Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #11

[Kimster]

FYI from our Rules forum:


Social Networks

Regarding Facebook, MySpace, Twitter, and other social networking or blog websites: Links may be used to direct posters to view something on a social networking page. But postings on social networking sites are not considered fact; they are rumor. Copying and pasting, or taking screen caps, directly from these pages is not allowed. Paraphrasing is okay. (Exception: If the Twitter or Facebook post belongs to a verified news station, it may be copied. But a link should still be provided.)

Also, social networking pages may only be linked if they are directly related to a case, i.e. the victim or suspect. We don't want to post to someone's mother, brother, employer, milkman, or postal carrier just because they know the main player. We also NEVER link to minor's pages (unless they are the victim). And be sure that the page actually belongs to the person being discussed. Do not link to someone if you are not 100% sure it is the correct person. And if a social networking is set to private and you get in the back way, you may not post what you find. Private means private!

 

[bellgirl]

I have suspicions that it is not TM but someone else......but not allowed to post initials that are based purely on my own research.

Ohhh, you're killing us! Do you know if this person has a blue car?!

 

[xfiles]

x-files, no disrespect , but are you local or foreign? 'cause I am both, and everybody local calls it the Brookie Show? we don't have fairs in Oz. I was there Sat. night too, and although they may have been seen together as a family, I clearly saw them sitting apart in the stands.. MOO

Sorry Fair/Show all the same to me and I thought referring to it as Brookfield would be easier for those that aren't local to keep track. I'm across the river with Family in Brookfield and up just off Mt Crosby Road.

They may have been sitting apart in the stands but they were also sitting together in the bar area

And we do have Fair's here in Brisbane .... http://www.indigofair.org/Indigo_Fair/Home.html Although I would usually refer to them as Fetes but I remembered this one so thought I should post as reference

Oh and this .... http://www.marketsandfairs.com.au/

 

[Thinking]

Yes I think there wold definitely be incriminating information / evidence on the phone which is why the perpetrator has ensured it will never be found. Frustrating.

That said, if there were calls and messages sent between the parties that night, the police should have that info. My understanding is that they may not be able to actually retrieve the actual texts etc without having the phone. This has been discussed in detail in previous threads.

 

[xfiles]

That said, if there were calls and messages sent between the parties that night, the police should have that info. My understanding is that they may not be able to actually retrieve the actual texts etc without having the phone. This has been discussed in detail in previous threads.

Is there anyone on here that can verify on whether you can retrieve txt msg's or voice msg's from logging into itunes or something. Allison had an iphone from what I remember.

 

[Humdinger]

Good morning everybody

What I am about to post is an opinion I have come to in the last few days. These observations and thoughts are mine only, I hope that you will read them and consider them in that light.

Most of us on this website, do not personally know the main players. It is not a fairytale were there is a goodie and a baddie. It is real life and all of the characters involved, just like ourselves, have these elements pf good and bad in their personalities. What we know of these people has been formed by the media and our own feelings and we also do not know what went on in the BC marriage.

For reasons unknown, ABC stayed in a marriage were her partner was unfaithful, and seemingly unfaithful with a number women. We can speculate that Allison was self sacrificing and stayed for her children and I am sure that would have been part of it, but there are also an number of other reasons she decided to endure the public humiliation that must have gone hand in hand with being GBC wife - security, prestige, company, love etc etc. The accompanying of Gerard by his mistress to dinners etc, rings of Allison condoning the relationship and GBC actions. Similarly, GBC obviously felt no remorse when cheating on his wife, this says something I feel on his view of women.
If, as the newspapers have said, the final affair was very public and his mistress attended dinners etc with him, it seems to me that Allison in some ways condoned of the affairs. Perhaps it was easier to not "know" the truth, Allison was tied up with three young children and the life that Gerard led, may not have been what she wanted or could be part of.

Someone alluded a few threads ago that the reason Allison was in involved in "Pathways" was because of her youngest child. If this was the case then a child with special needs would put another burden on the marriage.

Regarding the face scratches, I wonder now whether they weren't cause by some rough play with the girls. I remember having a black eye from playing on the bed with mine when they were little, things can easily get out of hand with young children. I certainly don't think that they would warrant a doctor's visit, unless they became infected. No man would go to a doctor if they had been inflicted in a domestic violence situation.

I think we need to realise that there are good and bad on both sides in this tragedy. Some of the players are arrogant and self centred and perhaps the sort of people we don't like, but they are people and not tv characters.

Personally I still find the public appeal for money in very bad taste. If that needed to be done then I think it should have happened at the funeral and have come from GBC, he is the father of the girls, it is his responsibility to fund their education, the same as it was before Allison was killed. I think GBC had something to do with Allison's murder, there is no evidence, that I am aware of, that clears him. As it has been indicated that the police are looking at other people's involvement, then we can only speculate as to who they may be.

