4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #83

[Nila Aella]

Confusing to me. Defense wants to hurry up and wait.
(Shorten time by putting 2 motions on 6/27 and STAY proceedings so D has more time.)

I hope BK was able to watch the octillion news reports about himself today.
With BK's control issues when disrespected/stressed/bad news
-- as in BK seems to have no control (think altercations with professor) --
his stress level must be rising, often leading to irritability and moodiness.
Tuesday is going to be interesting.
Except no cameras again? We won't be able to watch his jaw or fists clench.

JMO

They do seem opposite and confusing.

The initial motion to compel IMO has dragged on too long. Nice to see that the second one is being dealt with quickly by JJJ.

The motion to stay was a request for a temporary stay.

From the motion:
Mr. Kohberger’s request to stay proceedings until the grand jury record is prepared and he has adequate time to contest the indictment should be granted.

The Judge has already ordered extra time for the D to respond once they receive the GJ materials. When that was ordered I thought that meant the judge agreed with the D getting the GJ "materials" not just the proceedings.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/051923%20Order%20to%20Enlarge%20Time%20to%20File%20Pretrial%20Motions.pdf

I agree Tuesday will be interesting:

Grand Jury proceedings
Grand Jury Materials
Motion to Compel
Motion to compel 2

The D also wanted the Motion to Stay on Jan 27th.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/061323%20Notice%20of%20Hearing%20-%20Def%20Motion%20for%20an%20Exception%20or%20In%20Alternative%20to%20Extend%20Time%20for%20Compliance.pdf

I don't think the motion for exception or extension of time to comply with alibi demand is on the docket yet either.

There hasn't been a ruling on the nondissemination order yet. They had a pool camera at the other hearings. Hoping that this hearing will be handled the same.

MOO

 

[maskedwoman]

Much as I think he’s guilty, I also think we’re trying far too hard, when we try to pretend that a college student going home for Christmas is acting suspiciously.

That's a very fair point. I think fleeing would be a normal criminal's reaction to being a murderer - it certainly seems common enough on 48 Hours and in the news. But I don't think someone who is capable of murdering 4 people face to face is normal. If he planned any of this, and I think he did, he would have planned the aftermath, too. A stranger to the area would be best served by just leaving. But he had his TA and school. Suddenly leaving would have made him stand out. It seems logical that keeping to his normal schedule and activities were his best chance to remain undiscovered. MOOooo

EBM to correct typo

 

[ktm44]

Much as I think he’s guilty, I also think we’re trying far too hard, when we try to pretend that a college student going home for Christmas is acting suspiciously.

If he hadn't gone home for Christmas with family, it would have looked way more suspicious.

 

[Boxer]

MOO "fugitive from justice"'would apply to any perpetrator leaving a police jurisdiction in which the crime they are charged with and arrested for, was committed.
It makes sense to me.

 

[Twistinginthewind]

If he hadn't gone home for Christmas with family, it would have looked way more suspicious.

Respectfully, I get what you're saying, however, my experience has been quite different.

I moved cross country to attend college and never went home for the winter holidays. I was a starving student, working weekends and doing what we called Jan Term or Winter Term, a full course of credit packed into 1 month. So I never made it back home for the holidays, I didn't have time or money and my parents siblings and I didn't consider it a big deal even though we used to, before we all left home.

Back to BK, I never said his travel back to PA for the holidays was suspicious.

What I mean to say is "it happened", and it happened to coincide with him traveling far away from ID where he is the only suspect of committing 5 felonies / 4 murders, whatever the time of year/holidays on the calendar, that LE arrested him on a fugitive from justice warrant, see links in my post above.

If it sounds like he can't win for losin', oh well. IMO and MOO.

 

[Nila Aella]

The term “fugitive from justice” means any person who has fled from any State to avoid prosecution for a crime or to avoid giving testimony in any criminal proceeding.

18 U.S. Code § 1073 - Flight to avoid prosecution or giving testimony

www.law.cornell.edu

The state, in their search warrant application for his apartment, wrote:



MOO

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

MOO "fugitive from justice"'would apply to any perpetrator leaving a police jurisdiction in which the crime they are charged with and arrested for, was committed.
It makes sense to me.

He wasn't arrested or even charged at the time he left nor is there any indication he wasn't planning to return.

