Amanda Berry, Gina deJesus & Michelle Knight FOUND! #3

[gitana1]

For the most part I agree. 99% of the time, life in prison is worse then death. Most of these type of people have nothing to live for anyway. Many of them want to die. Thats why many of them try to get killed in a shootout with the police, rather then be apprehended.

Castro's live is already over. His own family considers him to be already dead. Executing him would accomplish nothing.

Well, when people are sentenced to death they have to sit there for decades. And death row is far worse than regular prison. In regular prison, there is the chance to get an education, work, socialize with other inmates, etc. Not so on death row. They are basically confined 23 out of 24 hours a day to their cell. It's horrible.

Well, right not Michelle doesn't appear to want to see her mother.
Why shouldn't her wishes be followed? Are you arguing she has to be forced to see her mother?

Again, are you asking me jenny? Because you are not quoting me.

I do not believe that she should be forced to see her mother and I don't know how on earth that could possibly be construed from any of my posts.

I do not hate Michelle Knights mother BK. I simply have tremendous sympathy for what Michelle has lived through, both before and after her kidnapping and most importantly, I respect her rights.

IF her mother truly has concerns about her well being and that she may be being "kept" from Michelle by third parties; her remedy is court and a guardianship process, not the press and not by further victimizing her daughter by calling her damaged in the national press.

MOO

The mother did not call Michelle damaged. And it appears she has hired counsel to do what you are suggesting. And I can tell you from experience that some lawyers a person hires do or say things they don't approve of but many people lack the resources, the wherewithal or education to hire another, get their money back or control their attorneys.

BTW, I don't like the public nature of that statement but i don;t think it is totally unwarranted. Michelle is undoubtedly damaged by what she went through and may not be totally emotionally capable of making logical decisions at all times. She will need a lot of help. And I don;t think her mom is probably the one to provide that for her.

Not to mention that BK herself has admitted there were "strains" between her and Michelle before her abduction


(There are other articles where she puts it a little stronger, but I wasn't able to find it just now)

And she took her lawyer with her to the hospital, after previous attempts to see her daughter were rebuffed.




Instead of sending her a note or a letter, and giving Michelle the opportunity to respond if she wished to, when she was ready to, she keeps trying to force herself into the situation.

And even though she is not getting to see her daughter, she is continually showing up in the press, giving interviews. Certainly if her daughter wasn't getting her messages, it is very likely she is seeing her requests on TV.

My anger is toward AC. But mom is rapidly gaining ground. At least AC is no longer a danger to her. He can no longer control her.

So if there was strain between a parent and child when a child disappeared that means the parent is evil and is trying to profit off the child's misery? I;m not following this. Lots of people have strains with their adult kids.

I didn't see that she took her lawyer with her to the hospital. I saw that she went and then that her lawyer called the hospital on her behalf. But so what if she did bring an attorney wit her?

How do you know she didn't send notes to her child? And how is she "continually" in the press? I think I have seen two interviews?

But let me say this: If MY child went missing for 11 years and I found out she was freed but I was told would not see me, you better believe I would hire an attorney and keep pressing and shout from the mountain tops that I wanted to see my child. I would not rest until I saw her with my own eyes or at least her voice with my own ears, to know she was okay and to hear from her, herself that she was not ready to see me.

Finally, she's no longer under the control of castro, huh? How can you say that? I can imagine that monster using the lack of public presence of her mother to keep tighter control of Michelle or to hurt her further: "Look, see how everyone is looking for Amanda? And for Gina? Look how their families miss them. Look how their mothers cry for them. No one cares for you. Where is your mother, Michelle? She is evil. She hates you. She abandoned you. She doesn't care."

And after 11 years that message may have sunk in, even if not true.

Michelle's case did not get the attention the other two did because she was deemed by the authorities to be a runaway. And maybe because the mother lacked an education or resources, or family support, or charm or relatability or whatever, her efforts to find her child may have been ignored as well. And here we are heaping coals on her head when we do not yet know all the facts. Just a few statements, a few media reports, strung together to paint a solidly negative picture that many are repeating with absolute certainty. My only point is that that is not fair. It's too premature, IMO.

 

[tlcya]

I don't fault her for moving because it is not like she moved weeks afterwards, it was recently, within the last few years.

Just as I don't blame Amanda's dad and aunt for being in Kentucky.

After this many years, with little or no leads, people must move on and think of their other children and family obligations.

I am bothered that for some reason LE and other organizations who had Michelle listed as missing were not informed of BK's move. That makes me sad.

I am sorry, I am not trying to be disrespectful to BK I just feel so very protective of Michelle. I suspect she has not had much of that in her life and feel she, of the three, is the one who needs it most. She is the one who lacks support and for her own personal reasons, she is apparently loath to trust her mom in that role.

I will not question her decision in that regard and completely support her right to make it.

