Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sep 2014 - #67
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Thank you!
Depending upon interpretation... this could be 4 or FIVE vehicles.. thoughts?
From the link above:
“We’re also interested in… a report of a four-wheel-drive leaving Benaroon Drive around the time William disappeared.
Det. Insp. Jubelin said police had also received information about a four-wheel-drive seen speeding in the vicinity of Benaroon Drive shortly after William’s disappearance.
ETA: Is this 4WD in the second sentence referring to yet a different 4WD than in the first sentence above?
Is the second sentence referring to the vehicle Ronald Chapman says he saw with a Spiderman boy in the back? If so, then why no mention of the blue car following that vehicle?
I also found this article, which makes it seem like the vehicle in question is indeed the same vehicle (in both sentences above). If that vehicle is the one Ron Chapman said he saw, then have we ever heard that THAT vehicle exited Benaroon before driving down Chapman's street?
Detectives have also released details about two other cars seen in the area on the morning William wandered around the side of his grandmother's home and disappeared.
One vehicle is a green or grey sedan that drove past the Benaroon Drive house about 9am while William and his sister were riding bikes in the driveway.
Det Insp Jubelin said the car drove into the quiet cul-de-sac, did a u-turn in the neighbour's driveway and drove out of the street.
The second sighting was of a four-wheel-drive driving out of Benaroon Drive about 10.30am - when William vanished - and was later seen speeding down another Kendall street.
William Tyrrell detectives hunt for drivers 12 months after disappearance
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In regards to 4wd leaving Benaroon, it might have been HS. I don't know what she was driving. It would be interesting to know who reported this car. The other car speeding through Kendall could well be the vehicle RC has reported witnessing. The green or grey sedan, turning in the cul-de-sac is I believe the teal car. How grey/green becomes teal, I don't know. And then we have the mystery white station wagon and the grey sedan, parked together on Benaroon drive. I think that is 5 cars. Although not reported til later, I have wondered if the teal car FFC saw, was also the irridescent blue car that RC saw that followed behind the 4w drive.
The white station wagon and the grey car bug me no end. No one confirms the station wagon on Benaroon dr. on the 12/9/14 besides the FFC, who is not a local. PS says it has been parked on previous days, AMS was definite she did not see it the day WT went missing. It was parked on the border of her property. Neither AMS nor PS were pressed at the inquest nor gave further information about who they thought the car belonged to. Both the white station wagon and the grey car , were publicised almost a year after WT's disappearance and neatly tied in with publically named POIs not long after they were made public, TJ and PB. Nothing seemed to come of that. A WB member reported on here that there was a white station wagon sitting in the same spot as reported when she visited Kendall and a similar vehicle was captured in a real estate campaign., a couple of years after the disappearance. I think police know who the white station wagon belongs to and have used that information for strategic reasons for their investigation. Doesn't mean they know who belongs to the grey sedan parked in front of it.
If someone was a smart criminal, they could look for a car to park close to, to look as if they belonged together. I don't know what to make of the sightings of the cars by the FFC on the day WT went missing, I'm in 2 minds. Did she see the 1st 2 cars or did someone in the intervening days before returning from the airport tell her about 2 cars they saw and it may have created a false memory for her. Did she see a grey/green car turn in the cul-de-sac with dark tinted windows , give it a fleeting glance and not see the driver, only to remember the actual colour, make and the description of the driver which resembles DP, or was she told this information about a POI and then altered her memory, unconsciously, accordingly? I would have been interested to see her reaction to DP's testimony at the inquest. All MOO.
bearbear
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there is/was also aerial footage of a white station wagon and possibly a grey car parked inside someones property, just along the road, i saw it using six maps or google and wondered maybe they were moved out while the property owner mowed the lawns?
seems unusual ffc would know which cars were foreign to the street though as she lived in sydney and hadnt visited for awhile
SLouTh
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I believe she had a maroon / burgundy coloured sedan, ??? Commodore.... I also believe she didn't take the White Pajero that day.....
IMO
Yes!! To my knowledge that has never been revealed ???? Unless possibly at the Inquest??
I would also like to know who owned the 4WD parked at FGM's house the day before, (Thursday), that was seen by PS??
It is possible that car was there, as GO stated that he thought he spoke to a "Daughter in Law" that day as well......
I am not implying in any way that I think the 4WD belonged to the Fosters. But I do wonder if FGM had a visitor on the Thursday?? Who may, or may not, have known the Fosters were coming to stay for the weekend??
As 2 separate witnesses have indicated there may have been some one else besides FGM at the house that day.
All IMO
SLouTh
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I thought that very early reports had this 4WD as being grey in colour??? But subsequently, it was described as white??
So that adds another car into the mix....?
Reference: Grey Isuzu Ute with canopy (CCTV - mentioned in Podcast 1 of Where is William Tyrrell)
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SouthAussie
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I don't think there is any reason AMS would have noticed any cars, early in the morning, and uphill from her house. Unless she was looking exactly in that direction for some reason, at the specific times.
Tyrrell carer believes abductors were there for both children
Google Maps
I wonder what FD said in his statement (and/or as a response to whether or not he saw the cars as he was leaving).
Seems to me that the only people who might have been able to readily notice the cars during their movements that morning are FD, FM, and potentially PS on his way home from his walk.