 

[girlhasnoname]

MOO "fugitive from justice"'would apply to any perpetrator leaving a police jurisdiction in which the crime they are charged with and arrested for, was committed.
It makes sense to me.

Standard language for them to be able to issue an arrest warrant in a different state (PA) for a crime committed in another (ID). Nothing burger IMO

 

[NCWatcher]

The term “fugitive from justice” means any person who has fled from any State to avoid prosecution for a crime or to avoid giving testimony in any criminal proceeding.

18 U.S. Code § 1073 - Flight to avoid prosecution or giving testimony

www.law.cornell.edu

The state, in their search warrant application for his apartment, wrote:

View attachment 430683View attachment 430684

MOO

I think the key point in the above definition is that the person has to be fleeing to try to avoid prosecution for a crime. As others have pointed out, when BK left WA he hadn't been charged with a crime but more importantly to me, do we really think he "fled" to his parents house for Christmas break to hide? That he thought "hey, no one will think to look for me where I lived my entire life until last summer.?" I don't. And from the search warrant info, authorities investigating the case didn't think he fled to PA either.
JMO

 

[Nila Aella]

I think the key point in the above definition is that the person has to be fleeing to try to avoid prosecution for a crime. As others have pointed out, when BK left WA he hadn't been charged with a crime but more importantly to me, do we really think he "fled" to his parents house for Christmas break to hide? That he thought "hey, no one will think to look for me where I lived my entire life until last summer.?" I don't. And from the search warrant info, authorities investigating the case didn't think he fled to PA either.
JMO

I agree that he did not flee to his PA home with the intent to avoid prosecution or to avoid giving testimony. Like LE states, he was on Christmas break at his family home when they issued a warrant for his arrest. I also recall that it was a planned visit home and the car repair business said it was mentioned the car would be going back to Idaho. MOO

I also think that the rules of extradition require a fugitive warrant to transfer a person from one jurisdiction (state) to another jurisdiction (state). I haven't found any other avenue for them to be able to extradite a person charged with a crime. He didn't flee, but they needed that type of warrant to bring him back to Idaho. JMO

 

[MyBelle]

Standard language for them to be able to issue an arrest warrant in a different state (PA) for a crime committed in another (ID). Nothing burger IMO

Huge nothing burger, imo.

He had been fired from his teaching job. He knew he had killed 4 people. Seems to me, BK had several reasons to flee to the comfort of Mommy & Daddy's house.

Bryan Kohberger fired as teaching assistant before arrest in student killings

Bryan Kohberger was fired as a teaching assistant at Washington State University after it investigated him for run-ins with a professor and his behavior toward women in the weeks leading up to his …

nypost.com

Bryan Kohberger reportedly was fired as a teaching assistant at Washington State University after it investigated him for run-ins with a professor and his behavior toward women in the weeks leading up to his arrest in the murders of four University of Idaho students.

 

[Boxer]

He wasn't arrested or even charged at the time he left nor is there any indication he wasn't planning to return.

MOO he is charged and arrested of a crime in that jurisdiction, he left that jurisdiction.
MOO the fugitive charge will be dropped if he is found not guilty.

If he was arrested, bailed in Idaho and then left he would be skipping bail.

 

[Boxer]

Standard language for them to be able to issue an arrest warrant in a different state (PA) for a crime committed in another (ID). Nothing burger IMO

Agree.

 

[NCWatcher]

Huge nothing burger, imo.

He had been fired from his teaching job. He knew he had killed 4 people. Seems to me, BK had several reasons to flee to the comfort of Mommy & Daddy's house.

Bryan Kohberger fired as teaching assistant before arrest in student killings

Bryan Kohberger was fired as a teaching assistant at Washington State University after it investigated him for run-ins with a professor and his behavior toward women in the weeks leading up to his …

nypost.com

Bryan Kohberger reportedly was fired as a teaching assistant at Washington State University after it investigated him for run-ins with a professor and his behavior toward women in the weeks leading up to his arrest in the murders of four University of Idaho students.

