Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #54

[Chrissy74]

IF, then both licences certainly? Car and boat?

Possibly. Conflicting reports from witnesses saying he was driven around (testimony from MP) , he couldn’t drive (testimony from Sil of RP) , FA came to my antique business in a white Ute (testimony from Ms Anderson I think or whatever owned the antique shop). So who really knows. I think you could be right though that he lost his license and if he was driving then it must have been illegally

 

[Chrissy74]

Deleted

 

[mussopossum]

IF, then both licences certainly? Car and boat?

I think if you lose your car licence you cant drive a boat as well from memory? Im a bit vague on this. It has been knowledge that Abbott walked a lot to places. To me it seems that he might not have had a licence for a very long time. I wonder if maybe he had a disability that prevented him from driving. Such as blackouts r that sleep disorder? Just looking for other possibilities

 

[mussopossum]

most definitely. I’m not sure about PS TJ but there are many pictures on the internet that connect FA RP MP possibly GO to Kendall Men’s Club and Herons Creek Heritage Trail and Community group. And these pictures go back some years too. Instagram and FB and even google are good avenues to explore

Thanks for that info will have a looksie tonight

 

[mussopossum]

Possibly. Conflicting reports from witnesses saying he was driven around (testimony from MP) , he couldn’t drive (testimony from Sil of RP) , FA came to my antique business in a white Ute (testimony from Ms Anderson I think or whatever owned the antique shop). So who really knows. I think you could be right though that he lost his license and if he was driving then it must have been illegally

Considering his disrespect for the law and the crimes he has been convicted of, one would think FA would not care about breaking the law and driving if disqualified.

He didn't care about going to jail either. Id really love to know the reason he couldnt drive. As I mentioned in my post earlier, when he worked on the properties my mum managed he never drove the many miles (was a fair hike over 50km) he always got there on foot hitching on the highway. That was 12 years back. Before little William.

 

[deugirtni]

It is possible that FA's finances were such that he simply did not own a vehicle. IIRC he was staying in a trailer parked on someone's property, and I believe it was in exchange for doing some work to it.. which I believe GO said he was not impressed with.. so perhaps FA did not have the money to pay for not only 'rent', but also a vehicle, vehicle insurance, etc., while he still may have held a valid license.. (or not)... this seems to be one of those things that we really don't know?

 

[Chrissy74]

It is possible that FA's finances were such that he simply did not own a vehicle. IIRC he was staying in a trailer parked on someone's property, and I believe it was in exchange for doing some work to it.. which I believe GO said he was not impressed with.. so perhaps FA did not have the money to pay for not only 'rent', but also a vehicle, vehicle insurance, etc., while he still may have held a valid license.. (or not)... this seems to be one of those things that we really don't know?

Highly possible. FA couldn’t afford to pay for legal representation or bail in his last case/conviction and MP claims he asked the church for somewhere for Abbott to live so he obviously had very few dollars and whatever he made from his odd jobs here and there I’m sure went on his gambling habit and whatever else habit so he may very well have had a license just not a vehicle

 

[Wexford]

I think if you lose your car licence you cant drive a boat as well from memory? Im a bit vague on this. It has been knowledge that Abbott walked a lot to places. To me it seems that he might not have had a licence for a very long time. I wonder if maybe he had a disability that prevented him from driving. Such as blackouts r that sleep disorder? Just looking for other possibilities

Firstly depends on the speed of the boat. You do not need a boat licence for less than 10 knots. Also, if your boat and car licence are not linked up on Service NSW some have said if they lose their driver's licence it did not affect their boat licence. I don't know if this is strictly true. Mine are linked but I requested that when I set myself up on Service NSW but perhaps if one was at a different address and you did not request them linked it could be possible. Either way it is quite rare to get your boat licence checked. Pretty sure there are a lot of people driving boats that should not be.

 

[deugirtni]

Highly possible. FA couldn’t afford to pay for legal representation or bail in his last case/conviction and MP claims he asked the church for somewhere for Abbott to live so he obviously had very few dollars and whatever he made from his odd jobs here and there I’m sure went on his gambling habit and whatever else habit so he may very well have had a license just not a vehicle

Did FA have a gambling habit?

 

[Tinker Taylor]

Did FA have a gambling habit?

You would expect that a single person on unemployment benefits that also works part time (more than likely for cash) should be able to afford rent (would qualify for rental assistance) and at least a basic vehicle.

So you would have to wonder why he was so destitute he had to rely on charity. Some kind of addiction is probably the answer.

