CA - 13 victims, ages 2 to 29, shackled in home by parents, Perris, 15 Jan 2018 #9

[Corina]

I want to record that for me one of the haunting things, of so many in this miserable crime, is LT's request that her little girl look at her and smile when asking for food.

Control; and confusion and denial of feelings for the child.

Horrible.

[Back to catching up the last few pages.]

 

[Zelda1010]

When did they create a "school" at their address? Prior to that, don't some homeschooling systems include monthly instruction or classes or testing via the district? Could it be they did that prior to creating their own school and further isolating them? Or did they have the kids wear "uniforms" and backpacks again to create the veneer or normalcy?

I think the private schools registered to their addresses didn't start until CA. Could be as simple as CA homeschooling possibly requiring it.

I definitely think they could have isolated themselves within a community of like-minded folks in TX. If I were part of that community I would want to distance myself from this. Especially if I still subscribe to what I believe to be better and different but similar parenting practices, or suffer abuse in my own home.

 

[SkipperKey3]

Lol, I will too. coz I am going to look.....

Yes, you will find them. Bonnie Jean maroon plaid dresses.

 

[SATA]

It must be this one.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Bonnie-Jea...618529?hash=item4d5b8f9621:g:iFMAAOSw-0xYP3vo

Imagine making 20+ and almost 30 year old women wear those kid clothes.

 

[rsd1200]

Lots of people do that when going to places like that. Scout groups do that with tee shirts. All of my grandchildren have field trip teeshirts diff color for each class. My kids were same in school. JMHO it is just easily to keep your group together. IIRC DT mother said they did it for safety reasons. That one parent would be at front and the other at back of group. This was a large group and just as groups go, it is understandable to me. We do this with our small brood 1/4 size of this one.

And I don't find it odd all dressing alike in group photos. What is strange to me is the wearing the same clothing various years. All of them, parents included.

BBM
I see it often too. A friend's Mom even hand sewed their matching clothing, for Sunday go-to-meetin', and other outings, when they were children. They were like stair-steps.

It's even possible that the Ts got the clothing on sale, so got a couple more pieces than they needed, and handed them down through the years. In other words they'd not actually be wearing the exact same shirts and pants. Note how far the cuffs were rolled up on the one photo. They likely could wear those a couple years. Having shorter statured, but not large-boned, children, mine could wear the same clothing for 2-3 years, only I did a bit better with rolling the cuffs... It doesn't appear that the parents were at the top of the fashion charts themselves, either.

Also, when mine were young. I had play clothes for them, and they stripped out of their good clothes, and into the play clothes. Mine were dressed appropriately, and not unlike their peers, but I made good use of big sales at the nearest mall, yard sales, and consignment stores. Brand new, properly fitted, sneaks, were an absolute must though. Nothing worse than an ill-fitting pair of shoes. Although I don't see anything really all that odd about the female children in the heels. It was probably the first time they'd had reason to wear them. I can remember myself, and other young girls, receiving our first pair (mine included). We walked much the same. I rarely have reason to wear them now, so if I decide to do so, I have to walk around and get comfortable in them again. When I wore them regularly I could run in them babies!

 

[rsd1200]

I know zero about companies such as Lockheed.

My son is an engineer in a multistate engineering firm.

They have parties and activities . We have had my son bring coworkers to our house for bbq that we had on Sundays for all of the family and friends if they wished.

There are activities,sponsored by the company. No one is super rich, but emoloyees have decent salaries so they have decent homes, I guess, Who knows after reading about the T’s.

Anyway, I wonder how they fit into the employee social scene. They liked to live in nice homes. Were they invited to parties? Did they join company events? Or was their life only with the family?

My Father's place of employment had a big outing to an amusement park each year. They took the grandkids with them. It is a thing with big employers, or, at least it used to be.

 

[mtnlites]

I doubt Louise cooked. I don't think she new how. The children were probably given just enough to stay alive with only one meal a day. The pies that they tortured the kids with leaving on the counter, I am sure were store bought. There were Vienna Sausage cans all over the house. I don't any fruits or vegetables or grains. What do you think they were given for their one meal?

Satch

I have no idea because I haven't seen pictures of inside their cabinets or refrigerators, but probably something microwavable or frozen, like a frozen pizza. Or perhaps something like instant noodles. Maybe even pre-packaged items like breakfast bars, Pop Tarts, etc. I imagine it was something that took little effort and was cheap enough to buy for 13.

 

[human]

The go to food Ramen Noodles. I will keep the comments to myself.

 

[SkipperKey3]

I think the two taller girls have bags, maybe. I definitely think I see a pink strap on the left shoulder of the girl to our right of LT. On closer inspection, I see just one strap, could be diaper bag duty. I also think maybe amongst the long hair of the girl in front of the graduate might be some hidden black backpack straps, but nothing definitely.

Hope this doesn't cause chaos.:shame::gaah:

Hard to tell for certain, but when I saw the pink strap I assumed it was a diaper/baby bag.

 

[SkipperKey3]

My Father's place of employment had a big outing to an amusement park each year. They took the grandkids with them. It is a thing with big employers, or, at least it used to be.

