Alec Baldwin fired prop gun, killing 1 on movie set, Oct 2021 #2

[Kiranerys]

When I read that the gun was fired at close proximity to Halyna, I felt chills.
It must have looked like an execution

And now we hear that producers are bankrupt!
Is it a joke?

If there weren't so many variables for what could go wrong, I might be tempted to wonder!

 

[IceIce9]

Well, armorer also claimed there were no live ammunition on the set. Yet police believe they recovered live ammunition (they have to be checked by forensics first to be officially declared live ammunition, but I am sure police know one when they see it). So either she was unware of the presence of live bullets or she wasn't telling the truth about live bullets being on the set when police asked her.

Either way she should never work as an armorer again.

 

[jjenny]

Either way she should never work as an armorer again.

Who is going to hire her as an armorer? A woman shot and killed during movie production for which you are responsible for guns doesn't look that good on a resume.

 

[GatorFL]

There are no industry standards such as you claim.

No need to get snarky. If you looked at the dialogue, @gitana1 a verified attorney here on Websleuths posted this article which referenced "Industry Standards"

EXPLAINER: Guns on movie sets: How does that work?

I don't agree that these standards are legally binding in this incident though.

 

[Kiranerys]

But, it was a single action gun. He had to *advertiser censored* it to make it fire. And, despite industry standards, he did not verify himself that it was empty. And furthermore, despite industry standards, he pointed it at someone, without a plexiglass shield in place, and pulled the trigger.

I respectfully disagree. Industry standards were not followed by others, but especially Alec Baldwin. IMO he needs to be charged with a crime.

Do we 100% know that he pointed the gun at her though,as opposed to her or anyone else moving into the path of where he was aiming?. I'm not saying he didn't or that she did, just that we don't know.

 

[Deleted member 158085]

Do we 100% know that he pointed the gun at her though,as opposed to her or anyone else moving into the path of where he was aiming?. I'm not saying he didn't or that she did, just that we don't know.

No, we do not. We actually still know very little.

 

[Satchie]

In the search warrant, it is stated that Hannah told the investigator that, after lunch, the gun was taken out of the prop truck by another person, Sarah Zachary, and handed to Hannah.

Hannah had checked the "dummies" that day, presumably before lunch, and the guns were put back into the safe on the prop truck.
Ammo was left unsecured on the cart, and ammo was also in the prop truck.

So, am I understanding that all the firearms in the prop truck were "cold" and that the ammo was inserted from the cart, or someone inserted the ammo in the gun which Zachary handed to Hannah? Or was there a hot gun in the safe (from target practice maybe) that was never emptied?

Read the search warrant: New details revealed in ‘Rust’ shooting investigation

There's been no information about where the live ammo was found by police.

I think police have to account for all the ammo: precisely where it was kept, who had access to it, in order to figure out where the live ammo that they found came from.

For example, did the Armorer have live bullets in her possession, that she mixed up with dummies and blanks?

Or was the live ammo left behind by someone who took the gun for target practice, who replaced unused live cartridges with dummies, but forgot to replace one of them.. .

 

[GatorFL]

Blanks are not the same as dummy rounds.

Hall doesn't know the difference, IMO.

 

[Gardenista]

There are no industry standards such as you claim.

Yes, there are

Firearms – Safety on the Set

 

[Speculaytor]

Halls says he looked at the gun before giving it to Baldwin. But he only saw 3 dummy rounds, and didn't check the rest. Gun with dummy rounds is a cold gun, because dummy rounds can't fire bullets and don't make noise. Blanks are different from dummy rounds. Blanks will make noise when fired and could be dangerous in close distance.

Thank you for that clarification. I did not know dummy rounds and blanks were different.

 

[GatorFL]

Do we 100% know that he pointed the gun at her though,as opposed to her or anyone else moving into the path of where he was aiming?. I'm not saying he didn't or that she did, just that we don't know.

Yes, we 100% know he pointed it at her and pulled the trigger.

How? She was shot and killed.

It's a single action revolver. It requires the person holding it to pull the trigger back to *advertiser censored* the gun, making it ready to fire. Then, that person has to pull the trigger. Bullets travel in a virtually straight line, especially at that distance. There is a lot we don't know, but we do know 100% he pointed it at her.