 

[mussopossum]

Firstly depends on the speed of the boat. You do not need a boat licence for less than 10 knots. Also, if your boat and car licence are not linked up on Service NSW some have said if they lose their driver's licence it did not affect their boat licence. I don't know if this is strictly true. Mine are linked but I requested that when I set myself up on Service NSW but perhaps if one was at a different address and you did not request them linked it could be possible. Either way it is quite rare to get your boat licence checked. Pretty sure there are a lot of people driving boats that should not be.

I think that you are correct Wex.

I know the water police in Sydney do many many RBT sessions on the harbour. So being police officers doing the RBT on boats and not cars, I wonder if the police officer also asks for a drivers licence for ID as well? If they got stung for speeding or being UI as a captain of the boat would police penalise the licence there as well for driving or suspend it? Even if not linked online?

 

[mussopossum]

It is possible that FA's finances were such that he simply did not own a vehicle. IIRC he was staying in a trailer parked on someone's property, and I believe it was in exchange for doing some work to it.. which I believe GO said he was not impressed with.. so perhaps FA did not have the money to pay for not only 'rent', but also a vehicle, vehicle insurance, etc., while he still may have held a valid license.. (or not)... this seems to be one of those things that we really don't know?

He sounds like the type of bloke who would just borrow a car off someone if he needed one. IMO, he seemed to like to walk and get everywhere by foot. Why is anyone's guess? I hope we do find out the reason though. So many people illegally drive without a licence who have no respect for the law.

He had little respect for many a thing and no fear of going to jail. I do find it odd he did not drive.

 

[Chrissy74]

Did FA have a gambling habit?

Yes I did read that somewhere at some point

 

[Wexford]

I think that you are correct Wex.

I know the water police in Sydney do many many RBT sessions on the harbour. So being police officers doing the RBT on boats and not cars, I wonder if the police officer also asks for a drivers licence for ID as well? If they got stung for speeding or being UI as a captain of the boat would police penalise the licence there as well for driving or suspend it? Even if not linked online?

Yes on Sydney Harbour, water police, MSB and I think even Customs do checks but I doubt they would ask for your driver's licence. You can hold a boat licence without a drivers licence. Kids can get a boat licence at 12 although it does not become a full boat licence until they turn 16. Regional waters of course have less checks. Areas where there is water-skiing and wakeboarding probably do attract more checks but not enough IMO. I have never been asked for my boat licence and have driven boats in regional waters for about 30 years.

 

[katydid23]

Totally makes sense FG.

And if RC did indeed see William in that car with the woman driving followed by the other vehicle who nearly lost control on the corner:

We have two vehicles (initial abduction woman with bun followed by man in car behind her)

Frank Abbott

Ray Porter.

Police have mostly and previously maintained that William was opportunistic in the early days.

When you take into account the above possibilities and it becomes more like a targeted abduction. (people on call ready to meet and move)

So how wuld they know he was there?

Could TJ and FA have been scrap metal collecting at the time close by?

If there were not two cars that RC saw (or it wasn't William) It still may have been an opportunistic abduction and FA got lucky when his mate was available to drive him on call.

The inquest has left us with many more answers yet so many more unanswered questions.

But if it was targeted, how would they know, or imagine, that they would find the boy ALL ALONE, outside, and be able to grab him?

Were they planning to just sit outside in their car, waiting to see if that happened?

 

[mussopossum]

But if it was targeted, how would they know, or imagine, that they would find the boy ALL ALONE, outside, and be able to grab him?

Were they planning to just sit outside in their car, waiting to see if that happened?

That is the million-dollar question.

And why?

 

[katydid23]

maybe bad reporting? the report says child and the person who heard it says infant, so i guess different interpretations, plus a terrified 3 year old could possible sound like an nfant?

If I needed to 'hide' a 3 yr old child, I might consider drugging them a bit to keep them docile, and maybe wrap them in a blanket and hold them close, like one might do with a baby.

 

[interested64]

That is the million-dollar question.

And why?

I think GO told FA from fgm mentioning it or his previous day ph call, ? was he smart enough to think an out of town child would be presumed missing in the bush?..my main Q now are did the staion wagon FA was said to be driving have hub caps and who had the grey car

 

[Georgy]

The court heard one of Jones’ neighbours was Frank Abbott’s son-in-law, but Jones told the court they didn’t know each other back then, later crossing paths in jail. Abbott is also a person of interest in the case.

..so this means Mickey blue eyes met TJ in prison..i wonder what he was in for

Thats worded really badly...it was Jones in jail with Abbott..there is a link but not sure where to find it..

 

[mussopossum]

Thats worded really badly...it was Jones in jail with Abbott..there is a link but not sure where to find it..

The more I think of a link between FA, TJ and RD I feel utterly sad, thinking what might have happened to William.

I hope that whoever has sat on any information for so long can live with themselves.