Australia - 3 dead after eating wild mushrooms, Leongatha, Victoria, Aug 2023 #4

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I still think it all could very likely be accidental deaths from mistaking the mushrooms.

If so all the rest can be explained by trying to cover it up.

Yes it does sound stupid, but these days even for an accidental death people go to jail, sometimes for a long time.
And the fines when even one person dies accidentally are huge.

Then there are civil lawsuits. A person could lose everything even if it was just a terrible mistake.

And no I don't think she killed her parents, or made her ex sick.


When there is enough evidence to make me think otherwise, then I will think otherwise.

Plus people cover up accidental deaths because they don't want to lose their children, most especially if their children are very young they imagine the child will suffer without them and god forbid in the care system. So the motivation for covering up a crime is very different for a mother with children under the age of say, 16 than it would be for an average person who maybe just doesn't want to particularly be inconvenienced by consequences.

 

[Oona]

If EP had deliberately poisoned the Saturday lunch I wonder if any of her behaviour in the hours/day that followed was perceived as unusual by her children. Surely her mind would have been buzzing with the potential consequences of her actions. Would she have been nervous/curious during her visit to the hospital in case the guests had revealed anything to medical staff?
Presumably this was when the discussion about the dehydrator occurred?

 

[CityKid]

The thought came to me that maybe he has moved on...

He is currently separated from EP; no evidence of a divorce.

 

[Ellery84]

He is currently separated from EP; no evidence of a divorce.

In fairness, a lot of people start dating again whilst legally separated.

 

[Ellery84]

Plus people cover up accidental deaths because they don't want to lose their children, most especially if their children are very young they imagine the child will suffer without them and god forbid in the care system. So the motivation for covering up a crime is very different for a mother with children under the age of say, 16 than it would be for an average person who maybe just doesn't want to particularly be inconvenienced by consequences.

That’s right, because God-forbid the state gets your children.

Makes sense.

 

[CityKid]

It also says that a third guest recovered, having not eaten as much as the others.

Death Cap Mushrooms kill three - Australian food history timeline -

2012-Two people died after eating Amanita phalloides, or Death Cap Mushrooms at a New Year’s eve dinner in Canberra. Another later died.

australianfoodtimeline.com.au

"It appears Liu Jun was a fan of foraging and fresh food and used his local finds to prepare a private dinner for friends after the official New Year celebrations ended. He and one of his guests died a few days later waiting for liver transplants at the Royal Prince Alfred Hospital in Sydney. A third guest recovered, not having eaten as much of the stir-fry that contained the poisonous fungi. Another man who died in hospital at around the same time was poisoned in a separate incident"

I wonder why no one suspected the one who recovered ?

It sounds like Liu Jun had control of the mushrooms from foraging to cooking to serving. Thinking a New Year's Eve party guest showed up with what they knew to be death caps, snuck them into the dish when the cook turned away, then decided to have a small amount of the stir-fry, seems far more unlikely than the forager made a mistake.

That seems awfully suspicious. How can someone survive and not be affected as much.

These days it's totally suspicious if you're not affected as much, back then not so much.

I'm sure that if the survivor in this case went home and threw out a kitchen appliance unrelated to the mushrooms and lied about it to the police then they would have been treated with suspicion as well.

 

[Forest_Wood]

It seems curious to me why the husband would even bring up the dehydrator to begin with, in relation to his parents' being in the hospital at that time. Had he used it before himself to dry mushrooms? Why would his mind even go there? MOO.

 

[SouthAussie]

It seems curious to me why the husband would even bring up the dehydrator to begin with. Had he used it before himself to dry mushrooms? Why would his mind even go there? MOO.

I don't think Simon was the one who brought it up. Maybe he did, or maybe a question from hospital officials or someone else brought the subject up in Simon's presence.


Ms Patterson said she was at the hospital with her children "discussing the food dehydrator" when her ex-husband, the son of the dead couple, asked: "Is that what you used to poison them?"

Woman who cooked suspected poisoned meal details where she bought mushrooms

The woman who cooked a meal that is believed to have contained poisonous mushrooms and led to the deaths of three people gives a lengthy written statement to police detailing her account of what happened, and revealing she was hospitalised after the incident.

www.abc.net.au

 

[CityKid]

I can imagine a scenario where EP‘s children are wanting to live with their father and she wants to punish SP by showing him how it feels to have your family taken away. It’s pretty extreme but motivations for murder are rarely based on rational thinking.
Just pure speculation.

I agree this was more likely over child custody than marriage preservation. The fact that she threw out the dehydrator (and lied about it to police) and said she did it because she was afraid the children would be taken away from her is, MOO, very telling about what's going on in her head.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Yes it was EP discussing the hydrator with her kids at the hospital.

