Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #192

[mrjitty]

They've already took it higher. There were three motions raised to the Indiana Supreme Court and they rejected two, stating that JG is the right person to judge (aka state opinions and pass judgment) on the case. IMO.

They could have appealed the Franks ruling on an Interlocutory appeal i guess?

perhaps they prefer to wait for post trial appeals on that stuff.

MOO

 

[sunshineray]

The prosecution responding that the franks was “not entirely true” doesn’t mean that it’s filled with lies. My expectation is that you had some type of proof of individual items being proven to be untrue. Unless this is just a grand generic accusation based on the prosecutions statement of “not entirely true” ?

My expectation for honest filings to the court would not include things that are "not entirely true". Maybe my standards is too high for this DT? I'm thinking they are after getting a peek, just a peek, behind the DT curtain with the Due Process Gang conduct. It's been illuminating and revolting. AJMO

 

[grannygates]

They could have appealed the Franks ruling on an Interlocutory appeal i guess?

perhaps they prefer to wait for post trial appeals on that stuff.

MOO

With the consistent history of “denied without hearing”, I don’t think anyone was holding their breath that Gull would hold a hearing or care. She denied the “findings of fact and conclusions of law” as well lol. Oh well, it was a good way to make a record for future use if needed. I don’t think we’ll see a Frank5.

Or will we

 

[Salah11]

With the consistent history of “denied without hearing”, I don’t think anyone was holding their breath that Gull would hold a hearing or care. She denied the “findings of fact and conclusions of law” as well lol. Oh well, it was a good way to make a record for future use if needed. I don’t think we’ll see a Frank5.

Or will we

Well, they claim Fifth time's a charm

 

[grannygates]

My expectation for honest filings to the court would not include things that are "not entirely true". Maybe my standards is too high for this DT? I'm thinking they are after getting a peek, just a peek, behind the DT curtain with the Due Process Gang conduct. It's been illuminating and revolting. AJMO

He didn’t list any one item that was “not completely true” so we have no idea what this means. It could be something minuscule or something big, there’s literally no explaination of what that sentence means.

Is saying that geofencing in Delphi is inaccurate up to 5,000 meters not completely true? Is the state putting in a motion that the prison decided against involuntary medication not completely true?

These are just two off the top of my head that I’m able to recall in filings. I’m open if you have anything to prove your claim of untrue statements in the defense documents. It’s an allegation I see often so I would appreciate it.

I think it’s also worth mentioning that the second set of defense acknowledged in their Motion to Transfer that they reviewed the Franks and found it to have merit as well.

2024 1/12: Defense Motion to Transfer Allen

drive.google.com

 

[photographer4]

Linking the FMs , IMO, seems a waste of time since they have been ruled to be inferior and not worthy of a hearing...4 times. MO

I wonder if it may prove a bigger waste of time on her part to not concede and hear them out as I wonder if perhaps this will be grounds for a possible future appeal? If the goal is to get the right guy, then hopefully they do well enough that future appeals stand no chance and won’t drag everyone through it all again. Maybe her denials will make some sort of sense post trial when more of the facts are known? I’m just skeptical that she’s made the correct call here. I’d rather she hold the hearing(s) and resolve issues thoroughly so that the trial can go as smoothly as possible. It’s not biggie if we don’t agree on this - all water off a duck’s back to me. Probably only because I’m not on trial nor one of the loved ones of either of the kids.

 

[photographer4]

RA extinguished Libby and Abby’s lives in the most brutal way imaginable that February afternoon.

The absolute terror they felt that day should never be underestimated.

He had zero disregard for their lives that day and that shouldn’t be forgotten. He had opportunities on that walk to reflect on what he was about to do, and yet he still decided to murder two teenage girls in the most barbaric way imaginable. He also got an extra 5 years of freedom, which he didn't grant to Libby or Abby that afternoon.

I have zero sympathy for him or his plight as he is where he is because of the choices he made.

Today is another day closer to justice for Libby and Abby and their loved ones.

mooooooo

Someone certainly did these horrible things to these kids. I won’t say RA did it unless and until he’s convicted BARD. For now, he’s the accused in my mind.

