Australia - Warriena Wright, 26, dies in balcony fall, Surfers Paradise, Aug 2014 #4

[sleepinoz]

Evidence and proof are very different things.

evidence
ˈɛvɪd(&#601ns/
noun
noun: evidence

1. the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid.

 

[SouthAussie]

Evidence: the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid.

Proof: evidence or argument establishing a fact or the truth of a statement.


Look the same to me. :waitasec:


https://www.google.com.au/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=definition evidence
https://www.google.com.au/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=definition proof

 

[Ausgirl]

In reply to Jimmy Russell:

He has expressed his concern numerous times.

Yes, in a minimal and shallow way, while writing page after page of concern for himself.

You don't know this.

Yes, I do. Car chase. The end.

Again you don't know this. Could easily be attributed to many other factors, if true. Are you suggesting that because he has been with a lot of women that he is a sociopath?

Nope.

He has never been charged or convicted of a violent offence. His demeanour with Warriena was generally very calm and non-aggressive.

Assault on an officer.

The logical fallacy here is you have a false pretense - that he is guilty. He hasn't been to trial yet.

I can have an opinion. Mine is that he's guilty as sin.

Also, have you not read his apology letter to the NSW police? That is full of guilt and "profit from experience".

But a few weeks later.... Warriena.

An innocent person would also offer plausible rationalization.

Key word there: "plausible".

 

[Jimmy Russel]

HE WAS described by his lawyer as “partially autistic”

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...oast-for-wedding/story-fnihsrf2-1227019228229

That article was written before the bail hearing, where his barrister said he was unaware of the diagnosis.

And how does social anxiety, presumably self-medicated with alcohol use disorder, *explain* the observations of multiple bar owners and staff, who say he had a habit of drinking water all night so he could pick up the drunk chicks? Or the women who've come forward to the media, saying how charming and talkative he is? Not one has mentioned he was also drunk.

Firstly that is hearsay.

Secondly there are a number of reasons he may only drink water in bars. Drinks may be too expensive or he may have already drank at home. He lived in Surfers Paradise.

None of this is evidence that he was sober. He has been diagnosed by a professional as having an alcohol use disorder as well as charged with drink driving and other drunken offenses, so why assume he would go to bars sober?

 

[Ausgirl]

Personally, I consider driving while almost 5 times over the limit, and continuing to drive on rims after running over police spikes, a violent act. He was driving on public roads, with many innocent people sharing those roads. People that could have easily been hurt by that wild driving ... thank goodness they weren't. Doesn't make the act any less violent though imo.

Many people have been seriously hurt, even killed, during police chases. If a person wasn't fleeing the police in their vehicle, innocent bystanders and drivers wouldn't have been harmed in some/too many cases. That is why evading the police in a car chase is so highly illegal and the penalties are severe. :jail:

He also physically and verbally assaulted police officers.

 

[sleepinoz]

It was not presented by his lawyer, the article says his lawyer only became aware on the day.

Which is why the judge wanted it looked at - as I said - same point Different Words - nothing Wrong in what was said.

 

[Jimmy Russel]

evidence
ˈɛvɪd(&#601ns/
noun
noun: evidence

1. the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid.

That is different to proof.

 

[Jimmy Russel]

Which is why the judge wanted it looked at - as I said - same point Different Words - nothing Wrong in what was said.

Ausgirl said it was presented by his lawyer. It wasn't.

 

[Ausgirl]

He has been diagnosed by a professional as having an alcohol use disorder as well as charged with drink driving and other drunken offenses, so why assume he would go to bars sober?

And we must presume that he was also "diagnosed by a professional" with autism, too (unless this was just made up altogether and the court did not want documentation..) -- professionals can be suckered, by someone good at suckering people. Case in point.

He clearly has alcohol issues. But how in control of it is he, if he can spend a night in a bar drinking water.

 

[sleepinoz]

That is different to proof.

No it's not

 

[sleepinoz]

Ausgirl said it was presented by his lawyer. It wasn't.

No she didn't - She said it should be looked at by his lawyer.

 

[sleepinoz]

It isn't.

It is

 

[Ausgirl]

How can one diagnose someone they have never met with a mental disorder?

One can't. But one CAN speculate.

In MY OPINION he has displayed ALL of the above-linked attributes of a sociopath, in his behaviour and words. You might not agree. That's fine too.

 

[Jimmy Russel]

No she didn't - She said it should be looked at by his lawyer.