 

[GatorFL]

There's been no information about where the live ammo was found by police.

I think police have to account for all the ammo: precisely where it was kept, who had access to it, in order to figure out where the live ammo that they found came from.

For example, did the Armorer have live bullets in her possession, that she mixed up with dummies and blanks?

Or was the live ammo left behind by someone who took the gun for target practice, who replaced unused live cartridges with dummies, but forgot to replace one of them.. .

Plausible for sure.

 

[jjenny]

Thank you for that clarification. I did not know dummy rounds and blanks were different.

I didn't either before this. Who knew there were different kinds of "fake" ammunition used in movies-not me.

 

[RANCH]

Yes, there are

Firearms – Safety on the Set

That's a pretty comprehension set of safety standards that Warner Brothers uses. Thanks for bringing this to the thread.

Warner Brothers is not a small time studio.

In 2019, Warner Bros. Pictures Group earned $4.4 billion in worldwide receipts ($1.57 billion domestic, $2.85 billion international), marking the 10th time the Studio crossed the $4 billion mark. To date, Warner Bros. remains the only studio to cross the $1 billion mark both domestically and internationally 19 years in a row—an industry record.

WarnerBros.com | Company Overview

 

[MsMarple]

Yes, there are

Firearms – Safety on the Set

Wow. Well, numbers 2 and 5 jump right out.
2. DO NOT ENGAGE IN HORSEPLAY WITH ANY FIREARMS OR WEAPONS.

5. LIVE AMMUNITION IS NOT TO BE BROUGHT ONTO A STUDIO LOT, STAGE OR LOCATION.

Numbers 9 and 21 are also interesting:
9. Instruction in the proper and safe use of firearms is the responsibility of the PROPERTY MASTER. The PROPERTY MASTER should be qualified with the firearms, and, if not familiar with the type being used, should consult an expert. The PROPERTY MASTER shall not issue a firearm without first determining that the person who will use that firearm is knowledgeable in its use.

21. Utilize protective shields for all personnel who will be within close proximity of any blanks fired from a weapon.
Firearms – Safety on the Set

 

[shotgun09]

Many thanks to so many posters! I have learned so much about movie sets, (with inside perspectives).... and guns and ammo, and of course our legal beagles. Appreciate you all!

 

[Dotta]

In Poland a film armourer must pass a pyrotechnic exam and also a psychological test.

Police must issue a document that this person has never committed any crime.

Safety measures are rigorous.
Weapons are kept in a safe and only an armourer has the key.

This case is popular in Polish Press and I have just read an interview with a seasoned armourer.

 

[RANCH]

After reviewing the Warner Brothers set safety rules for firearms I didn't see anything that would prevent a small budget film production from complying with all 24 listed. JMO.

Firearms – Safety on the Set

 

[Luna20]

In Poland a film armourer must pass a pyrotechnic exam and also a psychological test.

Police must issue a document that this person has never committed any crime.

Safety measures are rigorous.
Weapons are kept in a safe and only an armourer has the key.

This case is popular in Polish Press and I have just read an interview with a seasoned armourer.

This makes sense and should be protocol.

 

[Luna20]

Wow. Well, numbers 2 and 5 jump right out.
2. DO NOT ENGAGE IN HORSEPLAY WITH ANY FIREARMS OR WEAPONS.

5. LIVE AMMUNITION IS NOT TO BE BROUGHT ONTO A STUDIO LOT, STAGE OR LOCATION.

Numbers 9 and 21 are also interesting:
9. Instruction in the proper and safe use of firearms is the responsibility of the PROPERTY MASTER. The PROPERTY MASTER should be qualified with the firearms, and, if not familiar with the type being used, should consult an expert. The PROPERTY MASTER shall not issue a firearm without first determining that the person who will use that firearm is knowledgeable in its use.

21. Utilize protective shields for all personnel who will be within close proximity of any blanks fired from a weapon.
Firearms – Safety on the Set

Number 5 is the key here. I understand there are other contributing factors but whoever brought ammo set everything in motion for a fatal accident. There is valid reason for not having ammo anywhere within reach.