Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sept 2014 - #23

[purpleandgreen]

Hmmm. I wonder if LE find it interesting when sometimes it appears that one 'doth protest too much'.

 

[SouthAussie]

Who, amongst the POIs of whom we know 'publicly', and those of whom are not known 'publicly'; would come under the perview of the SCC's Robbery and Serious Crimes, Sex Crimes, and Fraud and Cybercrimes Squads?

http://www.police.nsw.gov.au/about_us/structure/operations_command/state_crime_command




Very specifically referred to in (now DCI!) Gary Jubelin's presser. It might bear thinking over a little IMO.

I notice that the 3 named squads all fall under the category of 'Serious Crime Directorate'. Looking at the squads in this Directorate, I imagine that many crimes overlap between the squads.
Eg, sex crimes and cyber crimes may frequently overlap.

None of them fall under the category of 'Organised Crime Directorate'.

Just wanted to mention this as I noticed some posters questioning a possible organised crime aspect earlier.


http://www.police.nsw.gov.au/about_us/structure/operations_command/state_crime_command

 

[richieswan]

Sorry if repeated. During questions at the presser:

"There is a very very good chance we know who the offender is, or at least have an understanding where this investigation is heading."

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10154088829661185&id=218519706184

 

[SouthAussie]

I can see how there would be so many people of interest. If he's alive, he's more than likely been moved around a lot. And the type of people that would conceal an abduction are probably up to their eyes in other crimes. So we have Rosann 2.

BBM: I saw a great post this week by one of our members who is a criminologist.
They said that POIs can include a huge range of people ... the postman, any neighbours, a childcare worker, a bus driver .... on and on ... anyone who could possibly have come in contact with the victim in any way. Many of them innocent unrelated people. Then they knock them off the list, slowly, one by one, some knocked off quickly, some not so quick.

I wish I could remember where I saw the post.

(Makara, I think you 'thanked' the post and replied to it, do you remember where it is?)

 

[richieswan]

16:30
"The person responsible for abducting William will now have to look at the people they've confided in and think well there's a million reasons why they might betray you. So the pressue is on."

That's some heavy words of warning. If you know who did this they might shut you up before you dob them in!!! So hurry the FU.

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10154088829661185&id=218519706184

 

[Eloise]

POI really just means person that can potentially provide information in an investigation. It doesn't necessarily mean a potential suspect, though it often does.

 

[Makara]

I notice that the 3 named squads all fall under the category of 'Serious Crime Directorate'.

None of them fall under the category of 'Organised Crime Directorate'.

Just wanted to mention this as I noticed some posters questioning any possible organised crime aspect earlier.


http://www.police.nsw.gov.au/about_us/structure/operations_command/state_crime_command

Thanks SA, that is exactly right. And simply because some of these specialised squads have been named, it doesn't necessarily mean that they are investigating crimes related to that particular squad. Investigators are hand picked for a specific strike force from the various crime squads within the State Crime Command. Their unique investigative skills play an important part in the strike force investigation but it is not the specific squad that is investigating. I hope that makes sense.

In essence it is not the whole of the Robbery and Serious Crimes, Sex Crimes, and Fraud and Cybercrimes Squads that are involved. Specific members from each squad have been hand picked to work with the new Strike Force Rosann2 because of the unique investigative skills that they can bring to the table.

Serious Crime Directorate

Fraud and Cybercrime Squad
The Fraud Squad leads and drives the NSW Police Force response to Fraud, Computer Crime, Assets Confiscation and Identity Crime. This is achieved through the development of strategic policy, intelligence products, best practice and provision of specialist investigative services across this crime spectrum.

Homicide Squad
The Homicide Squad leads and drives the NSW Police Force response to homicide and Coronial investigations at all levels. This is achieved through the development of tactical intelligence products, policy advice and the provision of good practice and specialist investigative service.

Child Abuse Squad
The Child Abuse Squad is comprised of detectives who are specially trained to investigate crimes against children, including sexual assault, physical abuse and serious cases of neglect. The squad works in partnership with the Department of Family and Community Services and NSW Health, with specialised tri-agency teams based at metropolitan and regional locations throughout NSW.

Property Crime Squad
The Property Crime Squad leads and drives the NSW Police response to motor vehicle theft/re-birthing, arson (structural fires and bushfires) and property crime, including major breaking offences on commercial warehouses and distribution centres and the receivers of the property subject of those offences. This is done through the development and implementation of strategy, policy, intelligence products, best practice and provision of specialist investigative services across the three crime disciplines.

Robbery & Serious Crime Squad
The Robbery & Serious Crime Squad charter focuses upon the crime disciplines of: Armed Robbery, Product Contamination, Extortion, and Kidnap for Ransom.

Sex Crimes Squad
The Sex Crimes Squad was established to ensure provision of a specialist sexual assault response to support Local Area Commands across NSW.