She said it was made by his lawyer. Different case, different lawyer.

 

[SouthAussie]

One can't. But one CAN speculate.

In MY OPINION he has displayed ALL of the above-linked attributes of a sociopath, in his behaviour and words. You might not agree. That's fine too.

I think a lot of people agree with you Ausgirl. Here and on other social media sites that I have seen. There are big concerns about Tostee's behaviour in many places. And for good reason imo.

 

[sleepinoz]

She said it was made by his lawyer. Different case, different lawyer.

Quote Originally Posted by Ausgirl View Post
I see the point you're trying to make -- but let me fill you in on a couple things:

Wayyyy back before we had any of this information - maybe in thread #1?? -- GoddessIsisRising, our *verified* psychologist, expressed a lot of doubt about reports re the autism thing, due to the way it was worded when presented to the court by his lawyer ("partially autistic"). IE, she said the terms were NOT proper diagnostic terms, and thought perhaps it was bogus.

Turns out, the autism thing wasn't mentioned by his parents at all in the brief for this case. Which, if valid, it really ought to have been. Maybe that's why the judge got a bit suss and wanted this claim -- made by his lawyer - looked at.

Wrong - both cases were mentioned in that post - This case the judge wanted the claim "mentioned by his lawyer" looked at. You already said his lawyer mentioned it because he only just heard about it that day, so he did mention it.

 

[enzeder]

Reading this. Thinking: check. check. check.



Sociopath Traits

According to ICD-10 criteria, presence of 3 or more of the following qualifies for the diagnosis of antisocial personality disorder (~sociopathy):

Callous unconcern for the feelings of others.
Gross and persistent attitude of irresponsibility and disregard for social norms, and obligations.
Incapacity to maintain enduring relationships, though having no difficulty in establishing them.
Very low tolerance to frustration, a low threshold for discharge of aggression, including violence.
Incapacity to experience guilt or to profit from experience, particularly punishment.
Markedly prone to blame others or to offer plausible rationalization for the behavior that has brought the person into conflict with society.

http://www.md-health.com/Sociopath-Traits.html


Also: http://www.mcafee.cc/Bin/sb.html

BBM

"Reading this. Thinking: check. check. check." :yes:

 

[Ausgirl]

I think a lot of people agree with you Ausgirl. Here and on other social media sites that I have seen. There are big concerns about Tostee's behaviour in many places. And for good reason imo.

Thanks, SA. I'm not really concerned with how many people agree with me, but I am obviously not the only one thinking that way. I do think the concern is justified, imo you're spot on, there.

 

[enzeder]

I think a lot of people agree with you Ausgirl. Here and on other social media sites that I have seen. There are big concerns about Tostee's behaviour in many places. And for good reason imo.

BBM

ITA SouthAussie!

"Police opposed the application, arguing Mr Tostee posed an unacceptable risk to the community and that his behaviour was unpredictable."

http://www.smh.com.au/it-pro/gable-tostee-granted-bail-but-banned-from-tinder-20141119-11po6s.html

 

[marlywings]

Reading this. Thinking: check. check. check.



Sociopath Traits

According to ICD-10 criteria, presence of 3 or more of the following qualifies for the diagnosis of antisocial personality disorder (~sociopathy):

Callous unconcern for the feelings of others.
Gross and persistent attitude of irresponsibility and disregard for social norms, and obligations.
Incapacity to maintain enduring relationships, though having no difficulty in establishing them.
Very low tolerance to frustration, a low threshold for discharge of aggression, including violence.
Incapacity to experience guilt or to profit from experience, particularly punishment.
Markedly prone to blame others or to offer plausible rationalization for the behavior that has brought the person into conflict with society.

http://www.md-health.com/Sociopath-Traits.html


Also: http://www.mcafee.cc/Bin/sb.html

Well, in my opinion, he is most definitely no stranger to the law! Our prisons are full of crims who started committing crimes when young and progressively worsened over time. Majority of them show zero respect/complete disregard for the law and society's rules. They all use the same tired old cliché...."it's everyone elses fault not mine"

Decent law abiding citizens don't attempt counterfeiting, they don't make fake ID's, they don't assault police and they sure don't get themselves involved in leading police on high speed pursuits.

And they sure as heck aren't handed a murder charge . Police don't hand those types of charges out on a whim when they're fully aware of the amount of evidence that's required to post such a charge.