Recovered/Located CA - Cecil Knutson (dec'd), Dianna Bedwell (inj'd), Valley Ctr, 10 May 2015

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I have to run to the hospital for a bit shortly so this will have to be short.

Yes, yesterday I wrote quite a bit about why I thought they could go to Deer Springs instead.

Frankly I don't really see it as THAT out of the way, and I absolutely (and very strongly) think it's far, far, far more likely they did NOT intend to go the back way to La Quinta (again, no restroom stops possible for Dianna as has been said she needed, more desolate, a "harder" drive, etc)

I think it's far more likely they were going to take the major route - which really is NOT much longer because you can drive at freeway speeds, don't have the frequent issue of getting stuck behind a slow car on the winding one lane road, etc. - and were going to take 15 to 215 to 60 to 10 - especially since THOSE are the roads they'd know more from driving out their normally from home!

As far as pinging at Deer Springs instead of going north to Gopher Canyon, like I wrote in GREAT DETAIL yesterday, I am quite sure that much of coming down Lilac / Old Castle that you could ping the Deer Springs tower - and so if they went off the road coming down, that wouldn't surprise me.

There are other reasons Deer Springs wouldn't surprise me - YES it's 4.2 miles from the Old Castle Road they could have taken down from Valley View vs. .2 to Gopher Canyon - but there are many reasons they could have done that that I don't see as odd, especially since you can drive quite quickly on Champagne Blvd, so speed wise it wouldn't be very low and it's really only like 4 minutes from Old Castle to the Deer Springs entrance, it's not like a 10 mile detour that I think some are seeing it as.

Things like taking a different turn coming down from Valley Center Road (assuming they actually went left instead at the intersection where the white cars went right) is a very easy one, especially since there are SO many options from up at the top of the hill over to the freeway.

Deer Springs is also more of a "main" entrance/exit to 15 than Gopher Canyon is, in that it's the more main route to go to things like the Lawrence Welk Resort and other attractions over on that side of the freeway.

It's also got "services" at that exit, which many others don't on the ones immediately north of it.

That can be a HUGE thing and absolutely make it a more memorable exit than something else would be. And when you've got a couple who already spent 2+ hours in the car driving there, and then had another 2+ hour drive to the desert (with a lot of that also having stretches with minimal services) they might have known that was an easy gas option from passing it.

Like I said, many of the few options further north end up with huge delays getting off the freeway (the one at the south end of Temecula, and absolutely if you wait until you're nearer to Temecula proper, etc.) and without a doubt I'd stop at that Arco / AM/PM at Deer Springs if I needed gas or even a bathroom break.

More on Champagne in another post revisiting my highlights from when I wrote (and included pictures) about the specifics of the terrain and what they'd pass briefly before I go to the hospital, then I'm out of here for now.

Speaking of missing persons, TravelingBug started this thread and was heavily involved in it up until a few days ago when he said something about going to the doctor. He was posting google shots of numerous intersections and other information. I remember the above post because he appeared to be annoyed at my questions since he had already explained things in a previous post. (which is totally understandable).

Has he been heard from since ?? Do we need to organize a search team to go find him ? Do we need to deploy a Websleuths chopper to do a fly-over ?
 
Thanks Forager. I just "drove" from the Valley View Casino to Escondido on Lake Wohlford Road using Google Street View and I found the route to be a normal two lane road with some K-Rail, Guard Rail, and unprotected road sides. The landscape is primarily Southern California Chaparral. Hard to imagine an accident in this area going unnoticed. It seems that the few areas where an off road car might go un-noticed would be easy to scope out on foot or horse back. The entire route is only 12 miles. The shortest route from the Valley View Casino to La Quinta is 94 miles.

Where I live, many roads are too small for a full sized bus and there are densely wooded areas adjacent to the road that make accidents difficult to spot.

I've now highlighted the route you show on the Knutson & Bedwell map as "Casino to Escondido Medical Route". (Of course the payout in bragging rights for merely pointing the route isn't as rich as it would be if your were declaring a particular stretch of road as an area you "like" for the presumed accident. ;) )

The Knutson & Bedwell map:
https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=z_XRj_yu3Dto.khuzU1KdCXHY
 
Thanks Forager. I just "drove" from the Valley View Casino to Escondido on Lake Wohlford Road using Google Street View and I found the route to be a normal two lane road with some K-Rail, Guard Rail, and unprotected road sides. The landscape is primarily Southern California Chaparral. Hard to imagine an accident in this area going unnoticed. It seems that the few areas where an off road car might go un-noticed would be easy to scope out on foot or horse back. The entire route is only 12 miles. The shortest route from the Valley View Casino to La Quinta is 94 miles.

Where I live, many roads are too small for a full sized bus and there are densely wooded areas adjacent to the road that make accidents difficult to spot.

Lake Wholford is mostly level until the last 2 miles before escondido. It won't show on street view. I really don't like driving Wholford even as a local. I only drive it if the main grade is shut down because of an accident.
It's a steep drop off the side in spots for a while.
 
Google "car over embankment", and it will give you a sense of how common (and tragic) this occurrence is. You can even see articles talking about how difficult it was to find the cars because in some cases they were caught by, and hidden in trees.
 
Google "car over embankment", and it will give you a sense of how common (and tragic) this occurrence is. You can even see articles talking about how difficult it was to find the cars because in some cases they were caught by, and hidden in trees.

