Recovered/Located CA - Cecil Knutson (dec'd), Dianna Bedwell (inj'd), Valley Ctr, 10 May 2015

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:welcome:​

Thank you very much for pitching in! You made my morning as I was wishing for you! It's great to have a local eyes willing to consider possibilities. The spaghetti you throw against to wall has a better chance of sticking.

Thank you so much for pitching in. We'll get your suggestions on the map. If I may impose on you when you have a minute, I've found as I often am too stubborn to use GIS devices and prefer maps which aren't always on hand, I try to figure it out. So, sometimes I end up in places that are dead ends, or tricky to get out of. Would you happen to know of easily mistaken turn-offs that may have lead them to a dangerous edgy spots. Then assuming they drove at least fifteen minutes out, what roads would put them in cell signal dead zones within fifteen minutes on which they would not have made it on long enough to not ping again? I realize these are kind of dumb to ask but I'm trying to whittle down to some possibilities, especially with locals who may know what it will take to find them.

updated 4 min ago
https://www.facebook.com/MissingPaulandDianna/posts/986935044663881

"There are a lot of speculations on them winning a large Jackpot.... They lost 50 dollars"

Yes here is some insight.

First there are many places that could be turned down and reach a dead end, but most of them are not cliffs or areas that you would fall into. Valley Center is pretty flat. It's not until you head out of town that you have to use a grade to get down.
Now to dismiss one place right now. In the YouTube video "sand crab news" or whatever it was called. They were suggesting The Turner Lake area where that gate is to access Cougar Pass. Yes that road is a curvy hill, but there is no way they could get in there at all.
It is a locked gate, that is locked at all times by the owner. It used to be an open road short cut to Hidden Meadows, but people kept using it for dumping so the owner shut it down, only he can open it and he make sure it's always locked. So the YouTube video, out the window.

Next unlikely place. The main grade out of Valley Center, into Escondido. It would be Valley Center Road to Escondido on the Map. That road has Guard rails all the way down, not to mention a barrier wall that runs down the middle to divide the up n down lanes. Very hard to go over on that road unless it was at the bottom where the wall ends, but then it's not so steep there anymore. So I'd discount that.

So I've been trying to analyze this all out. Since the Cell Ping came from Deer Springs 15 mins after they left, but they were seen at a gift shop in Rincon after they left
so this part does not add up, since there is no way to get from Rincon to Deer Springs in 15 mins. So my theory on the Ping is it ping long distance. Like maybe they were near the tower.
This places it as Old Castle Road grade as a possibility. It's very steep and Deer Springs is straight shot over the mountain. Cell service is also spotty there so it may have drawn off the ping.

Next possible route. Lake Wholford itself. We would have to ignore the ping. But Lake Wholford into Escondido it a very treacherous road. Very deep drops. A Few bodies have been dropped off the side over the years. Gang related and other crazy stuff. Cell service is spotty in this area.

Next possible is totally ignoring the Ping but making more sense in the direction they were in. It's possible they pinged off deer springs from the casino area itself if there were no other towers of their phone service.

They were last seen in Rincon at a gift shop. From there is 2 more routes of interest.
If they took 76 to the left and decided to take to local short cut, which is a fast run to Temecula which would get them farther north and onto the freeway or onto 79 to go the back way. This would be Pala Temecula road. Windy, curvy it's a grade with lots of trees in the middle of it. If something went down there. It would be tough to see. This is the road Amber Dubois was found off.

Final Route. Eat on 76 from Rincon. This is "the other back way".
Most people go to Temecula and take 79 to the Coachella area. But most people in Valley Center take 76 out past lake henshaw. It's a shortcut into the desert valley towns and on this route, there is a lot of bad cell service.

Between the La Jolla Indian Reservation and Lake Henshaw, there is no Cell Phone service at all, totally dead. Maybe for 20 minutes of driving.
There is then another area like that once you get out of Anza and start going down the grade of stone mountains by Berrego Springs.

Hope this gives people a better idea.
 
wow, Myekah - thank YOU so very much for your long post (your second here, and very helpful and insightful indeed!
 
Interesting that they were last seen at a gift ship.
Weren't they going to be late then to arrive at the son's house due to stopping at a gift shop?
Stopping at a gift shop sounds to me like they were doing their own thing that day, and perhaps not pressed
for time to get to the son's house at 4pm?
Is there a link specifying them being seen at a gift shop, or is this a "rumor"?
IMOO.
 
Yes here is some insight.