Agreed, which is why I suggested it might by a "company sponsored" event that they took advantage of. Just a possibility.

 

[blue22]

When did they create a "school" at their address? Prior to that, don't some homeschooling systems include monthly instruction or classes or testing via the district? Could it be they did that prior to creating their own school and further isolating them? Or did they have the kids wear "uniforms" and backpacks again to create the veneer or normalcy?

When they moved to California. Registering as a private school is one of the ways you can file to homeschool in California. The other ways would have potentially more involvement from outside people. (Which is why I think they went that route.) The options in California:

File an affidavit to function as a private school.
Enroll in a private school satellite homeschool program.
Have home instruction provided by a certified tutor.
Enroll in an independent study program at home using homeschool curricula.


JMO... I don't believe they were creating a school and I don't think they were wearing backpacks or uniforms. They were just doing what they had to be "legit" as far as the state is concerned. I don't think the were actually schooling them.

ETA: In Texas there is no oversight whatsoever in homeschooling. The district they were zoned for wouldn't have required any testing or instruction.

 

[Satch]

Maybe hoarding the children like possessions is accurate. But do LT and DT ever have a point where they realize that they're not going to allow the eldest children have a 'normal' pathway to adulthood, getting a job, leaving home, developing their own lives? I don't get the sense they were preparing the siblings for that, but that might have been coincidental and not by design, at least for the older siblings. With the story of LT leaving home and her father's attitude to that, I wonder if she felt that she wouldn't let her children go as easily, that she would fight harder to keep them? And somehow, seeing the siblings more as possessions, maybe she ended up finding that she couldn't let them go...that would mean breaking up her dream, it would feel like she was being abandoned. Feeling that way doesn't preclude the control (to the point of cruelty) aspect over the siblings, I think it works well with it.

Once Louise couldn't love the cuteness of infants and toddlers, the children became "things." Yes, slaves to do as she and David demanded. You begin to wonder if Louise, David, or both of them were tied up and chained as kids? In other words, was that the only form of discipline that they knew? Beatings and torture? One of the sisters of Louise claimed that over twenty years ago, David and Louise picked her up at the airport and were "glad to see them." The home was very clean and well-kept. I am not so sure that I believe that. But even if that is true we would be like at a 1998 time frame.

Aren't there two sisters in Louise's family? Maybe more. I heard that another sister said that Louise always was the way she was. Assume this to mean controlling and manipulative. Louise and David built their religious beliefs on what they valued from multiple religions, even discarding things in each faith that they didn't like. The world was meant only for them. And David is rumored to say to her, when he abducted her at sixteen from high school and the drove to Texas to elope. "I can give you everything you ever wanted." Conceited little manipulative Louise, even as a teen, found her Prince Charming, who, as it turned out, fed off of each other and had the same delusional beliefs of what life represents. Everything evolved and revolved around David and Louise only. How to raise a family, and have no interference from the outside world who isn't family. They would believe outsiders are satanists anyway looking to destroy their dreams of a controlling, robotic, family, who will do what we want, when we want.

Was the girl who tried to escape before who asked about getting a driver's license and a job, the same one who called 9-1-1? I think the first escape was back when the Turpin's lived in Texas. Than within a week or so, they moved to California. I think that is when the ropes turned to chains and padlocks. It could be that neither the parents or children knew what proper discipline was. Grounding, Spanking, Time-Outs, and revoking of privileges. Tragically, maybe the only form of abuse the children knew were beatings and torture.

Satch

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

As far as society in general goes, and maintaining our American principles per te US constitution, it is imperative that everyone accused of a
crome be afforded a zealous defense.

But when I look at their ugly mugs and the innocent faces of their long suffering kids, I don't care. I'm less interested in American principles of due process and more interested in revenge. Not too logical, I know.

In any event, I went through their charges and any significant time will hinge on whether the torture charges stick.

Abuse of a dependent adult = up to four years state prison (as charged).

Child abuse/neglect = 1-6 years as charged.

False imprisonment = 16 months to 3 years as charged.

Torture = up to life imprisonment.

We absolutely need to the torture charge to stick. Otherwise, I do not see justice coming close to occurring.

So for that we need that the motive is extrotion, persuasion or sadistic pleasure.

Putting pies out of their reach but where they can see them would be a great way to prove sadistic pleasure. That's evidence. Even without clear statements indicating they were taunting them. Anything, like "Don't you dare touch this pie." Should be enough, IMO.

My wavering and worry comes from the cultural, historical sentiment that children are our property and we can do with them what we want.

There is also a historical, cultural attitude that harsh discipline of children is necessary.

Read the comments' sections of any article that has anythin remotely to do with kids committing crimes, talking back, being rude, or anything to do with any crimes and you will see countless comments about how "If that was me I wouldn't be alive to tell the tale." "When I was a kid I would have feared my parent more than the teacher" (who abused the child in the article in some way).

"We need to bring back corporal punishment. These people weren't disciplined as children. That's what caused them to kill. My parents used thebelt on me and I turned out fine."

Over and over you see these comments.

