordinary way. In the way used to convict Joe DeAngelo and many others who are being convicted all over the US (or, exonerated). There's nothing the least bit controversial about the nature of DNA or its study using amplification and computerized sequencing of the nucleotide bases.

What would be controversial if somehow BK was tricked into touching the knife sheath (but of course, there's still the problem of his car, and his phone). BTW, I assume they found his DNA on his phone and in his car - and that will be used at trial as well. If the only DNA in his car is his and his dad's, that's relevant (no one else drove his car in that case).

IMO.
 
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<modsnip: quoted post was removed> There's staged/framed crime in there, too, and if you want more examples, Innocence Project and Equal Justice Initiative have them. You just have to search. Within the list I provided, you'll find at least 5 examples of people framing others, and if you wanted more, they're out there imo. The list I provided is not just police or prosecutorial misconduct, but of course, that happens, too. I do not think it's valid to excuse some of those instances of police or prosecutorial misconduct since they do involved planting and staging in some cases, too.

While I do not believe BK was framed by LE, I do think that there was a singular focus on him since 11.29. Maybe that's for valid reasons, maybe IDK. What I do know is that there are a lot of questions, a lot of holes, and that when the focus narrows too much, we miss a lot. I thought I had this figured out until I saw the warrants/scopes/dates, and started following those trails. IMO the simple explanation may prove to be true, but IDTS jmo.
 
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The police putting those things in an affidavit is one thing. Now the prosecutor much meet legal standards to get them all admitted. And it is complicated, and in my opinion, going to be challenging. We have all gotten used to the idea that "the police said his phone was in the area," and just assuming that is true. But is it? How do you prove it? That is his DNA? Really? Prove it. Even if it is, what does that show? Does it meet evidentiary standards to be presented?
The phone can be placed.
MOO Iris Eytan was able to minimize technical phone data evidence in real time on the stand at Barry Morphew's PH by confusing an expert witness, but hopefully here the prosecution is not so lax as to not prepare their witnesses and evidence for questioning.
 
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The police putting those things in an affidavit is one thing. Now the prosecutor much meet legal standards to get them all admitted. And it is complicated, and in my opinion, going to be challenging. We have all gotten used to the idea that "the police said his phone was in the area," and just assuming that is true. But is it? How do you prove it? That is his DNA? Really? Prove it. Even if it is, what does that show? Does it meet evidentiary standards to be presented?
You do well to remind us that the PCA is a summary of evidence that has not been tested under evidentiary and procedural standards. Its purpose is limited to showing the court and the public that BK was not arrested and detained arbitrarily. Because it's one of the few attested documents we have, we sometimes make too much of it, or too little. So, thanks for the reminder.
 
With the continuing development of forensic sciences, the Courts have assumed the role of gatekeepers when it comes to admissibility. You can get into the details as deeply as you like on sites like The National Library of Medicine, which has an article describing the different analytical frameworks courts apply, and cases decided under those frameworks.

People who live in the American West will not be surprised to learn that Idaho has decided to go its own way on this subject, adopting a standard that seems much broader than other states and the US Court system:

"Idaho Rules of Evidence Rule 702. Testimony by Expert Witnesses.

A witness who is qualified as an expert by knowledge, skill, experience, training, or education may testify in the form of an opinion or otherwise if the expert's scientific, technical, or other specialized knowledge will help the trier of fact to understand the evidence or to determine a fact in issue."

MOO, BK will challenge expert analysis of DNA under this test, both as support for search warrants and as evidence for the inference that he was at the murder scene with a weapon. I note with interest that the lead investigator specifically asked the court to ignore the DNA evidence in its analysis of probable cause to arrest. I expect (MOO) this is a standard precautionary strategy, i.e. not wanting to rely too heavily on DNA in case there were errors in handling or processing that reduce its reliability and call the arrest and incident searches into question. But it could have other significance for speculative minds.

Most of the reported cases seem to support the admissibility of DNA expert testimony even when its reliability or relevance to a particular fact in issue may be questioned. After decades of reliance on DNA science, judges seem to prefer to let juries sort these issues. Again, MOO - and I am always prepared to be surprised...
 
Perhaps, the next morning, BK was dressed in his best professorial clothes and hoped to sidle up to a journalist to offer his educated opinions about crimes of this nature and the minds behind them.

Only to discover no LE presence, no media.

Jmo

Good point. I'm not sure what time frame a person would *expect* the horror to be discovered but I am personally surprised it was so late in the day before police arrived and then the news quickly broke. Supposed it's quite reasonable to imagine one could go and be part of the attending crowds by at least say, late morning, lunch time-ish? Especially in a household that has a dog.

Speaking of the dog... I'm baffled. Would the dog not have been barking non stop and scratching at the door by morning time? needing the loo, etc, like ALL dogs do? This is a dog that was used to being in company of a lot of people, no doubt had a routine of being let out or taken out early in the day then frequently walked, and suddenly it's alone in a closed room for many many hours. Any dog I've ever had would have been a noise nuisance to neighbouring households at that point, barking and howling, scratching the door and trying to chew it's way out. What do we know about any of this?
 
Ethan's parents wise advice how they deal with their grief. Lots of adorable photos!


The Chapins aren’t angry, they insisted, although no one would blame them. Jim offered a firm and brief explanation about why.

"That’s negative energy, and it’s not worth it," he said.

View attachment 417879
Oh my goodness, how precious.

So sad one of these angels is gone too soon, but what a class act this family is and has been throughout this entire ordeal. I don't know if I could be the same, but God bless them and continue to give them strength.

MOO
 
Only one issue I see, they are loud.

Agree, they make that scritchy scratchy papery noise.

I personally imagine that BK being a runner, if this scale of horror was pre-planned meticulously (personally I leave room that it may not have been), then he would have chosen very thin, close fitting, lightweight, and waterproof / impermeable / semi-permeable (where the moisture only wicks outwardly and doesn't let anything in) type of attire that is aimed at sports people and doesn't make scuffly noises or hang loose anywhere.

JMO MOO
 
<modsnip: quoted post was removed>
It appears the sheath was left in place from the time LE responded until the documenting officer got there. There is no evidence of the sheath being in that room before the murders. The crucial detail has to be that the knife wounds were made by a knife that fits into that sheath, which the ME's can determine with fair accuracy.

Further, BK had few friends or associates who could have gotten access to his DNA (and only his DNA - not their own mixed in). BK would have to remember that someone handed him a sheath to mess around with, at some point. It's very unlikely to have gotten to the use point of the sheath in any other way.

I do expect them to test the sheath further. If someone else's DNA has been found on the use point of that sheath, then I would expect the Defense to have petitioned the Court in some manner.

IMO.
Spot on, @10ofRods!

Here for the rest of us is an article describing the ways DNA evidence improperly used or interpreted can result in wrongful accusations and convictions:

How Forensic DNA Evidence Can Lead to Wrongful Convictions
 
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