On another note, I wonder how our other girls are doing? I am so glad they seem to have lots of family and friends to support them as the transition into a more normal setting. I think of little J and how very confused she must be by all this.

 

[Detective Klimpt]

As for Michelle's mental capacity, in my opinion, she is a very smart person. She survived 10 years of hell by learning how to behave in order to keep herself alive. She assisted in a birth without any medical training and resusitated a newborn baby. She was there on her own for a couple of years, so survived without any help. I think she's perfectly capable of making up her own mind as to who she want to see.

I don't entirely agree. I do not think she is a very smart person evidenced by the fact that she was still in junior high at 17 or so and also that she was termed mentally disabled on her missing person report. She did not survive in the house of horrors without any help. The monster fed them and kept them alive. Is Michele able to carry on from now on without any help? I don't think so. She has no skills for a job. She has no place to live. She is totally dependant on help from others for now and maybe forever. I don't know how evil the mother is or is not, but she is the only person coming foward to offer a place for Michele to go.

As for the mother's motives for coming forward, she is damnned if she does and damnned if she doesn't. Had she not come forward, she would have been ridiculed for not caring. She comes forward, and is ridiculed and accused of having unsavory motives.

 

[jjenny]

Mother isn't the only person offering a place for Michelle. Michelle is obvoiusly somewhere, I really don't think hospital just dumped her on the street.
She is an adult, she has a right to decide who she does or doesn't want to see.

 

[Elley Mae]

Knight’s brother, Freddie, reportedly visited her in the hospital Monday. He told CNN that he was kicked out of the house when he was 14, and didn’t even know his sister was missing.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...otten-victim-cleveland-s-michelle-knight.html

 

[Irisha]

They will pay neighbors to take them in, and/or rent their houses. They will wait in "cable repair" vans in disguise. They will go thru their trash. They will use telescopic lenses. Paparazzi use these tactics all the time. Police are no match for them. Police in LA can't even make paparazzi leave, unless they are parked in a no parking zone. They have a right to park on a public street. I just want to give you a sense of what to expect. Cleveland may never have seen a story like this in its own streets before. The Sowell story was big, but NOTHING like this.

I choose not to buy the National Enquirer, Star, and the rest of the trash mags. If you buy them for the trash they sell for this story you endorse it. I will watch an update on CNN or a cable news, but they rarely overstep the bounds of privacy...............EXCEPT FOR THE SCREAMER JVM....... she'll dive in a dumpster for food or a story.:floorlaugh:

 

[mysteriew]

POLICE FILE , MISSING PERSON MICHELLE KNIGHT
http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/699108-michelle-knight-missing-file.html#document/p1

Bump for those who haven't had an opportunity to read it.

 

[Pink Panther]

Bump for those who haven't had an opportunity to read it.

On the flip side of today's discussions, I found it really sad that the police were just making occasional calls (to the one residence) and nothing else. Did they try to reach other relatives, friends, etc...If they did, this does not appear on this report. Did they try to reach the mother elsewhere? What else were they doing?

moo

 

[TartLemon]

My Mother died in 1993. I went to the funeral for my Dad's benefit. Not a single tear shed yet.

If this lady does not want to see her Mother, leave her alone. It's her choice.

For many years these captives were subjected to unwanted attention. They know no other way of life. Now, the press is doing the the same thing, capitalizing on it. LEAVE THEM ALONE!

 

[WillenFan21]

Knight’s brother, Freddie, reportedly visited her in the hospital Monday. He told CNN that he was kicked out of the house when he was 14, and didn’t even know his sister was missing.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...otten-victim-cleveland-s-michelle-knight.html

WOW who in their right mind would kick their 14 year old child out of the home?

 

[kk's mom]

I have been reading here, trying to get caught up. Most of which I know already, having watched the news. I'm so happy these women were found. They have a long road ahead of them but with love and support from family, they will make it! They are alot stronger than they think. One of these days they will look back on this and realize that. I have been thinking alot about Michelle Knight lately and my heart breaks for her, as Gina and Amanda. For some reason though, I think the road to recovery is going to be alot tougher for Michelle. We all know that AC made them watch tv news and how there families were still looking for them. Amanda and Gina that is. How painful it must have been for Michelle to know no one was looking for her. And I'm sure AC threw that in her face time and time again.

I don't understand how her mother never let anyone in the family know she was missing. How could she jut pack her bags and move down to FL, knowing there was a possibility that her daughter was out there? And now she's back -- with a lawyer? What is that all about. Is it $$$ signs she sees? I don't blame Michelle for not wanting to see her mother. I wouldn't want to see her knowing she never looked for me. I would have asked her to leave my hospital room as well. Poor thing. I hope she is in a safe place and that she is receiving the love and support that she so truly deserves.

I'm so happy Amanda and Gina are with their families right now. What an awesome Mother's Day this is going to be for all of them

 

[Wendy101]

I think you are asking me. If so, its easier for me to find posts to respond to if you actually quote me.

