Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #50

[mussopossum]

It's funny/interesting how people find fault with POIs and suspects' reactions no matter *what* their reactions are. If they're angry, they've got anger management issues; if they're cool and composed, they're slimy and untrustworthy; if they're emotional and crying, it's fake and alligator tears. To me, that is why it is terrible to name POIs in MSM and to air dirty laundry in public of an innocent person, at least until they become an 'accused'


Spot on
Look at that actor who got accused of rape.
John Garret I think it was.
People's lives are destroyed with a trial by media and are left to try to pick up the pieces.
It's not right.
No names,nothing until they're in court

It certainly can do damage and especially to someone who is not guilty.

IMO the naming of POI most likely for police would be operational reasons, to put pressure on them as well as once it is out there potential witnesses may come forward with information or dealings or suspicions of that person that would help move the investigation along or allow for warrants based on any information obtained from tips to crime stoppers police etc.

As you said, it can ruin a lot of lives and cause a lot of heartache to the POI as well as the families of the POI.

 

[mussopossum]

Me thinks this is just PS rambling. . In frustration & everything else.
I do believe he would’ve felt his property invaded. he was bugged, he was visited, he was interrogated ..

IMO .

I wonder if he "did" know or had a suspicion the place was bugged if he talked to himself deliberately in the house and said some things intentionally just to p*ss off the LE. Would make matters worse for himself obviously doing that however from what we have seen so far he really is quite a complex case in his actions.

 

[they'll get you]

No. 52 sold July 2019.
I missed that.

If someone were to know that house was empty that day then it would have been a perfect place to watch the little verandah.
Imho that’s not where William was taken but still a great vantage point to see the little verandah, carport, kitchen, living area.

52 Benaroon Drive, Kendall NSW 2439

 

[Wexford]

How was PS to know the postie was going to visit with FGM in two days time?
Was his nose getting rubbed into it and the two ‘untouchable women’ meeting and gossiping next door. I’m getting vibes FGM was a trouble maker as well and not really liked.

Dammit who’d live in Kendall?

Perhaps that was her birthday and she was calling in to celebrate? If they were good friends or perhaps related that might be a common occurrence?

 

[SLouTh]

Where are we up to ?? With the trial being extended into next week ...

I think there were 8 witnesses to be called

These are who we have heard from :
Beacroft
Gallyot
Savage
Dukes
Batchelor
Douiehi

So possibly 2 more to go?? Plus ?Jubes and ”Closing Arguments” .., (I do hope we get to hear a lot of what Cunneen says....)

Have I missed anyone???

Scott Cook
Mick Willing
For the Crown.

Then the Defence will commence.

Does any one have a list of the defence witnesses???

And is there a formal list of witnesses for the prosecution ? E.g. are Cook and Willing definites??

 

[stormbird]

Thank you Stormbird. Yes, I was curious about when she was interviewed. Obviously, FFM & the police would have spoken to her on the day, but if she was on the deck she would not have seen much. The poor little mite deserves all the privacy she can get.

BBM
Even from the deck she might have seen something or heard something. IMO (generally speaking) children are more likely than adults to be aware of their surroundings and paying attention to what's going on. Adults tend to be preoccupied and not paying attention (... or maybe that's just me).

 

[sleepinoz]

Does any one have a list of the defence witnesses???

And is there a formal list of witnesses for the prosecution ? E.g. are Cook and Willing definites??

Cook and Willing are definate, unless the Crown changes their mind to call them. Cunneen only received their statements late on Wednesday. The Crown were admonished for the late information.

No, no Defence witness list has been released afaik.
@LiaJHarris
·
Feb 6
Replying to
@LiaJHarris
Margaret Cunneen tells the court the defence plans to call two former commanders of the NSW Homicide Squad to testify, who supervised Jubelin during the investigation. Those two people can only be now Assistant Commisissioner Mick Willing and current Homicide boss Supt Scott Cook

 

[stormbird]

Police made secret recordings of William Tyrrell person of interest Paul Savage speaking to dead wife

<bbm>

IF PS in fact said this, what opinions do members have on what this could be related to?