I think we should look at this case a little more realistically, and not play goodies and baddies and feel a little compassion for all involved. I am old enough to remember the Lindy Chamberlain saga, the frenzy wiped up by the media and our own prejudices against the Seventh Day Adventist church and against her as a mother and community obsession that led to evidence that was proved wrong and to Lindy's imprisonment and removal from her children. I believed she was guilty, as fanciful as the prosecution case now seems, lets not let history repeat its self.

In regards to the money, I don't find that in bad taste at all. Here are 2 parents that have just lost their daughter, they have 3 beautiful grandchildren that they love and adore and they want the best for them. They would no doubt have felt absolutely useless and needed a distraction, needed a way to feel as though they were helping, to feel like all was not lost.
At this point I'd assume that they have now been made aware of the truth of their financial situation and this was something that they knew would help their grandchildren!

Another thought is that maybe someone else suggested it and they thought it was a good idea or distraction? Maybe someone came forward with a donation for the children and they wanted to ensure that GBC could not use the money for his own legal fees or for carting another woman around town, so it made sense to set up a trust fund for the girls.

You could also look at it as they know that their father isn't going to be there to support them as he'll be in jail, so they needed to ensure the financial security of those girls.

All MOO of course.

 

[Indromum]

One of my neighbours is a police officer at Indooroopilly, and we are friendly with this person....it has taken me all my strength not to ask what the hell is going on-specially after a few drinks on a Saturday night! I am sure they are getting questioned daily by the public when out & about, but can't bring myself to do the same......

 

[Bayside]

Is there anyone on here that can verify on whether you can retrieve txt msg's or voice msg's from logging into itunes or something. Allison had an iphone from what I remember.

My husband and I have iphones through optus and when I log into our account online I can see what calls where made and when and where from.

 

[possumheart]

My husband and I have iphones through optus and when I log into our account online I can see what calls where made and when and where from.

Same here and I am with Telstra. People also use smart phones for online banking, so correlating the place and time a money transfer was made would also be useful, particularly if the user was under duress to make that transfer.

 

[Thinking]

x-files, no disrespect , but are you local or foreign? 'cause I am both, and everybody local calls it the Brookie Show? we don't have fairs in Oz. I was there Sat. night too, and although they may have been seen together as a family, I clearly saw them sitting apart in the stands.. MOO

Yes I didn't see GBC with the Dickies on sat night either, and I saw him on three different occasions, including watching the fireworks.

 

[CJ60]

One of my neighbours is a police officer at Indooroopilly, and we are friendly with this person....it has taken me all my strength not to ask what the hell is going on-specially after a few drinks on a Saturday night! I am sure they are getting questioned daily by the public when out & about, but can't bring myself to do the same......

Then I would consider you a very good friend - not putting them on the spot, and asking them about this case : )

 

[Moggill2]

Yep I feel as though something else is going to come out of this! IMO of course!

On the note of TM being distressed over her outing of the affair and 'being linked with the murder' - blah effing blah... Suck it up sunshine, YOU had an affair with a married man and now his wife is dead!!!

I'm guessing TM is cruising seek.com looking for a new job? Can't imagine that she'd be the most employable of people right about now...

I have to admit, I have no sympathy for TM. I might be sympathetic if she was 16 yrs old but she was a mature adult woman. A mature adult should fully comprehend that there are consequences for choices you make and be prepared to take responsibility for your actions. Choosing to have an affair with someone's husband has obvious far-reaching and damaging consequences on that man's wife, children and extended family.

Unfortunately for TM, life chose to deal her the worst possible hand as a consequence for her choice and her actions. Too bad, so sad.

I think the reason most people reacted the way they did when the story of the affair came out is because most were feeling out-raged that GBC was reportedly out socializing at the Brookfield Show when his wife was not even cold in her grave.....oh but wait, I forgot, she had already been cold for 10/11 days, lying discarded in a dirty creek.

I try to stay open-minded and not get too emotionally involved with this case, but the thought of Allison lying in that creek, in the cold and dark for 10/11 day, is the one thing that just haunts me.

 

[willough]

Yep Moggill.....Spot on to both you and Shelbs, I reckon

 

[xfiles]

Yes I didn't see GBC with the Dickies on sat night either, and I saw him on three different occasions, including watching the fireworks.

IMO unless you are able to verify that you monitored said persons at all times during the morning/day/afternoon/night then what is the point in refuting another persons account of events. :banghead:

 

[itsthevibe]

There has been a lot of speculation in the past 500 pages of posts about the marriage of GBC and ABC. Much of it polarises GBC as the philanderer and ABC as the saintly martyr. I think the reality is probably not quite so black and white. The impresssion I get is of a marriage that had failed some time ago and as is often the case a mum/dad/home was maintained for the children. Then the individual personalities take their own path. GBC occupied with business and the emotional crutch of some other women. ABC occupied with being a mother and pursuing her interest in psychology. The arguments about "Where were you, who was there?" probably stopped months or years ago. GBC's business world was collapsing for economic reasons and exacerbated because he had lost focus. None of this adds up to a motive for murder.