 

[Oona]

The two tips (rubbish dumps) close by were both open on Saturday and Sunday (according to Google). I wonder if the children were asking their mother “why did We/you have to take the dehydrator to the tip?”
It is only Erin’s word (in her statement) that she dumped it after Simon asked her if she used it to poison his parents….she may have dumped it before.

 

[CityKid]

In fairness, a lot of people start dating again whilst legally separated.

Maybe I misinterpreted another poster. They said SP wearing a wedding ring might be evidence he'd moved on, which I interpreted to mean he was married to someone new.

 

[Ellery84]

Then her ex cancelled and for some odd reason she went ahead with it?

That part puzzles me

So to my mind, let’s say she’s planned to murder her ex. Which maybe she did, maybe she didn’t…

Just hypothetically. And then he’s done something infuriating - he’s “stood her up” on the occasion of his own murder.

How rude.

So maybe she’s gone “stuff it, I’ve been planning this since Autumn, I won’t get a chance to forage for death caps until Autumn 2024, the ingredients are here - waste not want not - I’m just going to kill his relatives instead.”

Sort of like a that will teach him for standing me up type thing.

I want to stress, this is just a hypothesis. I also want to stress that Erin has yet to be charged with a crime connected to the mushroom deaths.

 

[Ellery84]

Maybe I misinterpreted another poster. They said SP wearing a wedding ring might be evidence he'd moved on, which I interpreted to mean he was married to someone new.

Oh… no I don’t think he can marry someone new, as he’s still married.

 

[Ellery84]

I agree this was more likely over child custody than marriage preservation. The fact that she threw out the dehydrator (and lied about it to police) and said she did it because she was afraid the children would be taken away from her is, MOO, very telling about what's going on in her head.

Also she could have used the dehydrator to dehydrate death cap mushrooms in Autumn and then stored them in her pantry (or fridge?) in a suitable storage container until that day, 29 July 2023.

 

[Sjöberg]

MOO, but I can see 3 possibilities and I can sense quite some gender stereotypes going on that are not supporting objective discussion.

1. It was an accident. This could have wildly different backstories, depending on the origin of the poison.
2. It was a murder, committed by EP, the motive being revenge, that could be either 2.1 stemming from something to do with the divorce and everything around it or 2.2 stemming from something to do with her mental health. I would like to point out that from everything that I've read, EP had no financial gain nor was she interested in getting back together with her ex husband, while her partner still referred to her as his wife and would have financial gain. So she has been attributed gender-typical motives that do not match the known facts here.
3. It was a murder, committed by non-EP, the motive being either 3.1 financial gain or 3.2 abuse/control/revenge towards EP or 3.3 both of the above. This could include anyone who could have gained access to her house, either before or even during the dinner (especially if they had knowledge of the kids not eating mushrooms).

Personally, I think some of them are more likely than others, but I would not rule out any of them just yet, because I do not know of any evidence that would rule any of them out.

 

[Forest_Wood]

Yes it was EP discussing the hydrator with her kids at the hospital.

Yes and it sounds like it was his thinking that the dehydrator equated to poisoning.

 

[SouthAussie]

Yes and it sounds like it was his thinking that the dehydrator equated to poisoning.

Could be something to do with his thoughts about poisoning from nightshade plants.


A source close to the family addressed the 2022 illness, telling the Herald Sun Simon thought he ingested poison “through nightshade plants”.

Mushroom mystery: 'She tried to poison me' - ex-husband's shock 2022 claim

He ended up in a coma following a mystery illness. Now more allegations have surfaced.

www.nzherald.co.nz

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Yes and it sounds like it was his thinking that the dehydrator equated to poisoning.

Sometimes people are a bit psychic when it comes to extreme situations and they have sudden clarity where the dots join together.

However, we don't have enough facts and I don't see how any woman who loved her children would dry out poisonous mushrooms and / or powder them many months ago and then store them in the kitchen where *anything* could happen that could kill her kids or household members. Unless she stored it in a lock up safe.

Also I'm not convinced she hasn't been framed for this but I can't say why as it's breach of T&C, as she remains the only named suspect.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Could be something to do with his thoughts about poisoning from nightshade plants.


A source close to the family addressed the 2022 illness, telling the Herald Sun Simon thought he ingested poison “through nightshade plants”.

Mushroom mystery: 'She tried to poison me' - ex-husband's shock 2022 claim

He ended up in a coma following a mystery illness. Now more allegations have surfaced.

www.nzherald.co.nz

I know that everyone's pretty dead set on the concept of poisonous mushrooms but what is the difference between deadly nightshade poisoning and death cap mushrooms? Since S has raised this very specific plant, why is no one suspecting the same?

Also why did he get that in his mind and not one of a thousand other plant based or other toxins / poisons?

I find that aspect very bizarre.