Sadly, I can attest to this. I witnessed a terrible car accident years ago, a vw jetta had been clipped by a semi on a straight stretch of highway. The vw was sent high up into the trees along the side, crashing down 50+ feet from the road, pretty much obscured from view by trees. There were no skid marks or obvious signs visible. If we hadn't seen the crash happen, I think they could have been undiscovered for quite some time.
 
Thank you for the local's view. What is the landscape like in these last two miles? Is there a guard rail these last two miles? Are there shrubs or trees that would conceal a white sedan? Google street view is about one year old so not up to date.

This case reminds me of a local couple who "went missing" on an afternoon drive to the coast. Their route was known and the search was exhaustive. The searchers could not find their car. Later, their car was found submerged in a reservoir. The section of road where their accident occurred was flat and not challenging. There was no guard rail. Suspected cause of the accident was a medical emergency.

Lake Wholford is mostly level until the last 2 miles before escondido. It won't show on street view. I really don't like driving Wholford even as a local. I only drive it if the main grade is shut down because of an accident.
It's a steep drop off the side in spots for a while.
 
Thank you for the local's view. What is the landscape like in these last two miles? Is there a guard rail these last two miles? Are there shrubs or trees that would conceal a white sedan? Google street view is about one year old so not up to date.

This case reminds me of a local couple who "went missing" on an afternoon drive to the coast. Their route was known and the search was exhaustive. The searchers could not find their car. Later, their car was found submerged in a reservoir. The section of road where their accident occurred was flat and not challenging. There was no guard rail. Suspected cause of the accident was a medical emergency.

There are not many bodies of water on any of the routes, but WS has quite a few cases where the people and their car come up missing, and they are subsequently found in a pond, river, estuary, etc. When people disappear with their car, I always think, "Check the water first."

A recent case in Texas in which a woman went missing on her early-morning way into work was solved when she and her car were found in a pond, with very little evidence where she went off the road and through a fence. People drove that road often, even searchers, and it just was not evident an accident had happened in that location. And sorry, I don't recall how she was finally found. I'll try to remember her name and link her thread.

I, too, think an accident occurred with this couple, but the cell phone question nags at me a bit.
 
Just a little reminder that we don't speculate, sleuth or try to out other WSers.
 
Thank you for the local's view. What is the landscape like in these last two miles? Is there a guard rail these last two miles? Are there shrubs or trees that would conceal a white sedan? Google street view is about one year old so not up to date.

This case reminds me of a local couple who "went missing" on an afternoon drive to the coast. Their route was known and the search was exhaustive. The searchers could not find their car. Later, their car was found submerged in a reservoir. The section of road where their accident occurred was flat and not challenging. There was no guard rail. Suspected cause of the accident was a medical emergency.

The last 2 miles go down a steep grade. On the side going down which is the side they would drive it drops into a canyon. There are lots of trees at the start of the deep part., there are spotty guard rails but plenty of "holes".
There have been 2 cars found down there from just what I know.
One was a guy who was kidnapped n killed in Escondido by gangs and him n his car was dropped down. It was found by electric workers months later and it took a crane to get the car up from where it was.
The second was someone else who drove off and was found after a while by hikers. I'll see if I can find the articles anywhere. It's been a while.

As for water. Yes Lake Wholfors is right there. But it's pretty dried up. Level to the road and I don't think there is really any area to get near it with a car.
The road is far away from it till you get near the diner and there are parking lots and such that you have to drive down to. I don't see a car ending up in that lake.

I actually found the article of the guy who was killed. I guess his car was found in San Pasqual, and his body found 100ft in the ravine, but San Pasqual is where Valley View is.
But there was a story where a car had to be hoisted up from there with a crane. I'll keep looking for that. Here is the article about the guy though.
http://m.utsandiego.com/news/2006/oct/13/body-found-in-ravine-that-of-missing-escondido-man/
 
My understanding is that the cell phone is pinging with an antenna which might be located on a cell tower or another structure. I remember "antenna radiation" maps being available on the web but I am no longer able to find them. It was a way to check if a location was served by an antenna or was in the "shadow" of a hill or other structure. The range of an antenna is effected by the height of the antenna and the strength of the signal.

Oregon uses "cell phone pings" as locators all the time. I don't know about other areas.

Cell Phone pings used as locators in Oregon:

http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2014/08/02/how-tech-tracks-missing-people/

http://www.newson6.com/story/765015...p-in-search-in-oregon-for-2nd-time-in-2-weeks

http://newstalk870.am/kennewick-pol...0-year-old-man-just-in-time-for-thanksgiving/
 
Sister is asking for donations, talking about costs for medical care and now a broken water pump at her home.

To pay for these, she cannot save $ to send brother out to search.
 
Not sure what you mean?

The admin is asking for money because her water pump went out. It is probably because it will make it harder to for her to go to Cali if she needs to. I think I am in a grumbly funk and am being nit picky...sorry!
 
The admin is asking for money because her water pump went out. It is probably because it will make it harder to for her to go to Cali if she needs to. I think I am in a grumbly funk and am being nit picky...sorry!

Anything from where things stand on with Team Amber or other search efforts, official or otherwise?
 
The admin is asking for money because her water pump went out. It is probably because it will make it harder to for her to go to Cali if she needs to. I think I am in a grumbly funk and am being nit picky...sorry!

Uhm, that is a bit odd. But then again I tend to be a skeptic when it comes to people asking for money. You can always sell something, etc.
 
tacky IMO but I have no idea how I'd be in this situation... whatever it turns out to be...
 
I think they went over a cliff somewhere. :cry:
 

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