I thought he was referring to Mr Jubelin. To me it sounds like something said in anger, as a put-down, as something an older man might say to a younger man because the older man wants to assert dominance in some way and the first thing that occurs to him is that he's older. It wouldn't be much of a put-down to say to an actual little boy, William, that "you're just a little boy".

Also, if I was trying to describe Mr Jubes quickly I'd call him a "city boy": city boots, tailored shirts, shiny head with no hat on it.

Here's the tweet by Lia Harris which gives a bit more of the quote:
"Cunneen has just read aloud part of a recording from the bug in Savage's house, where he was allegedly talking to himself saying 'I'm not interested in your bulls** mate. You're just a little boy, you're nobody'." (@LiaJHarris 06 Feb 2020)

<modsnip>

 

[sleepinoz]

For those members that think PS was referring to GJ when he was speaking about the 'little boy' - what do you think he meant when he said the following:


@LiaJHarris
·
Feb 6
The court heard he was also overheard saying “I’m gonna run into your property too in Gordon. This is my place.” The court heard Gordon is the suburb where William’s foster grandmother would get off the train when she came to Sydney to visit her foster grandchildren.

 

[sosocurious]

For those members that think PS was referring to GJ when he was speaking about the 'little boy' - what do you think he meant when he said the following:


@LiaJHarris
·
Feb 6
The court heard he was also overheard saying “I’m gonna run into your property too in Gordon. This is my place.” The court heard Gordon is the suburb where William’s foster grandmother would get off the train when she came to Sydney to visit her foster grandchildren.

How would PS have known that fgm got off the train at Gordon?
Maybe with all the muffle and static in the recording he did not say in Gordon. Maybe in PS mind he was talking to a Gordon, be he real or imagined.

Jmo - trying to think outside the box.

 

[deugirtni]

The old timers would remember sleuthing the area under where the side verandah is, the land falls away and there’s an area there to hide.
A perfect place for an old nosey neighbour to lay in hiding listening to what the women were saying.

View attachment 230632

Then around came William.

Apparently the postie was due to visit FGM two days before this happened. It doesn't say whether or not she did, nor whether or not PS knew about it, as far as I can see from the article?

If an old 70 year old nosey neighbour was laying in hiding, my guess is he wouldn't have been able to get up too swiftly, let alone catch up with a running 3 year old who was reportedly full of beans that morning.. and even if and when he did, what would he do then? Grab him, and carry him under his arm with his hand over his mouth to his own home where his wife was trying to set off to bingo? (According to what we've been told, HS left at 10:38, but FD got home at 10:35 and by then he had already disappeared. So seems HS left after W had already been taken, and surely not by her own husband. Where would he have taken him and have no evidence for the K9s to show for it?)

edits: correct typos

 

[stormbird]

For those members that think PS was referring to GJ when he was speaking about the 'little boy' - what do you think he meant when he said the following:


@LiaJHarris
·
Feb 6
The court heard he was also overheard saying “I’m gonna run into your property too in Gordon. This is my place.” The court heard Gordon is the suburb where William’s foster grandmother would get off the train when she came to Sydney to visit her foster grandchildren.

If that's what PS did say, it's certainly odd, and I wouldn't have a clue what he meant. I'd be wondering:

(a) How would PS know which railway station FGM used? If he knew that much about her, why wouldn't he also know the name of William's suburb?
(b) As far as I can recall, the only time that Gordon was mentioned previously in the case was in relation to the birth parents absconding with William as a baby - reportedly they were found living in Gordon. (Sydney Morning Herald, 28 March 2019) It seems unlikely that PS would know that, but who knows.
(c) Maybe Mr Jubes's suburb has a name that sounds like Gordon?
(d) Maybe PS was talking to or about someone called Gordon?

 

[CathyNSW]

"Where would he have taken him and have no evidence for the K9s to show for it?)"

This is what is bugging me, tbh. According to the police dogs, William never went out of the yard. So, he could not have been accidentally run over somewhere else. He would have to have been carried out of the yard to "somewhere"
Or taken by car from within the perimeter of the FGM's house.

 

[Chrissy74]

iirc FFC said William roared around the side of the house once or twice.
Who was he roaring at?
The person who took him.