First there are many places that could be turned down and reach a dead end, but most of them are not cliffs or areas that you would fall into. Valley Center is pretty flat. It's not until you head out of town that you have to use a grade to get down.
Now to dismiss one place right now. In the YouTube video "sand crab news" or whatever it was called. They were suggesting The Turner Lake area where that gate is to access Cougar Pass. Yes that road is a curvy hill, but there is no way they could get in there at all.
It is a locked gate, that is locked at all times by the owner. It used to be an open road short cut to Hidden Meadows, but people kept using it for dumping so the owner shut it down, only he can open it and he make sure it's always locked. So the YouTube video, out the window.

Next unlikely place. The main grade out of Valley Center, into Escondido. It would be Valley Center Road to Escondido on the Map. That road has Guard rails all the way down, not to mention a barrier wall that runs down the middle to divide the up n down lanes. Very hard to go over on that road unless it was at the bottom where the wall ends, but then it's not so steep there anymore. So I'd discount that.

So I've been trying to analyze this all out. Since the Cell Ping came from Deer Springs 15 mins after they left, but they were seen at a gift shop in Rincon after they left
so this part does not add up, since there is no way to get from Rincon to Deer Springs in 15 mins. So my theory on the Ping is it ping long distance. Like maybe they were near the tower.
This places it as Old Castle Road grade as a possibility. It's very steep and Deer Springs is straight shot over the mountain. Cell service is also spotty there so it may have drawn off the ping.

Next possible route. Lake Wholford itself. We would have to ignore the ping. But Lake Wholford into Escondido it a very treacherous road. Very deep drops. A Few bodies have been dropped off the side over the years. Gang related and other crazy stuff. Cell service is spotty in this area.

Next possible is totally ignoring the Ping but making more sense in the direction they were in. It's possible they pinged off deer springs from the casino area itself if there were no other towers of their phone service.

They were last seen in Rincon at a gift shop. From there is 2 more routes of interest.
If they took 76 to the left and decided to take to local short cut, which is a fast run to Temecula which would get them farther north and onto the freeway or onto 79 to go the back way. This would be Pala Temecula road. Windy, curvy it's a grade with lots of trees in the middle of it. If something went down there. It would be tough to see. This is the road Amber Dubois was found off.

Final Route. Eat on 76 from Rincon. This is "the other back way".
Most people go to Temecula and take 79 to the Coachella area. But most people in Valley Center take 76 out past lake henshaw. It's a shortcut into the desert valley towns and on this route, there is a lot of bad cell service.

Between the La Jolla Indian Reservation and Lake Henshaw, there is no Cell Phone service at all, totally dead. Maybe for 20 minutes of driving.
There is then another area like that once you get out of Anza and start going down the grade of stone mountains by Berrego Springs.

Hope this gives people a better idea.

Thank you. I'd like to welcome you a couple of more times. The map should reflect your thorough information and consideration. You've been a great help.

:welcome:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~:welcome:~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~:welcome:​
 
Where is it stated they were in Rincon?
 
Interesting that they were last seen at a gift ship.
Weren't they going to be late then to arrive at the son's house due to stopping at a gift shop?
Stopping at a gift shop sounds to me like they were doing their own thing that day, and perhaps not pressed
for time to get to the son's house at 4pm?
Is there a link specifying them being seen at a gift shop, or is this a "rumor"?
IMOO.

I searched and didn't find anywhere that said they stopped at a gift shop in Rincon. Perhaps it was said in a video?

Something seems really odd, 4:00pm for a barbecue that you are already 3 or so hours away from home, after spending all day travelling and hitting the casino seems rather full.

If the roads are treacherous, winding with cliffs, why would two elderly people even think to drive back that night? Maybe the son "forgot" to tell us they were planning on spending the night or a hotel room was secured for them after the barbecue? If it were my parents, I would NEVER let them drive back home after a long day like that, even if the road was flat and straight! In fact, my parents insist that any functions we plan that they end by 4:00 so they can be home before nightfall, otherwise, someone has to pick them up and drop them back home at night.
 
Valley View Casino is famous for it's seafood buffet.
In case you were wondering.

Which would have been a perfect place to celebrate Mothers Day, instead of having elderly parents drive another 2 or 3 hours from the casino to their son's home for a very late in the afternoon, on a Sunday, barbecue. MOO!
 
I searched and didn't find anywhere that said they stopped at a gift shop in Rincon. Perhaps it was said in a video?