 

[photographer4]

Well, they claim Fifth time's a charm

I’m sorry, who does this? I may be missing a joke about the fifth amendment or something here? Maybe I need a keg of coffee

 

[sunshineray]

He didn’t list any one item that was “not completely true” so we have no idea what this means. It could be something minuscule or something big, there’s literally no explaination of what that sentence means.

Is saying that geofencing in Delphi is inaccurate up to 5,000 meters not completely true? Is the state putting in a motion that the prison decided against involuntary medication not completely true?

These are just two off the top of my head that I’m able to recall in filings. I’m open if you have anything to prove your claim of untrue statements in the defense documents. It’s an allegation I see often so I would appreciate it.

I think it’s also worth mentioning that the second set of defense acknowledged in their Motion to Transfer that they reviewed the Franks and found it to have merit as well.

View attachment 524677

2024 1/12: Defense Motion to Transfer Allen

drive.google.com

Do you think one of the girls was hung upside down like a slaughtered deer? I know some think they were ritually sacrificed, with no substantial evidence shown to the court in the FMs. There are more such things included in those filings...ridiculous things, IMO.

Other things recently mentioned in this thread which I find just as outrageous, MO, as the FMs are BG was never on the bridge, the girls were not at home having pancakes, they were at the trails. Libby's video was manipulated somehow to RA's detriment.

GPS is more accurate than geofencing. Hopefully that will be testified to in court so the jury can be well educated on it.

All Just My Opinion

 

[sunshineray]

I’m sorry, who does this? I may be missing a joke about the fifth amendment or something here? Maybe I need a keg of coffee

I believe it's reference to a possible 5th FM being filed

 

[photographer4]

I believe it's reference to a possible 5th FM being filed

Oh! Do we really expect this??

 

[sunshineray]

I wonder if it may prove a bigger waste of time on her part to not concede and hear them out as I wonder if perhaps this will be grounds for a possible future appeal? If the goal is to get the right guy, then hopefully they do well enough that future appeals stand no chance and won’t drag everyone through it all again. Maybe her denials will make some sort of sense post trial when more of the facts are known? I’m just skeptical that she’s made the correct call here. I’d rather she hold the hearing(s) and resolve issues thoroughly so that the trial can go as smoothly as possible. It’s not biggie if we don’t agree on this - all water off a duck’s back to me. Probably only because I’m not on trial nor one of the loved ones of either of the kids.

Under the law they did not meet the criteria for a hearing. It's pretty straightforward, IMO

 

[sunshineray]

Oh! Do we really expect this??

Goodness I hope not.

 

[sunshineray]

Oh! Do we really expect this??

I'm just sooo glad that RA is getting his due process. JG is following the law. The Prosecution is ready, has been. And it's seems the Defense has been allowed to do and say just about anything they can think of to get out of a trial, so far. Now it's time to pick a jury and go to trial. AJMO

 

[grannygates]

Do you think one of the girls was hung upside down like a slaughtered deer? I know some think they were ritually sacrificed, with no substantial evidence shown to the court in the FMs. There are more such things included in those filings...ridiculous things, IMO.

Other things recently mentioned in this thread which I find just as outrageous, MO, as the FMs are BG was never on the bridge, the girls were not at home having pancakes, they were at the trails. Libby's video was manipulated somehow to RA's detriment.

GPS is more accurate than geofencing. Hopefully that will be testified to in court so the jury can be well educated on it.

All Just My Opinion

<modsnip - no link to approved source>

I was looking more for actual proof that any of the defenses filings are truly “filled with lies”, as this is a claim that continues to be repeated and I’m never able to get a clear answer from anyone of what exactly the proven lies are. Just because you cant believe it, doesn’t make it not true. Crimes happen everyday that are beyond our comprehension.

I’m able to compare documents and see discrepancies on the states half, which I’ve provided some examples, so I’m asking for the same if these accusations are going to continue. I still haven’t been provided with the line within the in-chambers meeting transcript where the defense allegedly lied either.