It is acknowledged that the roles and functions of this Squad are closely aligned with JIRS. As such, this will entail a close and ongoing working relationship between the two Squads.

UBM.

 

[Morrisa]

16:30
"The person responsible for abducting William will now have to look at the people they've confided in and think well there's a million reasons why they might betray you. So the pressue is on."

That's some heavy words of warning. If you know who did this they might shut you up before you dob them in!!! So hurry the FU.

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10154088829661185&id=218519706184

Commissioner Scipione also says at the end "We are all looking forward to the recovery of young William"

 

[JLZ]

BBM: I saw a great post this week by one of our members who is a criminologist.
They said that POIs can include a huge range of people ... the postman, any neighbours, a childcare worker, a bus driver .... on and on ... anyone who could possibly have come in contact with the victim in any way. Many of them innocent unrelated people. Then they knock them off the list, slowly, one by one, some knocked off quickly, some not so quick.

I wish I could remember where I saw the post.

(Makara, I think you 'thanked' the post and replied to it, do you remember where it is?)

I think it was post #800 on this thread by The Dark Shadow. I don't know how to link it.

 

[Makara]

BBM: I saw a great post this week by one of our members who is a criminologist.
They said that POIs can include a huge range of people ... the postman, any neighbours, a childcare worker, a bus driver .... on and on ... anyone who could possibly have come in contact with the victim in any way. Many of them innocent unrelated people. Then they knock them off the list, slowly, one by one, some knocked off quickly, some not so quick.

I wish I could remember where I saw the post.

(Makara, I think you 'thanked' the post and replied to it, do you remember where it is?)

Yes SA, it was The Dark Shadow. I'll find the post, give me a minute.

 

[Makara]

The Dark Shadow's post that you referred to SouthAussie.

Sorry, a little OT from where the thread is drifting right now (I am consistently catching up, lol), but I just wanted to say that the 'Hundreds of POIs' would almost definitely still include some residents from Benaroon Dr and surrounding areas, as well as regular visitors to the street (i.e., postal workers, utility meter readers, possibly council workers, door-to-door sales people e.t.c.).

Those with watertight alibis would have been excluded already, but those without will remain as POIs until they are cleared (or arrested). Some of these POIs would be secondary (wrong place, wrong time, insufficient alibi); whereas some would be primary (people within the area who have no alibi, historical charges and perhaps some circumstantial evidence showing that it's possible they were capable of taking William at the time, or evidence pointing to later involvement). Out of the hundreds of POIs, most of them are likely secondary POIs and investigations would be concentrated on the few primary POIs.

I'd say the POIs we have heard about in the media are the majority of primary POIs, but there's no doubt a couple of leads we haven't heard about (yet). so when we hear about hundreds of POIs, the majority of these would be completely innocent citizens living close by, who just haven't been completely excluded yet.

Frogwell, in regards to what you have said about BS being targeted by the media, it would be truly tragic if he was completely innocent and being targeted in this manner, but if he hasn't been cleared yet, it is either because:
1) His alibi/s haven't checked out and nothing else has indicated he isn't involved, or...
2) He has not been cleared due to police strategies because they want somebody else to believe he is being monitored.
Now, police definitely do use strategies when needed, but (like every Govt. department) they have a budget, so it's extremely unlikely they would use a strategy that could later result in a huge compensation claim for defamation etc. One could argue that maybe BS is cooperating with a strategy, but if that was the case, you'd think he would negotiate a deal on his historic charges. This clearly hasn't happened or there would be a conclusion (guilty plea) to those.

Also IMO, there's no chance that LE have just simply forgotten to clear him publicly yet. If you were innocent and named a POI in the same manner, what lengths would you go to, to clear your name? You certainly wouldn't let LE just forget about you, would you? Regardless, if he is innocent of all accusations, justice will prevail and he will be compensated eventually.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Makara]

Sorry if repeated. During questions at the presser:

"There is a very very good chance we know who the offender is, or at least have an understanding where this investigation is heading."

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10154088829661185&id=218519706184

Yeah, I love that bit.

 

[SouthAussie]

Thanks Makara and JLZ. That's the one! Great post.

 

[Makara]

Thanks Makara and JLZ. That's the one! Great post.

It certainly is.

 

[ozazure]

I wonder if the fraud squad could be involved in finding documentation that leads to William. If you had lived all you life off benefits and had the care of a small child you might go to some lengths to create an identity for them. This article talks about unregistered births in WA - it is not an uncommon occurance. I know some people who failed to register their kid for ages. There must be a steady trickle of kids appearing in the data banks outside the usual time frame.

Here are the NSW guidelines for registering a birth after the mandated 60 days. (although William could be anywhere, this is one possibility).

It is not that stringent. How much would the BDM check into the authenticity of some of the following:

• Medicare Card
• Pre-school or school report
• Medical Certificate from family doctor showing full name and date of birth
• Health Insurance Commission Immunisation Certificate
• Centrelink Letter (if child's full name is shown).