Something seems really odd, 4:00pm for a barbecue that you are already 3 or so hours away from home, after spending all day travelling and hitting the casino seems rather full.

If the roads are treacherous, winding with cliffs, why would two elderly people even think to drive back that night? Maybe the son "forgot" to tell us they were planning on spending the night or a hotel room was secured for them after the barbecue? If it were my parents, I would NEVER let them drive back home after a long day like that, even if the road was flat and straight! In fact, my parents insist that any functions we plan that they end by 4:00 so they can be home before nightfall, otherwise, someone has to pick them up and drop them back home at night.

Their neighbors in an early MSM interview described them as more active than the impression left by the reports of their going missing. The children or Knutson's themselves, it seems didn't think anything unusual of their scheduling, and seem to have thought it normal. They were said to be two hours away which would make sense that they left at 2 pm for a 4 o'clock gathering.
 
The son thought they might have a medical condition because of seeing them on video at the casino.
If they weren't feeling well, would they stop at a gift shop after leaving the casino?
If there is proof they stopped at a gift shop, are there videos of them leaving the gift shop, leaving the parking lot?
Why would Dianna's phone be turned off soon after leaving the casino? Wouldn't she want the phone on?
So, the phone was shut off, then they went to a gift shop??
IMOO.
 
LE said that or their son?

When I used the word Might, I was referring to the son saying that it was a clue because they turned right, towards Harrah's rincon.
IMOO.

ETA:
I haven't seen anything in MSM about them being at a gift shop.
IMOO.
 
So they left Valley Center Casino, shut off their phones, then stopped at a gift shop in Rincon?

Is the dessert still in the car from this morning? What purpose would they stop at the gift shop, would that be Harrahs? I know they mentioned potty breaks, but stopping at a gift shop makes no sense - gas station, fast food spot, bakery - now that makes sense. For what purpose would they need to stop at a gift shop? They knew they had to be at the barbecue at 4:00pm, it's a 2 hour drive from Valley Center to their son's, and no phone call, not even to ask someone to use THEIR phone or use a pay phone to say, hey, we stopped and we'll be late.
 
So they left Valley Center Casino, shut off their phones, then stopped at a gift shop in Rincon?

Is the dessert still in the car from this morning? What purpose would they stop at the gift shop, would that be Harrahs? I know they mentioned potty breaks, but stopping at a gift shop makes no sense - gas station, fast food spot, bakery - now that makes sense. For what purpose would they need to stop at a gift shop? They knew they had to be at the barbecue at 4:00pm, it's a 2 hour drive from Valley Center to their son's, and no phone call, not even to ask someone to use THEIR phone or use a pay phone to say, hey, we stopped and we'll be late.

Good Post!
IMOO.
 
Is the gift shop then, supposed to be a part of the parallel investigation that isn't supposed to be released, if they were seen at the gift shop?
That's why I asked if this was rumor, because I haven't seen it in MSM.
It could be true, but I haven't seen anything about a gift shop in MSM to link to.
IMOO.
 
So they left Valley Center Casino, shut off their phones, then stopped at a gift shop in Rincon?

Is the dessert still in the car from this morning? What purpose would they stop at the gift shop, would that be Harrahs? I know they mentioned potty breaks, but stopping at a gift shop makes no sense - gas station, fast food spot, bakery - now that makes sense. For what purpose would they need to stop at a gift shop? They knew they had to be at the barbecue at 4:00pm, it's a 2 hour drive from Valley Center to their son's, and no phone call, not even to ask someone to use THEIR phone or use a pay phone to say, hey, we stopped and we'll be late.

The quickest check out line is usually at a gift shop in place like that. There would doubtless be video?

Thank you JerseyGirl, more good questions... as well as better direction.
 
Wish I knew the name of the supposed "gift shop" they may, or may not have stopped at. When I think of the term gift shop, I think of a hotel. Period. Did they stop at another hotel after leaving Valley View? Pala maybe? Maybe it was a medical (although minor) issue at that point and they needed to pick up a quick Tylenol, Immodium etc......
Or, was it a gift shop that was completely separate from a hotel/casino? Maybe a last minute stop for a card or gift for the son's wife for Mother's Day?
Totally just throwing out ideas.....I'm not local, about 1-2hrs north, but have been down there plenty and I just don't see them even needing to take any dangerous route to the son's home.
Very sad...
 
Where is it stated they were in Rincon?

I was told by the Lady who runs the Facebook Search page that they were seen in a gift shop in Rincon after leaving the casino, but they were only there 5 mins.
 

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