What Court records? Please link me to court records that actually prove that Michelle's mom allowed someone to abuse her child or grandchild? Or that prove she herself was neglectful or abusive? Or didnt care and left town without ever trying to find her daughter again? Because I haven't seen those.

We don't know the full story or the situation. We don't know what really happened. We know there is a mother with a somewhat flat affect who says she never gave up hope, that she wants to see her child and we know that she hasn't and that a statement was made that Michelle isn't accepting visitors. We also know mom said there was some sort of rift between them. That's about all we really know.

I think we can afford to stop raging at this woman or accusing her of simply trying to cash in until we know more. She could have been a bad mother. Or maybe just a poor one with little hope or the emotional fortitude to get out of a bad situation. And maybe, if she had some bad moments or years as a parent, as a human, maybe she has changed. We don't know.

All I know is an evil man caused untold terror and misery for many people and I don't want to continue to let his evil have a ripple effect.

We DO have Michelle herself refusing contact with her mother. That is all that matters..IMO

 

[tlcya]

Bump for those who haven't had an opportunity to read it.

thank you mysteriew. Extremely telling. Paying attention to the dates when LE attempted to follow up and how those attempts were unsuccessful is of particular interest IMO.

Bless Michelle Knight. She is going to be in my ongoing prayers.

 

[nikb]

An interesting article on how the law works in Ihio.... And the Death Penalty.... Regarding the "how" and "why and whynot" prosecuting AC with homicide re the abortions might work.....

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/may/10/ohio-prosecutors-ariel-castro-death-penalty

This is a good article, thank you! It brings up a lot of the questions that I have had but hesitated to ask because I didn't want it to head down the road of an abortion debate (which I still don't, I know it'd be totally inappropriate here). From a legal perspective it's really interesting though, IMO. For those who've wondered about the legal side of it, that article's definitely worth reading.

 

[KaaBoom]

Well, when people are sentenced to death they have to sit there for decades. And death row is far worse than regular prison. In regular prison, there is the chance to get an education, work, socialize with other inmates, etc. Not so on death row. They are basically confined 23 out of 24 hours a day to their cell. It's horrible.

From what I have read, he is already in that situation. He is in solitary confinement, with no access to TV, news papers, or visitors. Even after he is convicted and he is transferred to a prison, I'm pretty sure he will still be put in solitary confinement, or something close to it. He will never be able to walk around the prison and socialize, for obvious reasons.

 

[mysteriew]

On the flip side of today's discussions, I found it really sad that the police were just making occasional calls (to the one residence) and nothing else. Did they try to reach other relatives, friends, etc...If they did, this does not appear on this report. Did they try to reach the mother elsewhere? What else were they doing?

moo

From the report it looks like they did reach BK at work once after they lost contact with her. They did continue to run Michelle through NCIC. Other than that not much else.

 

[KaaBoom]

On the flip side of today's discussions, I found it really sad that the police were just making occasional calls (to the one residence) and nothing else. Did they try to reach other relatives, friends, etc...If they did, this does not appear on this report. Did they try to reach the mother elsewhere? What else were they doing?

The reality is that the police have to deal with thousands of missing person reports. I'm sure they do the best they can. As some reports have said, it's really up to the family members to keep calling and bugging the police about their case. Otherwise it will just get lost in the shuffle.

 

[Elley Mae]

POLICE FILE , MISSING PERSON MICHELLE KNIGHT
http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/699108-michelle-knight-missing-file.html#document/p1

WOW there were no dentals records for Michele when she disappeared.

 

[Ladylub]

From what I have read, he is already in that situation. He is in solitary confinement, with no access to TV, news papers, or visitors. Even after he is convicted and he is transferred to a prison, I'm pretty sure he will still be put in solitary confinement, or something close to it. He will never be able to walk around the prison and socialize, for obvious reasons.

If only he would be shoved in prison with the rest of the criminals that way he can get a little taste of the life he gave to those girls. Maybe they can make a paper filing mistake and send him to the wrong spot and make it take a wk or 2 to fix.

 

[nikb]

Reading over Michele's original missing person report (that a poster here linked earlier), she has a mental disability and gets confused. Ok, that is her mom's opinion which may or may not be accurate. However, if it is, as her next of kin, her mother may have some legal rights to get some sort of custody of her. I'm concerned about Michele's future and whether she is capable of caring for herself.

In the missing person report, she is stated as being 4'7" and 160 pounds, nickname 'shorty'. Unusual.

JMO but I have to think if she cared for herself enough to survive under such horrible conditions plus delivered a baby and revived the baby with CPR techniques, she's probably pretty capable of caring for herself. She might need some additional counseling or guidance to help deal with whatever disability she may have, if she has one, but from what we know anyway it seems like she should be able to live independently when she's ready.

Just wondering, what did you find unusual about her nickname? Or was it her size/height?