That’s a really good point you make.. who was he really playing peek a boo with!!
if someone was hiding in that area mentioned and out of sight from mum n grandma gaining Williams trust would be priority so as not to alert anyone.. what better way to do that with a 3yo than play a lil game.. is that area close to the kitchen?

 

[KateM]

thanks for your closing *** D ... all good, and I do agree with your comments. We’re all so ready to ‘judge’ on the basis of someone’s reaction - however, we must give credence to fact of ‘individuality’, which covers the whole ‘being’.

As an Aussie, I immediately think of Lindy Chamberlain & how her demeanour was the catalyst to her being found guilty .. IMO.

It’s playing out again in judgement of William’s Bio & Foster families. .. it’s so sad & so wrong ... but we want answers & we search & search .... we don’t want to be mean or disrespectful but we want to find this little boy & we need to turn over every stone & examine it carefully ... ... this IMO was what was behind the examination of PS (& BS) and it’s a bit sad & disturbing IMO that those people didn’t embrace & join forces, rather than sue.. just my thoughts. .. also that it’s all a pretty crap situation..

I pray for William & his family. There’s power in the collective

I don't think people have judged the bio family on their demeanours. They have shown the emotion and reactions one would expect from the parents of a missing child.

 

[mussopossum]

For those members that think PS was referring to GJ when he was speaking about the 'little boy' - what do you think he meant when he said the following:


@LiaJHarris
·
Feb 6
The court heard he was also overheard saying “I’m gonna run into your property too in Gordon. This is my place.” The court heard Gordon is the suburb where William’s foster grandmother would get off the train when she came to Sydney to visit her foster grandchildren.

After re-reading your post I have to wonder if Jubes might reside in Gordon or the surroundings of?.

It does actually come across he is venting in anger at his house being intruded upon and that he is stating "how would you like it if I just barged into your house and invaded your privacy for no reason? This is my house.

Just my thoughts

 

[Chrissy74]

That’s a really good point you make.. who was he really playing peek a boo with!!
if someone was hiding in that area mentioned and out of sight from mum n grandma gaining Williams trust would be priority so as not to alert anyone.. what better way to do that with a 3yo than play a lil game.. is that area close to the kitchen?

Just to add to that has it been confirmed by grandma that when savage supposedly went over for a brief chat after everyone’s was on the alert William was missing that grandma told savage fm went inside to make a tea a and the lil one disappeared.. this recall from savage only came to light for the first time at the last inquest

 

[mussopossum]

If that's what PS did say, it's certainly odd, and I wouldn't have a clue what he meant. I'd be wondering:

(a) How would PS know which railway station FGM used? If he knew that much about her, why wouldn't he also know the name of William's suburb?
(b) As far as I can recall, the only time that Gordon was mentioned previously in the case was in relation to the birth parents absconding with William as a baby - reportedly they were found living in Gordon. (Sydney Morning Herald, 28 March 2019) It seems unlikely that PS would know that, but who knows.
(c) Maybe Mr Jubes's suburb has a name that sounds like Gordon?
(d) Maybe PS was talking to or about someone called Gordon?

Maybe in the past when (and IF) PS and Williams FF were on better terms conversation may have been had as to where the FGM goes to visit when she visits William. Just a possibility,

 

[KateM]

Just to add to that has it been confirmed by grandma that when savage supposedly went over for a brief chat after everyone’s was on the alert William was missing that grandma told savage fm went inside to make a tea a and the lil one disappeared.. this recall from savage only came to light for the first time at the last inquest

The media reported in the early days after the disappearance, that the FM had gone in to make a cup of tea when William went missing. So who did they get that story from?

 

[stormyseas]

Police made secret recordings of William Tyrrell person of interest Paul Savage speaking to dead wife

<bbm>

IF PS in fact said this, what opinions do members have on what this could be related to?

It seems far more likely to me that PS was referring to William.. especially when the missing child is the focus of any conversations he had with Jubelin. It almost sounds like an attempt to minimise the importance of William in his own mind.. to help him feel better, whether he was involved or not. Although, an attempt to minimise the relevance of a child does raise questions in my mind. IMO