 

[MiniMoo]

If you want a TLDR, I think the new thing we talked about today was the letters from Holeman and Mullin, the transcript, and whether that documentation would say that they were still investigating other possible accomplices after RAs arrest. Have you had a chance to read those?

No. Not yet.
Will go back and look.

 

[FromGermany1]

Some of my thought on the catfishing account A.S. I believe LE suspect Richard Allen had a connection to A.S. account, not only because of the searches at the two homes, (KAK family and RA) also because LE states KAK was in contact with Libby. ETC

LE also stated more than one person in the KAK household was using that account.

However, to my knowledge, only KAK has been charged. No one else in his household, why, because possibly LE could not positively identify another A.S. user. No evidence to charge another.

Same with Richard Allen, LE could find no evidence to prove he was involved with A.S. account. Without evidence a person should/can't be charged with the crime.

I do think this was a CSAM crime, however lack of evidence does not mean a person is innocent of the crime, simply that the person isn't charged.

Others involved. (simply can't prove it)

I vague remember, when KAK learned of the missing/murdered girls, he was shocked and said/thought something like "that would looking very bad for himself now". The wording isn't quite right, but the meaning of the statement is tantamount, as far as I remember. (I don't know, where to find this sentence now, which KAK thought or said. Otherwise I would present a link.)

WHY did KAK have concern, the missing/murdered girls would in some form lead to him? Only because he had phone calls with Libby?? Only because he feared to be unmasked with his fake account A_S?? Or because he knew, which person he enabled to have direct contact?

There may have been a connection between A/L and KAK and in addition with the person (say: RA), who was the most responsible for things, which happened to the girls (going missing/being murdered).

We will see in October/Nov. hopefully, if KAK played a role, although now there is never any talk of him.

 

[MiniMoo]

Regarding LE checking the HHS video for time accuracy:

They did check the video at the transfer station when they were checking on RL's alibi. It's stated the video appears to be off by 26 minutes. If they checked for correct times for RL, I would hope they would do the same in RA's case.

It's in the PCA, item 17.

LOGAN WARRANT final_Redacted.pdf

et he rS de. ur M. et he rS de. ur M. et he rS de. ur M. ...

www.docdroid.net

26 minutes - which way? Behind or ahead.

 

[MiniMoo]

RA told DD according to his note that he was at the trail between 13:30-15:30 on Feb 13th. In his interview with LE RA stated he was there between 1:30 and 3:30. I believe the only other place that claims he was there from Noon to 1:30 is the Franks Memo. Is that still correct?

I never believed RL was a serious POI. Too old, too tall, and his body build was completely different to me.

The SCOIN stated in their findings that SJG was not biased. I am attaching the actual document in case anyone wants to read through it.

It's been awhile and plainly states that SJG had reasonable cause to be concerned about the actions of R&B but hit the eject button too early.

They also found she showed no bias towards them or RA, if anything she expressed genuine concern that he was receiving proper legal representation under his 6th Amendment Right. (Due Process Gang)

Adobe Acrobat

JMO

"RA told DD..."

Is a copy of that note available or a record of it anywhere.

That I haven't seen.

Does anyone by chance have it anywhere?

 

[mrjitty]

It's worth remembering about the first Franks that it essentially hangs on two key allegations. Namely that Ligget misrepresented witness statements or omitted exculpatory evidence.

Given the Judge was provided the witness statements and Liggets depo, she is able to reach her factual conclusions without a hearing. It is not as if the witnesses or ligget need to testify. The question is simply does Ligget's statement accord with the witness statements viewed side by side.

Once Judge Gull decided there was no misrepresentation or misleading as a factual question, the D failed to meet the burden for a hearing. Had she found misrepresentation/omission, then there would have to be a hearing for oral arguments as to consequences.

Some might have the idea a Franks hearing would have involved the witnesses and Ligget testifying, but i don't see it that way. Whether he misrepresented anything had to be determined by comparing the witness statement to the SW PCA IMO

MOO