Put the two together and I'm worried a jury would find an excuse to give these people less time.

But the national outrage over this case gives me hope. Like even for those who believe kids should be harshly punished, this went over the line. I hope so.

They destroyed the lives of these kids. Some will never recover or reach the potential they could have due to intense isolation, abuse, control, etc.

To me justice would be spending the rest of their lives in prison.

Could the sentences be imposed consecutively? Times 13, that would add up.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[Satch]

When they moved to California. Registering as a private school is one of the ways you can file to homeschool in California. The other ways would have potentially more involvement from outside people. (Which is why I think they went that route.) The options in California:

File an affidavit to function as a private school.
Enroll in a private school satellite homeschool program.
Have home instruction provided by a certified tutor.
Enroll in an independent study program at home using homeschool curricula.


JMO... I don't believe they were creating a school and I don't think they were wearing backpacks or uniforms. They were just doing what they had to be "legit" as far as the state is concerned. I don't think the were actually schooling them.

ETA: In Texas there is no oversight whatsoever in homeschooling. The district they were zoned for wouldn't have required any testing or instruction.

School was only the values what David and Louise believed forced into their children's heads. The oldest son goiing to Community College and pulling straight A's. Shocked, considering his home life that he got an A in Public Speaking! Oh, would we give anything to hear what he talked about! But, probably not home life too much. I'm sure that Louise and David went over every assignment with him for something like Public Speaking and he was told what he could and couldn't say. Remember, she was outside the door in every one of his classes.

Satch

 

[Zelda1010]

Could the sentences be imposed consecutively? Times 13, that would add up.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

May be time for a precedence setting case if it is possible, just not usually done.

 

[Amonet]

May be time for a precedence setting case if it is possible, just not usually done.

It's OT really but I don't understand the logic of concurrent sentencing.

I also think in this type of case that subjecting one child or 13 is hideous and deserves a very extended stay in prison. 30-50 years x 13 kids, okay, but if it was 15 years for 13 kids and only 3 years for one kid, that doesn't sound right.

 

[rsd1200]

The go to food Ramen Noodles. I will keep the comments to myself.

It's a son's go-to. He can make a gourmet meal out of a couple packs. Me? No thanks. I've no jokes about the contents re; Ramen's. I just hate them.

 

[SkipperKey3]

Once Louise couldn't love the cuteness of infants and toddlers, the children became "things." Yes, slaves to do as she and David demanded. You begin to wonder if Louise, David, or both of them were tied up and chained as kids? In other words, was that the only form of discipline that they knew? Beatings and torture? One of the sisters of Louise claimed that over twenty years ago, David and Louise picked her up at the airport and were "glad to see them." The home was very clean and well-kept. I am not so sure that I believe that. But even if that is true we would be like at a 1998 time frame.

Aren't there two sisters in Louise's family? Maybe more. I heard that another sister said that Louise always was the way she was. Assume this to mean controlling and manipulative. Louise and David built their religious beliefs on what they valued from multiple religions, even discarding things in each faith that they didn't like. The world was meant only for them. And David is rumored to say to her, when he abducted her at sixteen from high school and the drove to Texas to elope. "I can give you everything you ever wanted." Conceited little manipulative Louise, even as a teen, found her Prince Charming, who, as it turned out, fed off of each other and had the same delusional beliefs of what life represents. Everything evolved and revolved around David and Louise only. How to raise a family, and have no interference from the outside world who isn't family. They would believe outsiders are satanists anyway looking to destroy their dreams of a controlling, robotic, family, who will do what we want, when we want.

Was the girl who tried to escape before who asked about getting a driver's license and a job, the same one who called 9-1-1? I think the first escape was back when the Turpin's lived in Texas. Than within a week or so, they moved to California. I think that is when the ropes turned to chains and padlocks. It could be that neither the parents or children knew what proper discipline was. Grounding, Spanking, Time-Outs, and revoking of privileges. Tragically, maybe the only form of abuse the children knew were beatings and torture.

Satch

I don't think it was the same girl who attempted to escape in Texas. I believe that time the escapee asked about getting a drivers license and an apartment, and the 17-year-old would have way too young at that point. As for the previous escape attempt that was hinted at in California, no further information was given. It was then that I believe the ropes turned to chains. Then again, maybe the MSM conflated or misstated the events, and it was the previous escape attempt. All I know is that they said that their had been a previous escape attempt from their current residence.

Things definitely haven't been right for a long time, if ever.

And their definition of "spanking" included beatings and chokings, and their definition of "groundings" included being locked in their rooms (or worse, closets, if the previous house is any indication), and their definition of "Time-outs" included restraints and shackles. It is certainly unclear how they came to the erroneous conclusion that such behavior or corrective practices were in any way proper. HINT: they aren't.

 

[rsd1200]

They wont sell many of those now!

Maybe in Cali and TX but I could guarantee that most around here couldn't tell you what they had on in those videos.

 

[mtnlites]

Maybe in Cali and TX but I could guarantee that most around here couldn't tell you what they had on in those videos.

Ha ha, that's true. And actually, there are quite a lot of people around here who haven't heard about the crime.