And perhaps the people who lived at the very top of Benaroon Drive, across the road (obviously not the ones who were away), if they left their house that morning.
imo
AMS had driven the kids to school that morning and returned, so there was a good chance of her seeing the cars upon leaving and entering her driveway, assuming she checks both directions when leaving her home. She was definite in her response that those cars were not there when giving evidence at the inquest. There was also an opportunity for JW or her spouse to see the cars when leaving her driveway around 9-9.30 that morning. I don't think MFC noticed any cars there either but I have no link. MOO
Yes, quite a few neighbours have sold up and moved since WT disappeared.
SouthAussie
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Yes, we have never heard much about FD's statements ... other than his walkthrough. And the times of his movements, which were then verified.
Cars can be pretty 'invisible'. Did I pass (or see) any parked cars on my street when I drove to my DD's place (and back) this morning? I am going to say no. Am I positive? No, who can be?
It is such a normal place for me to drive that I doubt I properly notice everything any more.
When we studied Google Earth satellite images from various different dates, way back in the threads, we saw cars parked here or there on the street at Benaroon Drive.
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I agree, so when I heard AMS be so definitive in her response at the inquest, "those cars were not there", it really made me sit up and pay attention. Hers is the only evidence that I know of that absolutely refutes what the FFC says about the cars and places the MFC back at Benaroon drive and searching for WT, before anyone from outside the 48 household was approached to help search that morning. The contradiction in her testimony to FFC, FGM and MFC's evidence is very interesting to me. IMO
SouthAussie
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So, how does that stand with Ronald Chapman's 'absolutely positive' sighting of the speeding Land Cruiser with the spiderman-suited boy in the back in that critical time period?
What I am saying is that there is much 'positive' testimony here. It can't all be right.
So that leaves questions about pretty much everyone's memory recall. imo
And it makes it really hard to sort the wheat from the chaff.
SLouTh
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Hi Bear,
I think I may worked out how this discrepancy of thinking occurred???
From The Inquest:
FM states:
“With William missing it went right out of my mind,” she told the court.
“But six days later, I just had this flash that there were two cars.
and this
Foster Mother stated in 60 Minutes doco she drove to the airport on the night of William's disappearance.
And this
"She spoke of two unidentified cars she spotted parked across the road from her mother’s house on the morning of his disappearance, which she did not recall until several days later."
And then in published sources, we have the trip documented on Sunday Afternoon:
So which is correct?? Time Line Discrepancy ??? Or bad reporting? Both??
National - 10 News First - Network Ten
William Tyrrell’s inquest: Family tears in court as inquest starts in Sydney | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site
National - 10 News First - Network Ten
SLouTh
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Another ODD thing about the TEA from the Inquest......
Craddock's introduction:
The time was “close to 10.30am. William was playing a game pretending to be a daddy tiger.
“William was ducking to the northeast corner of the house and then rushing out and roaring at the ladies,” he said.
“They were drinking tea.”
The foster grandmother had “thought William was being very boisterous and loud”, but the foster mother had replied “he’s a boy, that’s just how they are”.
Minutes later, the foster mother “had just finished her tea and … she noticed it had “become quiet, too quiet”.
“There had been one loud roar and then nothing,” Mr Craddock said.
Then Craddock goes to great lengths to ask about the tea ......???
The cups couldn't possibly be still warm to touch, on Rowley's arrival, if FM had finished her tea????IMO
William Tyrrell’s inquest: Family tears in court as inquest starts in Sydney | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site
Craddock's introduction:
The time was “close to 10.30am. William was playing a game pretending to be a daddy tiger.
“William was ducking to the northeast corner of the house and then rushing out and roaring at the ladies,” he said.
“They were drinking tea.”
The foster grandmother had “thought William was being very boisterous and loud”, but the foster mother had replied “he’s a boy, that’s just how they are”.
Minutes later, the foster mother “had just finished her tea and … she noticed it had “become quiet, too quiet”.
“There had been one loud roar and then nothing,” Mr Craddock said.
Then Craddock goes to great lengths to ask about the tea ......???
The cups couldn't possibly be still warm to touch, on Rowley's arrival, if FM had finished her tea????IMO
William Tyrrell’s inquest: Family tears in court as inquest starts in Sydney | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site
SouthAussie
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Does it say somewhere that it was Rowley who determined that the tea was 'not too cold to drink'?
Or is this FM's/FGM's description from a statement? (Perhaps from trying to determine exactly how long William had been gone?)
I might have missed it. I do remember Rowley had some testimony. And I am not finding the 'tea' connection when I google. Just finding other testimony of Rowley.
In his opening address, Mr Craddock, told the court William had disappeared while the foster mother and Nanna were drinking tea that was still warm or “not too cold to drink”.
He remarked there were different ways of making or pouring tea and asked the foster mother what was hers or her mother’s preferred way.
Inside the divided inquest into the three-year-old’s disappearance
katydid23
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There are so many possibilities with those kinds of details.
For example, maybe FM 'finished' sipping her tea, and noticed it was too quiet and walked off to investigate?
And FGM may have refilled her cup for her, assuming she was to return? And if she did, that tea would have been warmer as it was still in the pot, or she may have even refilled the tea pot with more hot water first?
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SLouTh
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I think it's exactly this!!
And that is what the relationship to the tea is all about!!!
SouthAussie
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So who said it? Rowley or FM/FGM?
I have only ever seen Craddock repeat it, that I can remember.
Is it from Rowley's statement, and/or FM's statement, and/or FGM's statement?
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