He hadn't been fired when he left for PA for Christmas break. The article cited above states the letter firing him was on Dec 19, after he was in PA. Also the article states the university didn't find wrongdoing with women as a reason he was fired. (That's stated after lots of anonymous stories about improper behavior are reported in the article.)
JMO

 

[Megnut]

He hadn't been fired when he left for PA for Christmas break. The article cited above states the letter firing him was on Dec 19, after he was in PA. Also the article states the university didn't find wrongdoing with women as a reason he was fired. (That's stated after lots of anonymous stories about improper behavior are reported in the article.)
JMO

True... but I don't the letter was a surprise to him. IMO he been informed. The letter was the formality.

Jmo

 

[I'm Nobody]

IMO everybody is right; BK didn't flee but he was arrested for fleeing. Another confusing case point.
Reference wording "fugitive" is NOT in PA statute used to arrest BK.
"fugitive from justice" reads "fled from justice."
True, as pointed out by many, BK left WA before the ID murder warrant was issued.
Therefore technically he did not "flee" but people say he fled from justice bc he was arrested for that.
And some say BK fled from justice bc they believe his fleeing was part of his plan. Maybe, maybe not.
PA arrested BK on the fled-from-justice-statute bc it fit.
AT would have already motioned to have BK's PA arrest thrown out if it wasn't legal.

What's fascinating to me is that the Supreme Court only agrees 9-0 in apprx 47% of their cases. Our laws are open to interpretation most of the time by even truly brilliant legal minds.

Everyone seems a little bit right on this fleeing from justice matter.
JMO

For reference:

BK Pennsylvania Arrest Docket
PA Statute Arrest Prior To Requisition 42 § 9134 "fled from justice"
SCOTUSblog votes

 

[10ofRods]

Yes, the defense just filed a motion for a delay.

The defense is asking for all the GJ proceedings including witness list. They are entitled to some GJ evidence but they are crossing the line by asking for information they are not entitled to. This is slowing things down because the prosecution has to keep filing opposition motions.

So the defense is asking to halt everything and get more time on the grounds that the prosecution is not turning over everything they have on the GJ.

Bryan Kohberger’s defense asks judge to halt hearings over records delay

Attorneys for the Moscow homicide defendant may seek to challenge his indictment. The trial is now scheduled for October.

www.seattletimes.com

Attorneys for Moscow homicide defendant Bryan Kohberger seek to pause his court proceedings while they await delivery of contested records from last month’s grand jury indictment that pushed the closely watched case to a trial scheduled for October.

Kohberger’s defense team might consider challenging the indictment of their client by the confidential panel, which the prosecution sat exclusively for this case.

The defense requested the details of those grand jury hearings, including all transcripts and recordings, presented evidence and the jurors’ names, to decide how to move forward, according to court records.

I did realize they asked for a pause. And I saw their reasoning. What I didn't catch is that they are asking for things they aren't entitled to have (I think I understand what and how now, after your post and a re-reading of the documents).

So what happens if, due to all these motions, trial must be delayed but Kohberger hasn't asked for delay and asserts his right to a speedy trial? What will the Judge have to do? What does a Judge do if the speedy-trial asking defendant also deploys delay tactics?

Wouldn't the Judge simply rule that the right to a speedy trial was thereby waived? It seems that legal actions should speak louder than words.

What do you think???

 

[10ofRods]

If he hadn't gone home for Christmas with family, it would have looked way more suspicious.

Why?

 

[Boxer]

I think the key point in the above definition is that the person has to be fleeing to try to avoid prosecution for a crime. As others have pointed out, when BK left WA he hadn't been charged with a crime but more importantly to me, do we really think he "fled" to his parents house for Christmas break to hide? That he thought "hey, no one will think to look for me where I lived my entire life until last summer.?" I don't. And from the search warrant info, authorities investigating the case didn't think he fled to PA either.
JMO

I think he left where the crime was committed.
He is charged with that crime. If he is found guilty MOO it was fleeing, whether casually and pre-planned or in a mad dash, it had to do with avoiding prosecution.

MOO anything less than going to the police station and confessing, as would be morally right to do, is MOO avoiding prosecution.

 

[NCWatcher]

I think he left where the crime was committed.
He is charged with that crime. If he is found guilty MOO it was fleeing, whether casually and pre-planned or in a mad dash, it had to do with avoiding prosecution.

MOO anything less than going to the police station and confessing, as would be morally right to do, is MOO avoiding prosecution.

Hmmm. I don't think it's a crime not to go to the police station and confess if one commits a crime. Some might find it immoral I guess but that doesn't make it illegal.
JMO