So you front up to a pre-school or school with another child's documentation and get them a history going. Use someone else's medicare card to get the doctor information. Or just take the Immunisation cert to the BDM of another child.

I had to get a letter from my child's principal (doesn't know her from a bar of soap, she had just started at a highschool and there's over a thousand kids) to open her a bank account. The lady at auspost didn't verify that document by checking with the school it was legitimate, I could have typed it up myself. The primary school school reports are printed on a laser printer, I could mock one of them up at home without much fuss - the high school ones arrive electronically, no stress at all to doctor one of them for a new identity.

 

[ozazure]

To add - remember Keli Lane and how long the documentation took to catch up with her? This could happen in reverse for William.

 

[bearbear]

[h=2]Police investigation largest in state[/h]inspector Jubelin said the investigation was the largest in the state with 2,800 reports to Crime Stoppers, a further 196 reports of information direct to the taskforce and 1,078 possible sightings reported.The taskforce has identified 690 persons of interest and Inspector Jubelin said the net was being cast very wide.
"As I stand here and speak we are working on covert operations at this particular time," he said.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-09-...ion-dollar-reward-for-william-tyrrell/7834782

 

[Wexford]

Thanks SA, that is exactly right. And simply because some of these specialised squads have been named, it doesn't necessarily mean that they are investigating crimes related to that particular squad. Investigators are hand picked for a specific strike force from the various crime squads within the State Crime Command. Their unique investigative skills play an important part in the strike force investigation but it is not the specific squad that is investigating. I hope that makes sense.

In essence it is not the whole of the Robbery and Serious Crimes, Sex Crimes, and Fraud and Cybercrimes Squads that are involved. Specific members from each squad have been hand picked to work with the new Strike Force Rosann2 because of the unique investigative skills that they can bring to the table.

Serious Crime Directorate

Fraud and Cybercrime Squad
The Fraud Squad leads and drives the NSW Police Force response to Fraud, Computer Crime, Assets Confiscation and Identity Crime. This is achieved through the development of strategic policy, intelligence products, best practice and provision of specialist investigative services across this crime spectrum.

Homicide Squad
The Homicide Squad leads and drives the NSW Police Force response to homicide and Coronial investigations at all levels. This is achieved through the development of tactical intelligence products, policy advice and the provision of good practice and specialist investigative service.

Child Abuse Squad
The Child Abuse Squad is comprised of detectives who are specially trained to investigate crimes against children, including sexual assault, physical abuse and serious cases of neglect. The squad works in partnership with the Department of Family and Community Services and NSW Health, with specialised tri-agency teams based at metropolitan and regional locations throughout NSW.

Property Crime Squad
The Property Crime Squad leads and drives the NSW Police response to motor vehicle theft/re-birthing, arson (structural fires and bushfires) and property crime, including major breaking offences on commercial warehouses and distribution centres and the receivers of the property subject of those offences. This is done through the development and implementation of strategy, policy, intelligence products, best practice and provision of specialist investigative services across the three crime disciplines.

Robbery & Serious Crime Squad
The Robbery & Serious Crime Squad charter focuses upon the crime disciplines of: Armed Robbery, Product Contamination, Extortion, and Kidnap for Ransom.

Sex Crimes Squad
The Sex Crimes Squad was established to ensure provision of a specialist sexual assault response to support Local Area Commands across NSW.

It is acknowledged that the roles and functions of this Squad are closely aligned with JIRS. As such, this will entail a close and ongoing working relationship between the two Squads.

UBM.

Gangs?

 

[Freddo Frog]

Detective Chief Inspector Gary Jubelin said anyone who has information into William's location and has not come forward fearing they may have broken the law concealing a crime that this offence would be "negated the moment you come to police."

Yes it is interest.
Location of where William is being hidden or location of where he .....?

I also thought the comment from Jubelin was interesting. If you have any concerns about the way a child has come into a family.

Yes, I thought that comment was interesting as well.

'How we target each POI varies .... some have been very public' - Jubelin

'It is covert, it is overt, there are all different ways'

I wonder if he's hinting that there is someone they've let fly under our radar to allow them to feel a false sense of security.

"Reward ... arrest, conviction and we have added another part ... return of William" - Gary Jubelin

It's difficult to speculate because we don't know what the police know. IMO it seems that the police are trying to play one off against another with the offer of the reward. GJ said that if the abductor has confided in anyone, he/she would be getting very worried now. He also stated that there are covert operations in place and this could mean that phones and cars are now being tapped in the likelihood that people start to talk, or more importantly told not to talk.

Jubelin also said 'overt' as well as covert so I wonder if the heat is being put on someone such as being blatantly watched as they go about their daily movements, or little buzzings in their ears as they go about their daily business? But who... MS? NC? Hmmm...

Now I've got that song from Beverly Hills Cop going through my head

 

[Sillybilly]

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