The trust fund for the children and heavily promoted by the media I think is a good idea because they are the victims of this crime and it is patently obvious that there is no money in the ABC/GBC/NBC/EBC family. I suspect promotion of the trust fund by the media was timed to take advantage of the public sympathy for the children.

Yes, but then again it could be totally different. It is not uncommon for affairs that are supposedly 'common knowledge' in workplaces or other sectors of the circles the adulterer moves in, to not be known to the partner being cheated on. Or at least, not be known for a very long time, and even then not known to the fullest extent.

This happened to me and I then found out that it seemed 'everybody' had known for years. I'm not stupid and wasn't just in denial either. It's a complicated web of lies the cheating man (I'll use a male example here as it relates to my situation and the case) uses to explain away suspicions and rumours, and to get you into thinking you are becoming paranoid if you start asking questions. My partner really 'screwed with my mind'and I ended up having counselling to deal with my 'jealousy issues'. Looking back it's hard to believe but it happened.

I can only say that these situations are more complicated than you might think - and there can be one guilty party and one innocent one. And this case is about a murder. The affairs are part of a pattern which in this case has led to a murder. Someone (or more) is guilty and someone else is not. IMO people who commit murder and severe violence against women are not just people like everyone else who made a mistake, and I don't see the affairs in isolation in this particular case.

 

[willough]

I try to stay open-minded and not get too emotionally involved with this case, but the thought of Allison lying in that creek, in the cold and dark for 10/11 day, is the one thing that just haunts me.

This is what gets me the most......People having affairs etc....(then we have people coming in judging our moral viewstance)....How quickly those people forget about the possibility of this affair, causing the above. A beautiful mum, with so much to live for, being dumped on a creek bed, like she was garbage.

No different to those stories you hear when people havent paid dowry in India....Just discard.....Got no need to keep her anymore.

But, meow, we have to feel sorry for thoe involved in the affair....blah blah blah.....POOEY!!!!

 

[marlywings]

For reasons unknown, ABC stayed in a marriage were her partner was unfaithful, and seemingly unfaithful with a number women. We can speculate that Allison was self sacrificing and stayed for her children and I am sure that would have been part of it, but there are also an number of other reasons she decided to endure the public humiliation that must have gone hand in hand with being GBC wife - security, prestige, company, love etc etc. The accompanying of Gerard by his mistress to dinners etc, rings of Allison condoning the relationship and GBC actions. Similarly, GBC obviously felt no remorse when cheating on his wife, this says something I feel on his view of women.

Interesting the way people interpret things differently.

I don't see Allison as "condoning" his affairs...what I see is a lying, cheating husband going behind her back....picking up whichever woman believed in his "I am God's gift to women" sleazy BS.

Then, no doubt, returned home & told Allison another whole load of BS as to where he'd been. When he was caught out he said he'd end the affair...he didn't....liar!!!!!

Well now he's been well & truly caught out & I hope every woman he ever picked up comes forward & tells police.

 

[loosemarbles]

The Sunday Mail was this week told police seized a third car relating to the murder of Mrs Baden-Clay.

It is understood the car was seized for mechanical examination by the Forensic Crash Unit after Mr Baden-Clay crashed it near the Indooroopilly Shopping Centre bus terminal on Sunday, April 22.

The car, a friend's vehicle, is believed to have been handed back to general duty police.


Hi there don't know somw has already posted keep up the good work

 

[Sixsence]

This is rumour, not fact. There is no supporting evidence produced on the thread: witnesses/confidants to 'obsessive' behaviour etc.
The Police investigative process will either rule in or out on this one.

Your right Fuskier it is based on rumour and not fact: Similar to the majority of the last 4 weeks of comments. If everything was based on facts the guilty would have been arrested and there would be no Websleuths.

 

[CaseClosed]

Yes, but then again it could be totally different. It is not uncommon for affairs that are supposedly 'common knowledge' in workplaces or other sectors of the circles the adulterer moves in, to not be known to the partner being cheated on. Or at least, not be known for a very long time, and even then not known to the fullest extent.

This happened to me and I then found out that it seemed 'everybody' had known for years. I'm not stupid and wasn't just in denial either. It's a complicated web of lies the cheating man (I'll use a male example here as it relates to my situation and the case) uses to explain away suspicions and rumours, and to get you into thinking you are becoming paranoid if you start asking questions. My partner really 'screwed with my mind'and I ended up having counselling to deal with my 'jealousy issues'. Looking back it's hard to believe but it happened.

I can only say that these situations are more complicated than you might think - and there can be one guilty party and one innocent one. And this case is about a murder. The affairs are part of a pattern which in this case has led to a murder. Someone (or more) is guilty and someone else is not. IMO people who commit murder and severe violence against women are not just people like everyone else who made a mistake, and I don't see the affairs in isolation in this particular case.

G'day ... popping in to check for any news. Yes, I totally agree with you (I was also the last one to know, and I had already asked some of my friends if he was having an affair .. and they denied it, but knew he was and didn't want to get involved!).

Also, in court cases, character speaks volumes to the jury. A pattern of cheating and lying will not sit well with anybody!